Keeping the peace with a brother in law

[SteveH]

Here's the deal: you two are in a partnership. You allow him to do the stuff he does, and he goes out and does the stuff.

 

[Mike PA]

Ever go to his house for a visit? While there, find out where they are and go see them.

Otherwise, you just need to be direct. Explain it the way you have here. Tell him it has been three years and you need to know what is going on. Put him on notice right then that you have trusted him, but if he cannot produce the saws, then he needs to make it right, or no more borrowing tools. Any tools that he needs that need to leave your place, you go along with them. If you can't go, your tools don't go.

One last possibility - He knows he has had your saws for a few years. He may be asking you where you get your saws because he is going to replace one of them for you, since he has destroyed it.

BTW - It seems you are too nice. It's time for him to man up and take responsibility for his actions. You do him no favors by babying him. I would not rebuild the saws and give them to him. I would help him rebuild them, after buying the parts (since he broke it), and then offer to sell the saws to him for a small fee. Maybe he will learn something.

 

[Urbicide]

The #1 rule of chain saw ownership is never loan your saws!

I have been the nice guy many times, just not with saws. Seems that some believe your loaning of items or cash to them automatically equates to a gift after a certain amount of time passes. I would strongly recommend that you keep your saws locked up, just in case an "emergency" should arise, with the BIL feeling entitled to commandeering one or more. Does your BIL have any nice guns that you might "borrow"?

 

[boltonranger]

Billy; you're dealing with more than one thing.

1. You have 2 saws presently loaned to him.
The terms are not clear; but they belong to you unless you told him different.
It doesn't matter how long he's had them. If he destroyed them; he owes you.

2. He didn't ask for a saw; he asked where you bought yours.
He probably was hoping you'd offer another; and why shouldn't he? He's done pretty good so far.

If you want the saws - get the saws. There is no big controversy here.
-br

 

[GlenM]

Does he have anything you could 'borrow' from him?

 

[Diesel Pro]

Hindsight= 20-20

When he made mention of "another saw" you should have asked him what he needed to do that the two saws he borrowed couln't do?

It may also be simpler to volunteer to do a little cutting with one of your saws and keep the peace. Also gives an excuse to possibly see your babies...

 

[barton174]

Oh boy... I'll be interested to hear the outcome of this!

Mike

 

[striperswaper]

if his wife is a hotie, ask to borrow her - when he asks why tell him as a partial payment for the two saws that have not been returned
might make him think

 

[olyeller]

This is simple, if not easy

Here's the solution. In your original post, you said, "(He) then asked me where I buy my saws from, because he needs another saw." So get in the truck, pick him up and take him to look at brand-new Husqvarna and Makita/Dolmar saws. Then he will see how expensive these puppies are. While you're in the store, just be square with him and explain how he took about $700-$900 worth of saws from you and never mentioned it much less brought them back. Explain that you don't want any hard feelings over this since he's family, but that the two of you need to get this squared away. Ask him what he wants to do about this to make things right. Then ask him to get the two saws and you can work on them together.

And just like that you've solved the problem and have a better BIL and a new chainsaw buddy too.

Olyeller

 

[Billy Jack]

Lots of good points. Yeah, I was too nice and that's my fault. He really doesn't have anything I need to borrow, although I do have his commercial grade broadcast spreader at my house ($150 or so). He's never asked for it back, but sees it all the time (he stores it at my "rural" house, rather than keep it in his truck or in his small outbuilding at his subdivision home).

Negative on "borrowing" his wife. He doesn't own a gun either. He has provided some shrubs, ground cover, etc., though. The saws are the only real flies in the ointment, so to speak.

I guess I'll have to cowboy up and demand he show me the saws, rather than just ask. I hate getting snotty about it, but I feel the comments here prove that I have been nice - maybe too nice - about it for long enough.

 

[MNTAINGAL23]

You definitly have been to nice.
I have a son that used to come over when we were gone and borrow things without asking. He no longer does that and he knows not to ask about borrowing any saws.
He is a good kid just not very good at returning things the way he got them.
(He gets that from his Dad, who is an ex):hmm3grin2orange:

 

[Hddnis]

If he really uses the saws in a business he should have the money to buy a saw. If not, then he needs to learn to run a business. I'm not trying to sound like a know-it-all saying that. I understand about cash flow and all, shoot, I learned what I know the hard way running my own business. lol

You won't do him any favors helping him continue a bad way of doing business.

You have decided what is best for you. Stick with it and no apology is needed, they are your saws.



Mr. HE

 

[barneyrb]

Well, you could always treat him like PB treated his BIL...is a long read but very entertaining.

http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=65278

 

[boltonranger]

There is absolutely nothing "snotty" about asking to have your saws back.
But I suppose you could do it in a snotty way.
Just say "BIL please bring me my saws. I need them."

Forget about "nice" "not nice", "snotty;" etc...

Just be courteous and get your saws back.
-br

If you're feeling guilty about the spreader - return it when you ask.
You sound a little like you're walking on eggs for some reason..
You afraid he's pregnant?

 

[Billy Jack]

There is absolutely nothing "snotty" about asking to have your saws back.
But I suppose you could do it in a snotty way.
Just say "BIL please bring me my saws. I need them."

Forget about "nice" "not nice", "snotty;" etc...

Just be courteous and get your saws back.
-br

If you're feeling guilty about the spreader - return it when you ask.
You sound a little like you're walking on eggs for some reason..
You afraid he's pregnant?

Well, I've tried the tactful way and it didn't take. I tend to get rather unpleasant way too quickly when I feel I'm being lied to - or at a minimum - not being told the whole truth. I try not to "police" my own family or neighbors, so my methods have to change from what I'm comfortable with. In the end, I want peace within my own family above all else.

