The best biner
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Tree Machine
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It's easy
The answer to that, is this....
The answer to that, is this....
Tree Machine
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heavy schmevvy
Personal safety and sense of utmost security allow me to do what I do, which is why I carry what weight I carry. That flipline eliminates the need for a delta, a quick-link or a biner at one end. It wraps around my waist exactly 2 times and clips to the opposite side of the saddle, resting around my belly, not my hips. This allows unencumbered access to all the other heavy things on my harness, other safety things like locking biners and slings. They all weigh something, and I don't care, as long as the items allow me to go anywhere in the tree.
I, personally have never, ever used a rope lanyard. Even when I was a newbie, I fabricated a cable lanyard. Crude, and non-adjustable, but if I touched it with a chainsaw, I was not going down. Then I moved up to the conventional wirecore flipline (snap on one end, thimbled eye on the other), then to the double-ended which I'm finding hard to improve upon.
If I had to work in the Florida heat, I would shave ounces, too, so I can see where you're coming from. I wouldn't, however, trade in my double-ended wirecore flipline and microcender. No way. -TM-
Personal safety and sense of utmost security allow me to do what I do, which is why I carry what weight I carry. That flipline eliminates the need for a delta, a quick-link or a biner at one end. It wraps around my waist exactly 2 times and clips to the opposite side of the saddle, resting around my belly, not my hips. This allows unencumbered access to all the other heavy things on my harness, other safety things like locking biners and slings. They all weigh something, and I don't care, as long as the items allow me to go anywhere in the tree.
I, personally have never, ever used a rope lanyard. Even when I was a newbie, I fabricated a cable lanyard. Crude, and non-adjustable, but if I touched it with a chainsaw, I was not going down. Then I moved up to the conventional wirecore flipline (snap on one end, thimbled eye on the other), then to the double-ended which I'm finding hard to improve upon.
If I had to work in the Florida heat, I would shave ounces, too, so I can see where you're coming from. I wouldn't, however, trade in my double-ended wirecore flipline and microcender. No way. -TM-
Burnham
ArboristSite Operative
Hey, Rocky J, I can go Tree Machine one better (or worse, as you'll see it 
)...I spur climb with TWO 18 foot 5/8 inch cable cored lanyards with steel snap hooks and Petzl macrojusters. And it is only long hike-in access that causes me to cut back to one cable core and one rope lanyard. You (or at least I) can't flip rope lanyards on big, rough barked trees worth a toot .
)...I spur climb with TWO 18 foot 5/8 inch cable cored lanyards with steel snap hooks and Petzl macrojusters. And it is only long hike-in access that causes me to cut back to one cable core and one rope lanyard. You (or at least I) can't flip rope lanyards on big, rough barked trees worth a toot .Kneejerk Bombas
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Like TM, I want to be secure.
Here is my lanyard and locking biner.
Here is my lanyard and locking biner.
MasterBlaster
TreeHouse Elder
I wish I would get to climb a tree so big around my 1/2 Super-Braid couldn't flip around it.
Burnham, are you talking about Beranek-sized trees? THAT would be super-cool!!
Burnham, are you talking about Beranek-sized trees? THAT would be super-cool!!
I remember those days of climbing on three strand and begging my boss to get some arborplex. Hell he had no idea what I was talking about. I didn't climbing like I do now until like two years ago. I use do nothing but crane removals and ocassional pruning and if it was big I was hooking it. I had been body thrusting up trees since I big enough to fit in Dads saddle. A year ago I would have told you I was falling apart and old. Since the recent surgery on the shoulder and knee I feel great.
NickfromWI
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Smarter, not harder
That "s" is for "smart."
love
nick
That "s" is for "smart."
love
nick
Tom Dunlap
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Mike,
Is that the stainless steel or titanium lanyard?
Tom LMAO
Is that the stainless steel or titanium lanyard?
Tom LMAO
Tree Machine
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I could dig a titanium-core flipline about half the diameter as now, and wrapped with Amsteel. I still like the microcender, but I have to agree with you that the steel snaps are completely unnecessary and should be of aluminum.
My microcender-to-D-ring is an aluminum Kong autolock (captive eye) which I think is my answer to the opening thread
There is no weak link in this system. Nothing can be cut through if a saw touches ANY PART OF IT (unless you tried to cut through). The weak link is human error. My rig is bombproof, easily adjustable one-handed and has never, ever failed me. That's all I need of it. -TM-
My microcender-to-D-ring is an aluminum Kong autolock (captive eye) which I think is my answer to the opening thread
Aluminum auto lock, but not necessarily the one shown. It just happens to be what I'm trying in that position for , well, for the last year.
