Stihl Bar Question

[bower4311]

I'm not sure how the prices are form Stihl, but at my local dealer I asked about an ES bar, (18") compared to the E bar on the wall. I think it was only around $5 more. Stihl's "E" laminate bars are WAY overpriced (if my dealer didn't have them marked way up). If that is a Stihl issue, not my local dealers, I wouldn't sell an E bar over an equivalent ES bar if the user had to pay $5 more. E bars aren't terrible, but for a few bucks you get a professional bar with a removable sprocket tip? No brainer.

 

[husky01]

here in nz I travel an hour to get to my local Stihl, they are only interested in selling you a brand new saw and aren't interested in selling you a spare part. They won't sell me a full chisel chain as it is for "Loggers"
Over the road is the Husky dealer, he has been a mechanic for 30+ years, what ever he doesn't know he will find out, really goes out of his way and is a top notch mechanic, He has had me around to his house to teach me how to split a crankcase, clean a carb, and just teach things I need to know

 

[MustangMike]

I mean this on the best way. You owe it to your customers to learn all you can about Stihl products you sell. The vast majority of my customers are homeowners, but I spend a ton of time reading and researching about all the products I could offer from Stihl. Think of how much better your conversation with that customer would have went if you had the knowledge.


Sent from my iPhone on tapatalk

Doug, I hope you don't mind me stealing some knowledge from you but on both my 044 and 362 I like to run the yellow RS chain, but my bar is "green". Would a yellow bar make much difference? I think the green bar is slightly fatter in the middle (instead of two flat surfaces), is that correct?

Thanks in advance.
MustangMike

 

[AKDoug]

Doug, I hope you don't mind me stealing some knowledge from you but on both my 044 and 362 I like to run the yellow RS chain, but my bar is "green". Would a yellow bar make much difference? I think the green bar is slightly fatter in the middle (instead of two flat surfaces), is that correct?

Thanks in advance.
MustangMike

Mike- I'd actually have to lay them side by side to answer fatter question. (see, I don't know everything ) The biggest difference between an Rollomatic E standard and the yellow dot Rollomatic E super bars is that the E standard is a 3 layered laminated bar with some portions in the middle hollowed out and no replaceable tip. The E Super bar is a solid bar with a replaceable tip. Running a green dot chain on a green dot bar meets the ANSI standards for low kickback. A yellow chain on a green dot bar is fine, but it is not low kickback. BTW..to add more confusion, there are certain Rollomatic E Super bars that are green dot, but not very many.

Like anything else, individual use will determine longevity of any part of a chainsaw. In my area, guys get plenty of life out of E standard bar when falling and bucking clean wood with saws from 362's and smaller. If you are working in tough conditions, the solid bar with a replaceable tip might be the best value. I sell, by far, more E Super bars, than E standard bars. I stock both.

 

[MustangMike]

Thanks for the reply, I do appreciate it. I'm not worried about low kickback. I believe the best way to reduce kickback is to keep your chain sharp, pay attention to what you are doing, and maintain control of your saw.

Hey, I'm really impressed how strong my 362 C-M got after about 6 tanks of fuel. I can only imagine how strong a 441 C-M is. My friend has one, and he is going to let me play with it after my busy tax season (he is currently dealing with some medical issues). That muffler screen on the 362 is so dense that removing it is like making the outlet hole twice as big.

By the way, your State is on my bucket list. But it is almost like what I used to tell people about the mid-west "I would love to visit there, but I'm afraid I won't come back".

MustangMike

 

[AKDoug]

You should come visit. We're 10 degrees warmer than you now I should be seeing my first 362C-M tomorrow. Not sure if I'm going to keep it or put it in stock.

 

[cobey]

Mike- I'd actually have to lay them side by side to answer fatter question. (see, I don't know everything ) The biggest difference between an Rollomatic E standard and the yellow dot Rollomatic E super bars is that the E standard is a 3 layered laminated bar with some portions in the middle hollowed out and no replaceable tip. The E Super bar is a solid bar with a replaceable tip. Running a green dot chain on a green dot bar meets the ANSI standards for low kickback. A yellow chain on a green dot bar is fine, but it is not low kickback. BTW..to add more confusion, there are certain Rollomatic E Super bars that are green dot, but not very many.