I'm not at all guilty about the spreader. He chose to leave it there, I didn't ask him to. But it does bring up a concern about how he seems to haphazardly leave equipment in different places. I do use it though.

lol about the pregnancy joke. No, he's not pregnant, but I am a full foot taller than him and don't want to act like a bully, although he knows better than that.

 

[boltonranger]

Well, I've tried the tactful way and it didn't take....In the end, I want peace within my own family above all else.
.

Yer a good guy Billy; that's for sure.
But listen, Saying you'll be over to his house in the morning to pickup your saws that he borrowed forever ago, has nothing to do with tact.

It has to do with scheduling. "I'll be by at such and such time" is just giving him the heads up he needs for when to have the saws ready.

If he's busy that morning; well then go in the afternoon, that's all.

The idea of peace above all else is a nice thought.
Admirable too. But you being made a sucker...well I don't call that peace at all.
That is taking advantage.
And taking advantage is not a peaceful action.
It's aggressive action.

So how is it that you're responsible to turn the aggression of another into peace? Are you the only one in the family responsible for his own actions?

By this we often enable others and perpetuate their bad behavior.
We become responsible for them taking advantage of us.

I've been there. Not easy. But deciding to stand up for what's right even though it initially caused a blow-out has earned the respect of some of my family members, and they don't try to take advantage know. Not with me. And we still have a relationship; it didn't end everything.

It just ended their bad behavior.

Good luck with it.
-br

 

[kspakland]

Here's the solution. In your original post, you said, "(He) then asked me where I buy my saws from, because he needs another saw." So get in the truck, pick him up and take him to look at brand-new Husqvarna and Makita/Dolmar saws. Then he will see how expensive these puppies are. While you're in the store, just be square with him and explain how he took about $700-$900 worth of saws from you and never mentioned it much less brought them back. Explain that you don't want any hard feelings over this since he's family, but that the two of you need to get this squared away. Ask him what he wants to do about this to make things right. Then ask him to get the two saws and you can work on them together.

And just like that you've solved the problem and have a better BIL and a new chainsaw buddy too.

Olyeller

Must be nice to have a lucid moment .........

 

[spike60]

The responsibility for "keeping the peace" should not rest on your shoulders. Borrowing without returning is not borrowing, it's stealing. The guy has lost all borrowing privledges for life.

In general, I have always refused to be backed into the type of corner that you now find yourself in. I always stand my ground in this situation, and I would NEVER take it up the kazoo just to keep the peace.

The guy is a creep for what he did with the other two saws, so why should you be concerned that your saying no is going make you the bad guy? And why should there be a problem in the family if he's mad, but not if you are the one who's wronged? The reason: Because this jerk won't keep it just between the two of you. He'll whine and cry to family members and stir them up. This guy is trouble. I can't believe that you actually like him.

 

[KansasTom]

On Sunday, my brother-in law (1 of 3) came over to my house while I was out in my shop. I've been cleaning it up and had all my saws clean and neatly displayed. He remarked that he wished he had built his shop the same way (it is on a slab, stick built, wired, insulated, sheetrocked, and vinyl siding), then asked me where I buy my saws from, because he needs another saw. Big RED flag came out. This is the same guy who I have remarked "permanently borrowed" a Husqvarna 55 and a brand new Makita (50-ish cc model) that I had used for only fifteen minutes (only a slight scratch on the bar paint!). He borrowed them probably three YEARS ago, and I asked him several times to bring them back so I could service them, although he could continue to use them for his (small) landscaping business.

Up until two days ago, I had a glimmer of hope that both saws still lived, but now I bet they are junk (if he still has them). He doesn't maintain equipment, of that I am sure. Part of this issue was my lack of insistence for him to return the saws in a timely manner. I take responsiblity for that. But Sunday I got the feeling he was going to ask to borrow another one (he'll probably do this by asking my wife when I'm not home).

I've already made up my mind that his "borrowing" days from me are over. I feel that a good $700 dollars worth of used-up chain saws sealed that deal. I'm going to instruct my wife that he is not to borrow anything without asking me personally, but she already knows I'm pissed at him. He's not a bad guy - I actually like him - but he is not a responsible person. Now I want to just maintain a level of civility and just write off the two saws as a learning experience for myself. Still, when he (likely) asks to borrow something (namely a saw), I feel a strong urge to qualify my refusal with an ultimatum that he returns both saws in whatever shape they are in, as well. This might get some bad blood boiling on the wife's side of the family because I tend to dig my heels in when I'm angry, and strongly express my reasoning for my stance. I have a sneaking suspicion that IF the saws were still useable, he sold them a while back, but won't admit it. That's why I'm leaning towards seeing two battered pieces, that used to be chain saws, before I call him out.

Any suggestions on how to deal with this? No, I'm not going to beat him up though. Non-violent suggestions please.

In a tough spot for sure. since you have already asked for the saws back numerous times (I assume you've been direct with him about it, not trying to ask in a joking manner). Explain to him your diffacult situation(your point-of-view) and see what his reasoning is for not giving you your property back. Maybe he did something for you that you didn't realize and has decided to use your saws as payment. If he has no answer or says that you "gave them to him" or "you owe him", then I would suggest bringing another family member into the situation, one that you both respect, and then confront him about it. I would guess he's tore them up and not wanting to pay up to fix them or he doesn't have any money to do so. If he has sold them, tell him you will take reasonable payments until the value of the saws are paid back. If you didn't give them to him, don't let him off the hook.

 

[fubar2]

Tell him you are selling them and need them back to show to the prospective buyer.