There is no weak link in this system. Nothing can be cut through if a saw touches ANY PART OF IT (unless you tried to cut through). The weak link is human error. My rig is bombproof, easily adjustable one-handed and has never, ever failed me. That's all I need of it. -TM-
Tree Machine
Addicted to ArboristSite
don't git yer undies bunched
And Rocky will be quick to note that there is a spring retention pin in the microcender, but I have since replaced that pin assembly with the proper bolt and lock nut. -TM-
And Rocky will be quick to note that there is a spring retention pin in the microcender, but I have since replaced that pin assembly with the proper bolt and lock nut. -TM-
Tom Dunlap
Addicted to ArboristSite
Wire core flip lines will give you only a little more cut protection. I've heard, but not seen, that a tensioned wcfl will cut pretty easy. Nick your saw teeth a little though.
If you're bringing the wire core to get protection then you might consider your saw handling techniques. Not that it isn't a good idea to have protection but it seems to me that the amount of protection is small compared to the weight.
Do you always have two means of support when using a chain saw in the tree? Good positioning and handling will keep you and your gear out of harm's way.
Does a MicroCender work with that thick line? It seems large enough to need a Macro Cender.
Tom
If you're bringing the wire core to get protection then you might consider your saw handling techniques. Not that it isn't a good idea to have protection but it seems to me that the amount of protection is small compared to the weight.
Do you always have two means of support when using a chain saw in the tree? Good positioning and handling will keep you and your gear out of harm's way.
Does a MicroCender work with that thick line? It seems large enough to need a Macro Cender.
Tom
mikecross23
ArboristSite Guru
I use a 12' wire core for removals, but wish it were 8'. I just like the way it flips up or down a spar. Since switching to an advanced hitch on my prunning lanyard, I find myself using it more.
Tom,
Ever get a picture of your butterfly w/ the delta links?
-Mike-
Tom,
Ever get a picture of your butterfly w/ the delta links?
-Mike-
Kneejerk Bombas
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That's where wire core flip lines are used, if you do a lot of spiking up and down large straight spars, not for cut protection.
You need two tie in points when cutting. Even if you cut your rope you wouldn't go anywhere, there's another rope holding you.
You need two tie in points when cutting. Even if you cut your rope you wouldn't go anywhere, there's another rope holding you.
I used to think I really needed a wirecore. Then instead I started using 2 tie ins and focusing on saw handling.
I figure you need it for the stiffer hand.
You can easily knock the "a split second counts" theory because I am guessing that most people who cut it can't see they are cutting it so that argument is out.
Gotta go kill an elm tree hanging over a glass house
and focusing on saw handling.I figure you need it for the stiffer hand.
You can easily knock the "a split second counts" theory because I am guessing that most people who cut it can't see they are cutting it so that argument is out.
Gotta go kill an elm tree hanging over a glass house
Lumberjack
Banned
I use an 18' wire cored lanyard. I have a prusik tied and the tail comes back around as another lanyard. I use a micro pulley to mind the knot and I like it better than the asender because I can adjust it either way with easier than having to open the cam and pull the rope through.
Oh and I use a pear screw gate.
Carl
Oh and I use a pear screw gate.
Carl
Tree Machine
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Are we now a flipline thread???
The acid test to the saw technique thing would be 'How long until you nick your flipline?' Because to be quite honest if you just lightly nick it, you're gonna be thinking about buying a new one. Once the rope winding dissociates from the inner steel cable, the rope will slide up the cable, bunching up, and making use of the microcender impossible.
My current wirecore I bought at last years TCI, making it about a year old to the day, and not a nick. Of the two previous wirecores, I dinged them both going up on pine takedowns, limbing as I'm climbing. My saw handling technique improved after that. Wirecores can run up to $75
Let's lay an 8 foot wirecore, minus the snaps, next to a buckstrap or lanyard, minus the snaps and compare their respective weights, I think you'll see that the difference is mere ounces.
