Techniques For Cutting Hung Leaners?

[SteveSr]

Hello,

I am looking for some suggestions on the best practices for dealing with hung leaners such as the one shown in the photos. This one hanging over a hiking trail.

The situation is tricky as there is still significant tension/force from the root ball trying to stand the tree back up.

Thanks,
Steve

 

[irhunter]

I imagine, what you will get here is not a "best" approach...but, rather, a list of alternatives. The on-site realities and your cutting history will dictate which method to try first.

I would say, seems like a small tree to be having root-ball issues.

Another pic showing the other side of the leaner would help. Is it hung up by its own fork or by the branches of the second tree?

Roy

 

[PV Hiker]

Steve if the top is captured, locked in place, then you can leave it and someday a wind storm might bring it down. I leave trees all the time like this if they are safely attached at the crown.

As soon as you detach the tree from the base you're going to have to finish it.

Sometime I can cut the bottom and alow the butt end to be on the other side of the trail.

You can keep cutting the base and walk the tree down until it slides on it's own. Side cuts can move the butt left or right to help sliding.

Can also rig up a griphoist on the butt after detaching root ball and pull it down.

Best practice is a thorough exam to see how best to handle it in person and the experience comfort level of the Sawyers. Safety first, sometimes nature takes care of it eventually.

Patrick

 

[Tomos770]

Look up his channel....

 

[ZeroJunk]

I have a walnut tree like that over my hiking trail except at about a 45 . Still alive. Would sort of like the lumber.

But, I think I will just leave it alone.

 

[muddy42]

If small I undercut near the base and cut away sections until the tree falls. Sometimes this technique fails and the tree stays hitched or vertical, then I winch it away.

 

[SteveSr]

Look up his channel....

Great video link!

 

[SteveSr]

I would say, seems like a small tree to be having root-ball issues.

That is probably a 12-16" tree. Not small for this area.

Another pic showing the other side of the leaner would help. Is it hung up by its own fork or by the branches of the second tree?

Unfortunately I have not laid eyes on this tree. All I have are the photos therefore I don't know who is hanging who.

 

[SteveSr]

Steve if the top is captured, locked in place, then you can leave it and someday a wind storm might bring it down. I leave trees all the time like this if they are safely attached at the crown.

I don't know if the crown is well attached or not.

As soon as you detach the tree from the base you're going to have to finish it.

Correct. Getting to this point is my main concern as the tension near the base could create a barber chair hazard if the tree is not well hung and decides to come down.

Sometime I can cut the bottom and alow the butt end to be on the other side of the trail.

Not so lucky with this one.

You can keep cutting the base and walk the tree down until it slides on it's own. Side cuts can move the butt left or right to help sliding.

This works reasonably well until the tree gets almost vertical. Then you are working directly under a hazard that can literally go just about any direction.

Can also rig up a griphoist on the butt after detaching root ball and pull it down.

We have a griphoist but haven't had much luck with this as the weight of the tree digs the butt into the ground making it all but impossible to pull, even with a griphoist and a pulley.

I have had much better success using the griphoist (or rope puller) to reverse buck the trunk away from the hanger tree.

Best practice is a thorough exam to see how best to handle it in person and the experience comfort level of the Sawyers. Safety first, sometimes nature takes care of it eventually.

Patrick

In this case the tree is near a trail and a campsite so we would like to be proactive.

 

[madhatte]

Sounds dumb but if you can get close enough with a truck to give it a few jerks with a bull line, it'll probably break free and you won't have to be anywhere near it when it comes down.

 

[SteveSr]

Sounds dumb but if you can get close enough with a truck to give it a few jerks with a bull line, it'll probably break free and you won't have to be anywhere near it when it comes down.

Unfortunately, not an option. This is a hiking trail on Corps (federal) land.

 

[PV Hiker]

Steve agree with you comments. Once you get your eyes on it to see what is going on in the canopy, I think you can get a cutting plan.

I carry a throw rope that I can throw over mid length. It is long enough that I can double back to me. Standing away from the tree I can pull down to start a ocsonslation to get the top to bounce. Sometimes bouncing and pulling sideways I can get it to slide off and come down. Only works if the top is not captured securely. You do what you can and be creative when you hike 5 miles in.

 

[oldbuzzard]

Unfortunately, not an option. This is a hiking trail on Corps (federal) land.

