I’m going to do some calling around and see if I can get it in sooner somewhere else to at least get a diagnosis without a 2 week weighting period.
Trailer break problem. I need help, I;='m Stumped
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I’m going to do some calling around and see if I can get it in sooner somewhere else to at least get a diagnosis without a 2 week weighting period.
Frank Boyer
Addicted to ArboristSite
Buy a volt meter and do some tests. The voltage drop test works on the negative side. Does the manufacture have a wiring diagram online? Trying to fix electrical without testing can be extremely frustrating and expensive.
Well after wasting a full day spending money and getting no where and just tired of going over the same things again and again, I started calling this morning for a place to look at it.
I found a place that said they could look at it rite away, so I headed down there even though it was a fairly long drive. Just after I left the house I remembered a trucking yard I worked out of for 12 years that was just 6 miles away that has a shop for all there trucks.
Having had many trucks worked on there for so long I decided to pop in and see some old friends and see if they would look at it.
Had a nice chat with Darwin, Glen and Gus all part owners and all family they told there best trailer guy to look at it. So he broke out some rather expensive testing gear and started probing.
We found out that I am getting the rite voltage to both break assemblies, both with the foot break and the hand break. Grounding was good and still almost zero breaks.
Did a little more visiting and thanked them for the help and offered to pay, and they wouldn’t have any of that. I thanked them again and said I’d pop in sometime soon just to visit.
Also I didn't like the way the place I was headed to sounded on the phone and I went to the place where I bought my cargo trailer that had been there 17 years and there shop still looks like a brand new shop. So they keep a tidy house and have been there a long time. I had called them and they said they could get it done by Friday so off I went.
Just to double check I stopped at my house and unhooked the flat bed and hooked up the cargo trailer and gave it a test drive. Sure enough it worked perfectly like it always has.
Running 30 mph I hit the trailer hand break and she locked up with no problem.
Returned to the house and swapped them out and took the flat bed to the shop where there supposed to do a diagnostic and call with the results.
It’s in the hands of the pros now so hopefully they can sort it out.
I did ask then to test the old break assemblies and if the are working I said to put them on the front axle with some new break hubs so then id have breaks on both axels.
So now we wait!
I found a place that said they could look at it rite away, so I headed down there even though it was a fairly long drive. Just after I left the house I remembered a trucking yard I worked out of for 12 years that was just 6 miles away that has a shop for all there trucks.
Having had many trucks worked on there for so long I decided to pop in and see some old friends and see if they would look at it.
Had a nice chat with Darwin, Glen and Gus all part owners and all family they told there best trailer guy to look at it. So he broke out some rather expensive testing gear and started probing.
We found out that I am getting the rite voltage to both break assemblies, both with the foot break and the hand break. Grounding was good and still almost zero breaks.
Did a little more visiting and thanked them for the help and offered to pay, and they wouldn’t have any of that. I thanked them again and said I’d pop in sometime soon just to visit.
Also I didn't like the way the place I was headed to sounded on the phone and I went to the place where I bought my cargo trailer that had been there 17 years and there shop still looks like a brand new shop. So they keep a tidy house and have been there a long time. I had called them and they said they could get it done by Friday so off I went.
Just to double check I stopped at my house and unhooked the flat bed and hooked up the cargo trailer and gave it a test drive. Sure enough it worked perfectly like it always has.
Running 30 mph I hit the trailer hand break and she locked up with no problem.
Returned to the house and swapped them out and took the flat bed to the shop where there supposed to do a diagnostic and call with the results.
It’s in the hands of the pros now so hopefully they can sort it out.
I did ask then to test the old break assemblies and if the are working I said to put them on the front axle with some new break hubs so then id have breaks on both axels.
So now we wait!
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The other day I went and picked up a load of green pecan and felt like I had a full load, weight wise anyway.
Now I pull with a 94 Chevy ½ ton short bed step side so it’s a small truck. And I had problems with having to much tong weight and most of you know what that means.
So I put some 2500 lb supper springs and new heavy duty shocks to help with the heavy weight. It pulls and rides 100% better.
Now having a heavy load I wanted to see just how heavy it was.
There a Cat scale about 3 miles from my house, so since I was already loaded I did the loaded weight first.
Trailer loaded
Front axle was 1920lb
Drive axle was 3800lb
Trailer axels was 8080lb
Total GVW with loaded trailer was 13800lb
Went home and unloaded and went back for a second weight.