The weight can be used to advantage. As MikeCross23 puts it
I like the instant, two-fingered (make that a finger and a thumb) adjustment of the (oh so heavy) microcender. And I'll be quite honest, mentally, I feel more secure on a wirecore than from a buckstrap, or a Grillion, or rope lanyard. But that's just me. -TM-
The acid test to the saw technique thing would be 'How long until you nick your flipline?' Because to be quite honest if you just lightly nick it, you're gonna be thinking about buying a new one. Once the rope winding dissociates from the inner steel cable, the rope will slide up the cable, bunching up, and making use of the microcender impossible.
My current wirecore I bought at last years TCI, making it about a year old to the day, and not a nick. Of the two previous wirecores, I dinged them both going up on pine takedowns, limbing as I'm climbing. My saw handling technique improved after that. Wirecores can run up to $75
Let's lay an 8 foot wirecore, minus the snaps, next to a buckstrap or lanyard, minus the snaps and compare their respective weights, I think you'll see that the difference is mere ounces.
The weight can be used to advantage. As MikeCross23 puts it
I like the way it flips around anything. I like the way you can have it wrapped twice around you, grab hold of a snap, do two lasso turns above your head and you're ready to flip. I love how the microcender can be pushed to the far snap end so you can flip around a fat trunk section. I have never even thought about the weight of the rig until writing about it here.
I like the instant, two-fingered (make that a finger and a thumb) adjustment of the (oh so heavy) microcender. And I'll be quite honest, mentally, I feel more secure on a wirecore than from a buckstrap, or a Grillion, or rope lanyard. But that's just me. -TM-
Burnham
ArboristSite Operative
You are so right, Rocky J. The aluminum snaphooks are sweet, the only way to go if you have the choice. All my rope lanyards, anything I build myself, has them. If someone is marketing a cable core with an aluminum snaphook I havn't found it...if anyone knows of a supplier, please let me know.
MB, you asked about "Beranek sized trees". Nooo Waaay. The largest that I climb here go in the 50 to 70 inch DBH range, 225 to 250 feet overall. Douglas fir, Noble fir, these will still be 3+ feet in diameter 100 feet up. We have some bigger ones, maxing out at around 100 inch DBH, same height range, or a bit more, but I have never had a job that put me in one of that size. Now everyone will agree that these are big sticks, but nothing like the Man puts up.
When I was young, strong, and knew nothing about ascenders, I did these big'uns with spurs and sweat. Beranek knows . More and more I am using SRT on these...getting better at placing the line. But sometimes the right target just isn't there, and the wildlife bio needs to know "is that a red tree vole nest there on that one limb at about 90 feet up?" Now, take it easy boys, you can't put a spur hurtin' on a tree with 4+ inches of bark at that height, maybe 7 or 8 inches at the ground, so up I go...batching all the way .
The majority of my climbing is in younger, smaller trees...I only get into the big boys every now and then. And you are right...it IS cool.
MB, you asked about "Beranek sized trees". Nooo Waaay. The largest that I climb here go in the 50 to 70 inch DBH range, 225 to 250 feet overall. Douglas fir, Noble fir, these will still be 3+ feet in diameter 100 feet up. We have some bigger ones, maxing out at around 100 inch DBH, same height range, or a bit more, but I have never had a job that put me in one of that size. Now everyone will agree that these are big sticks, but nothing like the Man puts up.
When I was young, strong, and knew nothing about ascenders, I did these big'uns with spurs and sweat. Beranek knows
. More and more I am using SRT on these...getting better at placing the line. But sometimes the right target just isn't there, and the wildlife bio needs to know "is that a red tree vole nest there on that one limb at about 90 feet up?" Now, take it easy boys, you can't put a spur hurtin' on a tree with 4+ inches of bark at that height, maybe 7 or 8 inches at the ground, so up I go...batching all the way .The majority of my climbing is in younger, smaller trees...I only get into the big boys every now and then. And you are right...it IS cool.
Tom Dunlap
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Jerry's told me how much easier it is to get into the tree with the BS and SRT. He says that he would be pretty wasted by the time he fliplined up a trunk. Doing that for too many years will takes it toll on your body.
Burnham,
I'll bet you could get the splicers at Sherrill to make up a wire core with the flat aluminum snaps. If they can't slip the wire in I would think they could take a longer flipline, cut off the steel snaps and swage new eyes with the al snaps.
Tom
Burnham,
I'll bet you could get the splicers at Sherrill to make up a wire core with the flat aluminum snaps. If they can't slip the wire in I would think they could take a longer flipline, cut off the steel snaps and swage new eyes with the al snaps.
Tom
