Surface roots a lawnmowing problem

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Sheshovel

Any chance of providing a link to that webpage you got that info from? :)

Some species are extremely prone to surface roots. Around here some varieties are Ficus, Tipuana, LillyPilly, Umbrella trees, Chinese Elm, and a few others I cannot remember at this stage. They're a shocker for urban homes.
 
I don't know how to put a link up,I did a search on air in the soil and picked one.There is a name at the bottom of the pg though.I will try to find you more scientifically proving info to substantiate my position
 
Sheshovel said:
The BEST solution is to select the CORRECT / PROPER Trees and plants for that location


Although he usually means well, and seems to have much education, this is a point still lost on Guy.
-Ralph
 
Hey, you dont have to preach to me I know what the go is with this stuff.

Hey, check out the roots on these mongrels, you reckon you'd bother with these in a home yard ... well people do and we "slay' em".

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OK heres some info from the University of Nebraska
Cooprerative Extention
Most trees are adapted to stable conditions in forests, where soil disturbance rarely occurs. In a garden, repeated disturbance of soil under trees can damage roots and reduce overall tree vigor. Activities which cause extensive damage to tree roots include: 1) rototilling under the tree canopy; 2) tearing away tree roots to make planting room for annuals; 3) adding soil to create planting spots or raised flower beds; and 4) cutting trenches 6 or more inches deep to install edging materials or to create a natural edge. These practices cut a tree's fine feeder roots which are responsible for water and nutrient uptake. Planting annuals like impatiens or begonias every year damages tree roots. In their place, use perennials or groundcovers which do not have to be planted each year. You can minimize root damage by using smaller seedlings. Smaller plants will take longer to fill in, but will preserve tree health. Not growing any plants beneath trees and simply mulching the area is another alternative. These techniques will cause less disruption to tree roots.

The Problem of Above-Ground Roots :blob5:
Like a tree's trunk or branches, tree roots grow in girth over time. A root that was once well below the soil surface can increase in circumference and appear above the soil line. Also, tree roots that are growing over a dense, compacted soil layer may eventually emerge above the soil. If turfgrass is in this area, care must be taken not to scalp tree roots with the lawnmower. Removing even one large root can cause the loss of 5 to 20 percent of the tree root system. Cutting tree roots reduces the ability of the tree to take up water and nutrients and affects the stability of the tree during high winds and ice/snow storms. Adding soil to rebury the root is not a long-term solution. Shallow roots will eventually resurface and deeper roots can be deprived of oxygen. A better alternative is to plant perennials or groundcovers, or mulch with a 2 to 4 inch layer of wood chips (or other organic mulch). This eliminates the need to mow, reduces tree root and trunk damage and allows roots to obtain needed oxygen, while hiding the shallow roots.

Dealing With Grade Changes

Adding or removing even a few inches of soil within the PRZ can kill a mature tree. Raising the elevation puts surface feeder roots further away from moisture and oxygen sources. Lowering the elevation removes vital roots and nutrient-rich topsoil. Decay organisms can move into the severed ends of remaining roots. Dead and dying roots lead to branch dieback, a greater susceptibility to insect and disease problems, and decline and possible death to the tree. Building retaining walls outside the PRZ can create desirable grade changes around trees, yet keep soil depth at existing levels (Figure 3).
:blob5:

Figure 3.
tive Extention # G021452A
 
beglytree,
Did I say that? In this thread??It's true but won't help what has already been planted,in this case anyway.Thanks though.
I kinda love a good debate so treeseer and I are in the feeling out each other stage here.I am perfectly capable of backing up MOST of my statements,and though I am not certified and have had NO formal training in the botany of trees...I am self educated and not too stupid either.I do not know all that's for dang sure but my knowledge and expertise in Landscaping with trees has been gained by
having planted many,many,many of them and is from hands on knowledge in the field for quite a long time.

SOOOO treeseer...Dogma you say sir??? :)
Now what say you? HuuuMMMM? :p
 
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Ekka said:
He thinks he's always right too, so be careful around this town. :)

There's a few more too, you'll get to know them.

See, now you've started something. There was another who said they're never wrong also. Phew, sometimes you just gotta laugh.

Have a look at this mulching effort, it's actually across the road from my home, pretty good hey. :p

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Lot of good can be nongood, Ekka. In the thick mulch layer very different bacterias aerobic and anaerobic and funguses are growing, free oxygen will be consumed by them. IMO, the effect of such mulch can be even negative, as the normal breath of roots will be retarded.
 
I know this is bad, I was stirring. :cool:

I call them mulch volcanos.

The guy tidies them up all the time, makes a steeper mound up the trunks, he's a bit odd and doesn't communicate well, so I dont say anything.

He knows what I do but I'll wait till he asks one day ... if ever it happens. The funny part is they are all footpath trees so the council owns them.
 
So the volcaoes have spread to California too, yikes! I agree with mot of what is in those links, thanks for posting them. Adding soil AFTER aerating the eroded native earth is often a good thing; I don't see that proven wrong.