Front axle was 2440lb a gain of 520lb
Drive axle was 2560lb a los of 1240lb
Trailer axles was 2000lb a los of 6080lb
Total GVW with empty trailer 7000lb
For just a guess I was pretty close on the weight on the trailer. the trailer is rated at 6000lb
So I was over 80lb.
I wonder what the weights were with just the stock springs?
Now you see why I really need my trailer breaks working. Stopping an 8080lb trailer with a little ½ ton truck is just asking for trouble.lol
Now I pull with a 94 Chevy ½ ton short bed step side so it’s a small truck. And I had problems with having to much tong weight and most of you know what that means.
So I put some 2500 lb supper springs and new heavy duty shocks to help with the heavy weight. It pulls and rides 100% better.
Now having a heavy load I wanted to see just how heavy it was.
There a Cat scale about 3 miles from my house, so since I was already loaded I did the loaded weight first.
Trailer loaded
Front axle was 1920lb
Drive axle was 3800lb
Trailer axels was 8080lb
Total GVW with loaded trailer was 13800lb
Went home and unloaded and went back for a second weight.
Front axle was 2440lb a gain of 520lb
Drive axle was 2560lb a los of 1240lb
Trailer axles was 2000lb a los of 6080lb
Total GVW with empty trailer 7000lb
For just a guess I was pretty close on the weight on the trailer. the trailer is rated at 6000lb
So I was over 80lb.
I wonder what the weights were with just the stock springs?
Now you see why I really need my trailer breaks working. Stopping an 8080lb trailer with a little ½ ton truck is just asking for trouble.lol
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i can tell you this,,your are getting VOLTAGE to the BRAKES,,but you arent getting AMPS..been there one toooo many times...this can be caused by bad grounds,,wires in the blue wire back to the brakes corroded, wires broken loose,,where trailer manufacters use those rotten crimp connectors 
, and other maladies!! bet if you ran a new blue wire back to the brakes,,and SOLDERED it ,since you said you fixed the grounds,,they would work..this considering the grounds are good. also,,the trailer boys told me,,do not hold full large batt voltage to the magnets too long,,youll smoke em.. thats why the safety batt is only so many amps.......just a short burst,,even with the small batt.....the magnets are rated at 3 amps....
, and other maladies!! bet if you ran a new blue wire back to the brakes,,and SOLDERED it ,since you said you fixed the grounds,,they would work..this considering the grounds are good. also,,the trailer boys told me,,do not hold full large batt voltage to the magnets too long,,youll smoke em.. thats why the safety batt is only so many amps.......just a short burst,,even with the small batt.....the magnets are rated at 3 amps....
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For my seconded disappointment for today, my old trusty ms290 stopped oiling properly so I removed the oiler and clean out all the oil lines and tank, cleaned the oil pump and the impeller turns real easy with my finger and the worm gear is in good shape.
Put it back together and it will pump a very tiny bit of oil. But not nearly enough, even with the oil adjustment set to max.
I have a brand new ms290 that I can compare it to and the new one pumps oil like crazy.
So I took it to a sthil dealer to have it serviced, they said that the worm gear wasn’t engaging with the sprocket, but they had it working.
Picked it up and tried to make a cut on a log and within les then a minuet the chain got hot and no oil on the chain.
I took the bar off and ran the saw so I can see how much oil is coming out of the little hole. And its barely putting out any oil, not nearly enough to oil the chain.
Pulled the chain off my new 290 and the oil comes out 10 times better.
So I still have a saw that won’t oil properly even though the shop said it does.
The old saw won’t even pump enough oil to sling it off the chain like it used to.
All my other saws will sling oil from the chain when running but not my old one.
Damn it!
Put it back together and it will pump a very tiny bit of oil. But not nearly enough, even with the oil adjustment set to max.
I have a brand new ms290 that I can compare it to and the new one pumps oil like crazy.
So I took it to a sthil dealer to have it serviced, they said that the worm gear wasn’t engaging with the sprocket, but they had it working.
Picked it up and tried to make a cut on a log and within les then a minuet the chain got hot and no oil on the chain.
I took the bar off and ran the saw so I can see how much oil is coming out of the little hole. And its barely putting out any oil, not nearly enough to oil the chain.
Pulled the chain off my new 290 and the oil comes out 10 times better.
So I still have a saw that won’t oil properly even though the shop said it does.
The old saw won’t even pump enough oil to sling it off the chain like it used to.
All my other saws will sling oil from the chain when running but not my old one.
Damn it!
Impalervlad
ArboristSite Member
Did you clean the oil pickup screen?
