Echo warranty a joke, need new saw.

[Cliff R]

NEVER put a Champion plug in anything for any reason, NGK is far superior in every respect.

I still have the same set of NGK's in my 455 Pontiac engine that have been in service in 3 engines now for over 30 years. I just hit them with ultra fine glass beads between engine builds and use them again. The car is street driven and drag raced frequently and never missed a beat once in all these years.



Anyhow, it is also mandatory to remove the limiter caps on the CS-370 and 400 saws and give them a LOT more fuel than they show up with from Echo. To keep the EPA happy with that design they are set WAY too lean right out of the box. I have two CS-370's here, one has about a zillion hours on it. I'm actually trying to kill it on purpose, but it just keeps on getting it done.

One problem with those saws when you set the "H" mixture screw is that they have a coil that retards the timing at high rpm's and mimics a correct carb setting, so don't be afraid to start out PLENTY rich and sneak up on the best setting so it's 4 stroking nicely out of the cut but cleans up when you put load on it.

I've bought a LOT of CS-370/400's and sold them to customers, and have had a good many brought to the shop to tune correctly. To date none of them have had a single issue anyplace, and the owners absolutely love them. I consider the CS-370/400's one of the very best bargains out there for a 36-40cc saw......LIGHT YEARS better than the Stihl MS-170's with the fixed jet carburetors on them......IMHO.......Cliff

 

[mountainlake]

Same here, no problems when tuned right. Plus have sold a lot and everyone loves them.. Best buy for a 40cc saw by far. Steve

 

[HarleyT]

Cliff, you are a well known Echo man here. What do you think happened to his piston? Have you ever encountered
one like this?

 

[jd548esco72]

i've had the warranty jerk-around from every major brand , the only ones that really put their money where their mouth was the homie dealers-- 40 years ago--

and maybe jones red , also very good-- but this was 1983 -- today may be another story

the one exception is dolmar/makita and that is because i just bought one-- and nothing has broke-- they might stink as well for all i know-- haven't owned one long enough to tell-- having never had to take one back to the dealer --

saws these days just about come with a warranty of " if it breaks in two--you own both halves!" ---

 

[Cliff R]

Best guess "H" speed screw was too lean, EGT's were hot enough and the ring heated up/ends butted together and it yanked the top off the piston. It started in the area where the pin is inserted as that would be the weakest place in the piston ring land area......Cliff

 

[Deleted member 149229]

I made ZERO modifications to this saw. Only thing I did was change the plug. Warranties anymore aren't there to protect the buyer, just the manufacturer. Yes, that CS-400 is a great saw to run. As much as I'm upset with how crappy Echo is being I'll probably buy another one.

 

[Deleted member 149229]

Since I've only been running saws a couple years and have never tried to act like I know more than I do I need some guidance. Anyone know of a good chainsaw mechanic in Western PA that can mod and tune my existing CS-400 and the new one I'm going to buy. Might as well have a pro do it instead of me screwing it up from the shakes I have because of the stroke. I ain't looking for charity, more than glad to pay. Thanks.

 

[mountainlake]

As has been mentioned Echo saws have to have the limiter caps pulled and tuned right, you bought yours from a dealer and he should have done that but didn't plus should have stood up for you on the warranty . Worthless dealer, sound like he gone and good riddance . I'd buy one off Ebay as cheap as you can and find a good backyard saw tuner to tune it, about a 99.5% chance you wont need a worthless warranty when tuned right. Also it's not hard to tune these saws, just start out real rich and lean them out gradually until they cut the fastest in big wood, soon as you get a little lean they will bog easy and not cut as fast. If you do find a good saw tuner stick around a watch him. Steve

 

[GeorgiaVol]

Picked this one up Friday for $50. Carb kept flooding. Cleaned it up at work and found out a carb gasket was missing. Going to try and run it this weekend.

 

[Deleted member 149229]

Great buy. Good luck.

 

[Cliff R]

"I made ZERO modifications to this saw"

IF you liked anything about the CS-400 stone stock, it's probably at least 30 percent better with a minor muffler modification and the limiter caps removed!

For sure right out of the box they are by far and above the leanest of all the Echo's I've tuned here. Some will not even stay running or rev up clean until they are fully warmed up and heat soaked, and even then they hesitate and go lean in the cut.

To date I haven't seen one break the top off the piston, but have seen a good many of them smear some aluminum over the ring on the exhaust side. With that said, every single Echo saw we have tuned BEFORE the owners ran them are flawless, and not one single P/C problem from any of them to date.....FWIW......Cliff

 

[Blokhead]

Best guess "H" speed screw was too lean, EGT's were hot enough and the ring heated up/ends butted together and it yanked the top off the piston. It started in the area where the pin is inserted as that would be the weakest place in the piston ring land area......Cliff

That's got to be the first time I've ever seen anybody say that in a chainsaw forum!

I had an old Arctic Cat El Tigre sled with a 500cc air cooled twin in it, and I was playing around with restrictors in the ends of the chambers to get more power. Was bored .060 over, had Wiseco's, and the heads were milled. Tightening up the exhaust definetly made more power, but apparently caused the exhaust temps to sky rocket, because it seized after a short run. Pistons survived (probably because they were forged), but the rings end smashed together so hard they mushroomed , and score both of the cylinder walls.

Looking back I really had no clue about excessive compression, restrictive pipes, and lean jetting. Oh well, live and learn.
As it was detonating, I wondered what that rocks shaken in a tin can sound was! Did run good for those 30 seconds or so.

 

[jd548esco72]

of the 4 echos i have i bought three off ebay as "wrecks" or "not-running for parts"

the two with the burned up pistons had catalytic mufflers -- a 450P and a 530P , they were super easy to fix and not all that expensive -- just a piston and a ring -- the cylinders cleaned up very easy on them-- i suspect your 400 would be about the same--

any of these catalytic converter saws needs that converter removed and the carb re-tuned--

you'll find that e-bay is covered up with cs-400s as are pawn shops -- since the box stores sell um there everywhere --

 

[Chuck Oppermann]

Did you verify that the champion plug actually is a hotter plug than the NGR? Maybe they are full of it.

Also I was wondering why you changed the plug in the first place? Was the saw not running right? Maybe there was a different problem lurking around.

 

[Deleted member 149229]

I normally change plugs every couple months when I run stuff a lot. Just to avoid fowling. Just a quirk of mine.

 

[Chuck Oppermann]

What are the heat ranges for the two plugs. Check them out just because. I would think they are very very close to each other.

 

[Deleted member 149229]

The Champion is only 2 bars higher for the heat range.

 

[Chuck Oppermann]

I am curious because I have a new Echo 620p and don't want the same problems you ended up with. Hopefully there is a lesson in all of this somehow. For starters make sure I keep the same plug brand etc even though I think Echo is just fishing for a way out of it.

 

[Deleted member 149229]

No doubt trying to get out of the warranty. I did get email from their public relations, that's a joke, that the service rep has final say. End of discussion.

 

[HarleyT]

Who exactly did you deal with? The area dist. or Echo?