First question that comes to mind is are you certified to cut on federal land and do you have permission? I live in Colorado and casually going out and dropping hazard trees on federal land would get you in trouble. I am a “B” qualified sawyer, with certification to saw on federal land, and the ranger district still probably wouldn’t give me permission to drop that tree.
Go on YouTube and watch a few videos on “walking”, also called “stepping” down leaners. It looks a little scary but it is actually pretty easy once you learn the simple techniques of doing them safely.

 

[SteveSr]

First question that comes to mind is are you certified to cut on federal land and do you have permission? I live in Colorado and casually going out and dropping hazard trees on federal land would get you in trouble. I am a “B” qualified sawyer, with certification to saw on federal land, and the ranger district still probably wouldn’t give me permission to drop that tree.
Go on YouTube and watch a few videos on “walking”, also called “stepping” down leaners. It looks a little scary but it is actually pretty easy once you learn the simple techniques of doing them safely.

Yes, I am "B-falling" certified. The district ranger gave us permission to remove that tree.

I didn't have much luck with videos. YT signal to noise ratio is pretty bad!

 

[dboyd351]

Steve
I agree with your assessment on walking down the tree. I did one yesterday that was hung up pretty bad and walking it down worked pretty well until it got almost vertical and then it got pretty hairy trying to work underneath it not knowing which way it was gonna go.
Worked out OK, but that last cut really made you pucker when the tree started moving around and you didn't know which way it was going to go.
ended up staying vertical and then we could put a rope on it a little way up and pull it over

 

[oldbuzzard]

Yes, I am "B-falling" certified. The district ranger gave us permission to remove that tree.

I didn't have much luck with videos. YT signal to noise ratio is pretty bad!

So, just throwing out alternatives that might work for you - cut the base free, borrow a cant from someone, and try rolling the tree out of the limb lock.
Another is cut the base free and borrow a Maasdam rope puller (or something like a come-a-long) to pull it down. Pulling it down is going to be your safest bet.
Don’t know if this is helpful or not but, when walking a tree down, I was taught to use one, straight through angle cut. Problem with that is, as you alluded to, you get a pointed end that drives straight in to the ground and then is hard or impossible to move. What I do is a perpendicular cut from the bottom first then a pie cut on top so I don’t have a pointed end. I think you can visualize that.

 

[SteveSr]

Steve
I agree with your assessment on walking down the tree. I did one yesterday that was hung up pretty bad and walking it down worked pretty well until it got almost vertical and then it got pretty hairy trying to work underneath it not knowing which way it was gonna go.
Worked out OK, but that last cut really made you pucker when the tree started moving around and you didn't know which way it was going to go.

I had a saw instructor/evaluator who accused me of falling tree wit a "pucker factor"... until he actually saw me cut. THen he offered me his fairly new MS440 to try out bucking.

ended up staying vertical and then we could put a rope on it a little way up and pull it over

This is where rigging can help immensely. You can use the rigging to force the trunk to go away from vertical. You are also no where near it when it drops down the 3-4 feet.

 

[SteveSr]

So, just throwing out alternatives that might work for you - cut the base free, borrow a cant from someone, and try rolling the tree out of the limb lock.

Ther is also a good alternative shown in the first referenced video to bore a square hole in the trunk and use a smaller limb in the hole to roll the tree.

Another is cut the base free and borrow a Maasdam rope puller (or something like a come-a-long) to pull it down. Pulling it down is going to be your safest bet.

Part of the hazard with this situation is in separating the stump from the trunk due to the tremendous tension in the trunk while it is still attached. Once the trunk is separated the problem gets MUCH easier.

Don’t know if this is helpful or not but, when walking a tree down, I was taught to use one, straight through angle cut. Problem with that is, as you alluded to, you get a pointed end that drives straight in to the ground and then is hard or impossible to move.

This is basically what our instructor taught. Cut a little on the top compression and then walk the bar around an come up from the bottom.

What I do is a perpendicular cut from the bottom first then a pie cut on top so I don’t have a pointed end. I think you can visualize that.

Yes.

 

[Leeroy]

Better know what you are doing, but this works on leaners too.

 

[dboyd351]

Looks like sliding trees works great where you have a 30 degree slope to assist you. Wouldn't go like that on flat ground