The shop I now trust to work on my saws said always start with the simple things first.
I had a saw on which the oiler quit. I took it to a shop and they told me it had a bad oil pump. They ordered a new one and a month later I had my saw back (they said they would call me when it was done but they didn't and I took them at their word until I got tired of waiting - they said they were busy and didn't get a chance to call). They said everything was fixed so I paid them the $125 for the oil pump and an hour shop time. First time I cut with the new pump installed, I smoked the bar because it wasn't getting any oil.
I complained on this site and several folks got on the case and one in particular told me how to reach the oil pump and check it. It took me less than fifteen minutes to pull the pump and reinstall and adjust for oil flow. Then, I thought about what my new shop said and decided to check the oil pickup screen. It should have been checked by the shop before they decided to sell me a new oil pump but I checked anyway. It was totally clogged and a couple of sprays with some carb cleaner had it all cleaned up. Now, I'm getting a little too much oil. I know how to adjust it now and just need to find the time to do it. I also know I should check the simple stuff on my own and only bother with the shop when I can't do the work myself.
The point of this long story is -check the oil pickup screen.
I would also check the other simple thing and make sure the oil delivery hole is clear and not plugged - you know, keep it simple and don't assume a shop would check the simple stuff.
The shop I now trust to work on my saws said always start with the simple things first.
I had a saw on which the oiler quit. I took it to a shop and they told me it had a bad oil pump. They ordered a new one and a month later I had my saw back (they said they would call me when it was done but they didn't and I took them at their word until I got tired of waiting - they said they were busy and didn't get a chance to call). They said everything was fixed so I paid them the $125 for the oil pump and an hour shop time. First time I cut with the new pump installed, I smoked the bar because it wasn't getting any oil.
I complained on this site and several folks got on the case and one in particular told me how to reach the oil pump and check it. It took me less than fifteen minutes to pull the pump and reinstall and adjust for oil flow. Then, I thought about what my new shop said and decided to check the oil pickup screen. It should have been checked by the shop before they decided to sell me a new oil pump but I checked anyway. It was totally clogged and a couple of sprays with some carb cleaner had it all cleaned up. Now, I'm getting a little too much oil. I know how to adjust it now and just need to find the time to do it. I also know I should check the simple stuff on my own and only bother with the shop when I can't do the work myself.
The point of this long story is -check the oil pickup screen.
I would also check the other simple thing and make sure the oil delivery hole is clear and not plugged - you know, keep it simple and don't assume a shop would check the simple stuff.
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Last night I went out to the shop and took another look at it. And everything looked fine.
But I did have some slight wear on the sprocket. So I had a spar and I put on a new sprocket and I ran a whole tank of gas through the saw and she cut fine and seemed to oil ok.
I have 5 saws, and I have a ritual that I use on every one of them. But before I explain that , yes I have a air compressor that I used to blow out all the oil lines on the oil pick up line and the little filter on the end.
Here is how I clean my saws,
First thing I do is clamp the bar with the head attached in my vice and do my sharpening with a hand file and file gage. Then I check with a gage my rake levels so there not to tall. The teeth on a saw are angled and after you sharpen them a few times you have to take the rakes down so the teeth can bite into the wood.
Then I remove the bar and scrape out all the junk and debris from the bar grove, then I use my compressor to blow out the grove and make sure the end sprocket is turning freely and the little oil holes in the bar are clear. While the bar is off I blow out al the holes for the oil and clean the mounting area where the bar bolts on. Then a scrape the cover plate that holds the bar and blow it clean.
Once everything is clean and ready to assemble I put it back together and tighten the chain adjustment while moving the chain back and forth so it moves freely and is not too tight or too loose. And yes I lift the bar up when I titan the bar so the adjustment is rite. Once that’s done I blow away any dirt away from the oil filler cap and gas cap so no debris can fall into the tank when I remove the cap. I refill the oil and fuel and clean he air filter and she’s ready to go.
I do this about every 2 tanks of fuel run through the saw, so yes I have a routine that has worked for years.
The enemy of a chain saw is neglect and lack of being maintained.
A dull saw will first get hot, and then the chain stretches and looses its temper, once that has happened the chain is worthless. It will never stay sharp after the temper is gone, even a new chain.
So yes I’m very anal about keeping my saws in tip top shape.
My guess is the sprocket wasn’t staying the little worm grove and wasn’t turning fast enough to pump enough oil.
Now I got a call from the trailer place this morning and he said I had one break adjusted too tight. I don’t see how that would have kept them from locking up. If anything it would have made them drag or lock up to fast or easy.