Ralph, the point of right plant/right place is not at all lost on me. What I do not understand is the unwillingness of tree service operators to make the place fit the plant, and instead recommend removal in what seems like a kneejerk fashion. Arborphobia about silver maples 100' from a house is just one example.

If most of your income is from removals, a bias is hard to avoid. 99% of mine is from tree care, so I am biased in that direction, and often must push my head away from that extreme to give the owner balanced advice. no one here is perfect.
 
guy, only about 25% of my biz is removals. As far as the silver maple thing goes, bad show old chap. My comments still hold true IF the tree was @ 30 feet from the house, as it looked. since the owner clarified the distance to 100 ft, I've not posted as my advice doesn't fit the situation anymore. The owner STILL has NOT clarified wether or not the cleared out area behind them was a building spot for new homes, or just open farmland.

treeseer said:
no one here is perfect
As long as you're willing to admit that now. In the past I've PMed you at the end of a discussion, basically alluding to that same premise, but every reply I ever got back was a continuation of the arguement. Hard to find common ground in that scenario....
-Ralph
 
UUUUHHHH treeseer you are not going to get away with that so easily sir.YOU advised a homeowner that soil AND mulch over surface roots totaling 6" deep would be OK.When I said this was bad advice you asked me to back it up..implying my brain was full of DOGMA info and that is all.I did as you requested and
NOW I would like you to say you were wrong ..
come right out and say it.... and tell the homeowner you were incorrect and that Mike and I were correct.Only in this manner will you ever get any respect for your knowlege.
It wont hurt that bad..admit and apologize,or admit and give the correct answer to the homeowners question.
I throw down the javelin
 
EKKA! Geeze you must have a strong will,there would be NOWAY I could sit across the street and watch that neighbor continue to do that to the citys trees!I would sneak over and undo those volcanoes every time he fixed them!!It would be fun and a challinging hobby anyway.
HA!HA!
IF your an Aussie then you have the personality to pull it off huh?
Sounds like fun stuff to me!
Sheshovel
 
Ralph & She, it seems I've rankled again, without meaning to. Sorry that happened. It's pretty hard to get down to nitty-gritty details online based on a pic or two and a tree owner's descriptions.

Re filling over an eroded rootzones, I've done it and seen it done for decades, with benefits to the tree if done right. Extension pubs are not that convincing a source; while researching articles I've perused many that say the exact same thing. It's evident that many of them are just parroting each other. Each time something is repeated it gets farther and farther from research and experience, and loses validity imo. Kinda like sitting in a circle around a campfire and whispering from person to person...

So I'm sorry but I cannot say you and Mike are right on this one. Remember, every tree and every site is different, so very few general taboos apply everywhere.
 
Coor blimey Sheshovel

You're right into that Treeseer guy. He's pretty smart and writes papers on stuff for organisations such as ISA.

But horses for courses.

What I've learnt is that blanket rules aren't always accurate. There are many species that differ in their tolerance to certain situations. Having said that I live in a semi tropical world and our trees plus climate do different things to say some-one who gets snow and ice.

So in essence what Treeseer is saying is that one shouldn't perhaps assume everything is 100% gospel at all times. Sure you are right, and in certain applications he is too.

Oh, by the way, that guy with the mulch volcano's he does my letterbox deliveries so I dont want to upset him. Fortunately most of the raked up stuff is light leaves and frankly the first few are tulip trees which if they dropped dead tomorrow I wouldn't care as they are really messy and fill my garage with crap when the wind blows.
 
Ekka said:
Fortunately most of the raked up stuff is light leaves and frankly the first few are tulip trees which if they dropped dead tomorrow I wouldn't care as they are really messy and fill my garage with crap when the wind blows.
This is really bad news :rolleyes:
 
pinus said:
This is really bad news :rolleyes:
So there's anti-arborphobic sarcasm coming from the Baltic state, along with arboricultural acumen! pinus, I think you are a twin across the pond; every post of yours I read sounds like it came out of my own head.

Ekka, i know of 3 species that are called "tuliptree". Which is it? O and to avoid upsetting your letter-carrier, perhaps you could re-mulch in the dead of night. Be a ninja volcano-buster! Just spray a little roundup on that grass first, and away you go! :cool:
 
treeseer said:
So there's anti-arborphobic sarcasm coming from the Baltic state, along with arboricultural acumen! pinus, I think you are a twin across the pond; every post of yours I read sounds like it came out of my own head.

My sarcasm is coming out because I think that arboritst should not hate tree(s), or at least should control such feelings :cry:
All we have the "darling" species and not so darling ones, but if we are not engineering in own garden we should keep our head "cold"
To remove tree or to cure it that is the question :angel:
 
treeseer said:
pinus, I think you are a twin across the pond; every post of yours I read sounds like it came out of my own head.
Two Guys? Now thats effin scary! :D

I don't think he sounds like you at all, Guy, Pinus seems to be more moderate, and more accepting of ideas other than his own.
-Ralph
 
begleytree said:
I don't think he sounds like you at all, Guy, Pinus seems to be more moderate,
You're right, Ralph, pinus is a better communicator, which is humbling considering that I don't know one word of Estonian. :cry:
 
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