Like anything else, individual use will determine longevity of any part of a chainsaw. In my area, guys get plenty of life out of E standard bar when falling and bucking clean wood with saws from 362's and smaller. If you are working in tough conditions, the solid bar with a replaceable tip might be the best value. I sell, by far, more E Super bars, than E standard bars. I stock both.

does the green bar have a smaller nose radious to make the bumpers on the safety more effective?

 

[AKDoug]

The E standard and E super bars have a very similar sized tip. I'll have to look when I'm in the shop tomorrow. Maybe some pictures will be in order. There is also a E super bar available with a wider radius nose.

 

[MustangMike]

I could be wrong, but I think the green bars are fatter in the middle, so the top and bottom cutting surfaces are not flat. It may also reduce the nose diameter, I'm not sure. But I don't think it hurts the cutting speed at all. Would love to see the pictures though. If it doesn't hurt the cutting speed, I have no problem with using it.

 

[SawTroll]

I could be wrong, but I think the green bars are fatter in the middle, so the top and bottom cutting surfaces are not flat. It may also reduce the nose diameter, I'm not sure. But I don't think it hurts the cutting speed at all. Would love to see the pictures though. If it doesn't hurt the cutting speed, I have no problem with using it.

Often it is about a 10t vs. an 11t (or even 13t in some cases) nose.

It is the smaller nose diameter that makes the bars "green".

 

[MustangMike]

Thanks for that SawTroll. If the bars taper toward the front, that would make sense. I don't think the green bars slow your cutting at all, your opinion?

 

[SawTroll]

Thanks for that SawTroll. If the bars taper toward the front, that would make sense. I don't think the green bars slow your cutting at all, your opinion?

It will if you are bore cutting, but not at all when cross cutting.

 

[MustangMike]

I almost never bore cut, so thanks for the answer, it is the right bar for me. I like safety as long as it does not cost me performance.

 

[AKDoug]

According to info I recieved from Stihl, there are cases where the green bar used in conjunction with yellow chains will have the potential for a higher kick back risk than just a straight yellow setup. I'm not sure if it's true, or just a scare tactic to keep me from selling yellow chains to folks with green bars.

Anyhow, here are the pics I promised. The E standard bar does in fact have a smaller tip than the E super. It also is narrower in places, but both have the same width at the widest point. There is a little difference in the tail section too. All in all, I don't think it adds up to anything in real world applications. In my store, the E Standard is $12 cheaper than an E Super. I don't stock the wide nosed bars as there is no requests for them in my part of the world.

E standard on top of E super in the two pics where they are stacked on top of one another:

 

[MustangMike]

Thanks for those pics, looks like SawTroll was correct. The other biggest difference is the Yellow is made in Germany and the Green in the USA.

FYI, I have run yellow RS on green bars for years and have never had a problem with kick back. IMO, excessive kick back is usually caused by a dull chain. It would also make sense that the smaller the tip, the less kick back you will have. Just take a look at how they design those carving bars. That's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it.

 

[MustangMike]

Is it my imagination, or is the oiling hole in the Green Bar a little bigger than the oiling hole in the Yellow Bar? Or is it just the camera angle or something.

 

[AKDoug]

Oiler hole on the yellow bar is angled. It's supposed to oil better. I guess that's another plus for the ESuper bar.

 

[treesmith]

I too was under the impression that yellow chain on a green bar makes the saw more liable to kickback and the low kick green chain is semi chisel and the standard yellow chain is full chisel. That's what my dealer told me IIRC

Sent from my GT-I9100

 

[nomad_archer]

You didnt get good info treesmith. I have semi chisel yellow chain. The difference is the yellow chain you only have rakers and the green chain has rakers plus a bumper with each cutter. Pictures would really help this explanation.

 

[KenJax Tree]

RM is the best semi-chisel out there IMO


Sent from my Autotune Carb