But he said he had them locking up properly now.
I gave him the go ahead to put breaks on the other axle so now I’ll have breaks on both axles, that should do the trick.
I told him I wanted to be able to drag the trailer till the tires pop if I needed to. He said it would be ready this afternoon.
So when I get there I hope it works or I’m going to be pissed!
But I did have some slight wear on the sprocket. So I had a spar and I put on a new sprocket and I ran a whole tank of gas through the saw and she cut fine and seemed to oil ok.
I have 5 saws, and I have a ritual that I use on every one of them. But before I explain that , yes I have a air compressor that I used to blow out all the oil lines on the oil pick up line and the little filter on the end.
Here is how I clean my saws,
First thing I do is clamp the bar with the head attached in my vice and do my sharpening with a hand file and file gage. Then I check with a gage my rake levels so there not to tall. The teeth on a saw are angled and after you sharpen them a few times you have to take the rakes down so the teeth can bite into the wood.
Then I remove the bar and scrape out all the junk and debris from the bar grove, then I use my compressor to blow out the grove and make sure the end sprocket is turning freely and the little oil holes in the bar are clear. While the bar is off I blow out al the holes for the oil and clean the mounting area where the bar bolts on. Then a scrape the cover plate that holds the bar and blow it clean.
Once everything is clean and ready to assemble I put it back together and tighten the chain adjustment while moving the chain back and forth so it moves freely and is not too tight or too loose. And yes I lift the bar up when I titan the bar so the adjustment is rite. Once that’s done I blow away any dirt away from the oil filler cap and gas cap so no debris can fall into the tank when I remove the cap. I refill the oil and fuel and clean he air filter and she’s ready to go.
I do this about every 2 tanks of fuel run through the saw, so yes I have a routine that has worked for years.
The enemy of a chain saw is neglect and lack of being maintained.
A dull saw will first get hot, and then the chain stretches and looses its temper, once that has happened the chain is worthless. It will never stay sharp after the temper is gone, even a new chain.
So yes I’m very anal about keeping my saws in tip top shape.
My guess is the sprocket wasn’t staying the little worm grove and wasn’t turning fast enough to pump enough oil.
Now I got a call from the trailer place this morning and he said I had one break adjusted too tight. I don’t see how that would have kept them from locking up. If anything it would have made them drag or lock up to fast or easy.
But he said he had them locking up properly now.
I gave him the go ahead to put breaks on the other axle so now I’ll have breaks on both axles, that should do the trick.
I told him I wanted to be able to drag the trailer till the tires pop if I needed to. He said it would be ready this afternoon.
So when I get there I hope it works or I’m going to be pissed!
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Impalervlad
ArboristSite Member
It sounds like your disappointments are starting to fade away into just memories and that's a good thing.
Triple +1 on corroded/ oxidized crimp on connections, voltage wise will check good, but the amps can't get through. goes for the back side of the socket on truck also.
One set of trailer brakes I had on a tandem axle trailer began to give trouble like OP mentioned, so got all grounds and voltages correct and still weak brakes. After much head scratching and verbal outburst, I tore it down for the 7th time. The hub where the actuator magnet rode was grooved and did not allow enough contact to engage the brake enough to lock up. The solution was to have the hub turned only where the actuator magnet rode. Perfect brakes till sold years later. Hope this helps
I did check the hubs and they looked good, no gouges or rust that I could see.
The bill on the saw repair was only $18.00 on the saw so that wasn’t bad.
The trailer guy said there was no charge for the diagnostic, but since he looked at it rite away and didn’t wan to charge me, I let him do the work on the other axel plus adding the break away controller.
Said it would run about $200 for everything.
When someone treats me rite and with respect, I generally reward them with my loyalty, and do the same for them as well.
I’ll wait till tomorrow to pick up the trailer since I would have to sit in traffic for 2 hours to go this afternoon.
Thanks for all the help and suggestions.
i can tell you this,,your are getting VOLTAGE to the BRAKES,,but you arent getting AMPS..been there one toooo many times...this can be caused by bad grounds,,wires in the blue wire back to the brakes corroded, wires broken loose,,where trailer manufacters use those rotten crimp connectors
I picked up the trailer this morning because I have a delivery to make and they said it was ready and working.
So I get there pay my bill and hook up to the trailer. No change, thay still barley work even with breaks on both axels.
After almost 500 dollars and a pro shop working on them and that still don’t work.
After I make this delivery I will be taking it back and make them get it rite.
I pulled the empty trailer across a gravel parking lot and hit the hand break to full breaking(12 volts) and it still wont lock the tires.
What a pain in the ass!
They said they checked all the wiring both amps and voltage and it read correctly.
WTF?
Like I said I have a cargo trailer with 6000lbs on it and it will lock up at what ever speed you are going if you use the hand break. So why not an empty flat bed?
So I get there pay my bill and hook up to the trailer. No change, thay still barley work even with breaks on both axels.
After almost 500 dollars and a pro shop working on them and that still don’t work.
After I make this delivery I will be taking it back and make them get it rite.
I pulled the empty trailer across a gravel parking lot and hit the hand break to full breaking(12 volts) and it still wont lock the tires.
What a pain in the ass!
They said they checked all the wiring both amps and voltage and it read correctly.
WTF?
Like I said I have a cargo trailer with 6000lbs on it and it will lock up at what ever speed you are going if you use the hand break. So why not an empty flat bed?
Did it ever lock them up ?
Is the flatbed the trailer using the 6to7 adapter?
Did you try the new break away???
That will prove the brakes, should lock up.
That will prove the brakes, should lock up.
for what you paid you could have bought new brakes and magnets and re wired it your self.
NSMaple1
Addicted to ArboristSite
Every time I've had a trailer brake problem, it's been bad ground - that includes problems just like the one you're having. No doubt about it, trailer brakes can be a royal PITA.
Well as it stands now I used the trailer to make some delivery’s today.
What the shop did was test everything including all the wiring grounds plug and re adjusted the new brake assemblies I had installed myself the day before.
And thay called and said the breaks were lucking up and working properly.
So wanting the best breaks I can get on my trailer I had them test the old brake assemblies that I replaced the day before and if they were good to put them on the front axel and I would buy new break hubs to go along with them so I would have breaks on both axels.
They did install the break away battery that I had bought the day before when I bought the first set of break assemblies.
So as of now the trailer has breaks on both axels with a break away battery.
The first time I hooked them up and started to pull I hit the hand break to test the breaks and all it did was barley slow the truck. Now this was on a gravel covered concrete drive with an empty trailer with new breaks on both axels and it should have locke them up with no problem.
And when the trailer was new and only had breaks on just one axel and no breakaway battery on it, it would lock up the breaks with no problem. So with twice the breaks it should have thrown me through the windshield with just the trailer breaks and not with the truck breaks.
In fact as a 25 year vet truck driver I know the trailer breaks should lock up, even on a loaded 18 wheeler.
When a car would be following me too closely for miles on the highway and I was in my 18 wheeler, I would pull the hand break and lock up the trailer breaks and scare the #### out of them and they would back off.
My cargo trailer will lock up the breaks with the hand break with no problem.
So I know something is still not rite.
It’s going back to the shop ether today or Monday and I’m going to make them do what ever it takes to make them work.
With my parts and there parts and labor I’ve put almost $500 in a break job and they don’t work worth ####!
What the shop did was test everything including all the wiring grounds plug and re adjusted the new brake assemblies I had installed myself the day before.
And thay called and said the breaks were lucking up and working properly.
So wanting the best breaks I can get on my trailer I had them test the old brake assemblies that I replaced the day before and if they were good to put them on the front axel and I would buy new break hubs to go along with them so I would have breaks on both axels.
They did install the break away battery that I had bought the day before when I bought the first set of break assemblies.
So as of now the trailer has breaks on both axels with a break away battery.
The first time I hooked them up and started to pull I hit the hand break to test the breaks and all it did was barley slow the truck. Now this was on a gravel covered concrete drive with an empty trailer with new breaks on both axels and it should have locke them up with no problem.
And when the trailer was new and only had breaks on just one axel and no breakaway battery on it, it would lock up the breaks with no problem. So with twice the breaks it should have thrown me through the windshield with just the trailer breaks and not with the truck breaks.
In fact as a 25 year vet truck driver I know the trailer breaks should lock up, even on a loaded 18 wheeler.
When a car would be following me too closely for miles on the highway and I was in my 18 wheeler, I would pull the hand break and lock up the trailer breaks and scare the #### out of them and they would back off.
My cargo trailer will lock up the breaks with the hand break with no problem.
So I know something is still not rite.
It’s going back to the shop ether today or Monday and I’m going to make them do what ever it takes to make them work.
With my parts and there parts and labor I’ve put almost $500 in a break job and they don’t work worth ####!
