Dealer says 441 M-Tronics are junk

[blsnelling]

No argument there. 441 is insane on how well it does on fuel. Mine impressed me, and the power impressed me. The weight and weak spring AV did not. I like my 044 better. Not a bad saw at all, just not my optimum saw.

You can fix the weak AV part. The springs on my wrap model are much stiffer. Not much you can do with the weight.

 

[Slamm]

Associates Degree here, not that I would brag about that, but 3 out of the top 10 smartest people I know only have an 8th grade education ............... granted it was 8th grade in an Amish school system, LOL. They all log or help me with my logging when needed or they can. I know another young logger that has a bachelor's degree. The others are older guys and quite smart/crafty or enterprising. I know of two absolute idiots that call themselves loggers and well, they cut trees down, but it isn't pretty and it isn't efficient and I'm not sure how they aren't dead yet.

I think either for the good or bad, but logging tends to kill off the stupid ones (and I don't mean that lightly for anyone that knows someone who died logging), its just that you have to have your brain on quite a few things at once and if you mess up or slip up too many times, your number is up.

Sam

 

[Andyshine77]

some of us loggers may have a little more education than one would think. whether it be from the school system or the school of hard knocks. myself i have a few semesters of college and a lot of years of hard knocks. andy is casting a very broad net that a lot of guys in the industry just wont appreciate.

You see the feeling is mutual. Some of the so called logger put down firewood cutter every chance they get, yet IMHO a good firewood cutter is every bit as hard on a saw as a logger. Just because someone is a logger, doesn't mean they now anything about saws, and that's been proven to me time and time again. And man are logger set in their ways.

 

[Bowtie]

You can fix the weak AV part. The springs on my wrap model are much stiffer. Not much you can do with the weight.

Ya, I wish they had those when I had my 441, but I got rid of it. The weight is the weight, like you said. possibly how it will be until technology changes that issue.

 

[blsnelling]

Associates Degree here, not that I would brag about that, but 3 out of the top 10 smartest people I know only have an 8th grade education ............... granted it was 8th grade in an Amish school system, LOL. They all log or help me with my logging when needed or they can. I know another young logger that has a bachelor's degree. The others are older guys and quite smart/crafty or enterprising. I know of two absolute idiots that call themselves loggers and well, they cut trees down, but it isn't pretty and it isn't efficient and I'm not sure how they aren't dead yet.

I think either for the good or bad, but logging tends to kill off the stupid ones (and I don't mean that lightly for anyone that knows someone who died logging), its just that you have to have your brain on quite a few things at once and if you mess up or slip up too many times, your number is up.

Sam

My Dad was a high school drop out and later got his GED in the military. The thing of it is, he was a mechanical genuis, and tested as such. He just never had the upbringing and life chances. Sometimes you have to play the hand you're dealt with. I worked in manufacturing until I was 32, and went to school part time. I finally decided I had to finish up, and finally got my bachellors degree at the age of 32. It was the best thing I could have ever done with myself. That's not always possible to do though. I was fortunate enough to be able to make it happen.

 

[lone wolf]

You see the feeling is mutual. Some of the so called logger put down firewood cutter every chance they get, yet IMHO a good firewood cutter is every bit as hard on a saw as a logger. Just because someone is a logger, doesn't mean they now anything about saws, and that's been proven to me time and time again. And man are logger set in their ways.

Sounds like a personal issue.I am a Firewood cutter and Tree Service and I dont see why you would broadside all loggers because what one or two said?:angry2:

 

[Slamm]

??? I don't get the weight thing, Wiggs and I, closed our eyes and passed 441 and 440/044/460 whatever they are around and neither could tell the weight difference.


I've cut all day with modded 440 years ago and 460's in more recent times and at the end of the day, there wasn't any difference between the three in the weight depart. In the vibe department, the 441 wins all day long, it simply is a Cadillac of saws. You have to go Husky to get anything remotely to similar.

For those that vibes supposively don't bother, well thats great, but do you hold onto a saw for 8-14 hours per day?? Or do you just cut some firewood or cookies here and there. That being the case, whether or not the vibes matter to you, doesn't negate the fact the it is a free bonus provided by the 441 over either the 440 or 460.

Same thing goes for fuel mileage, just because someone loves the 440/460 and they use 1/4 gallon every other weekend cutting firewood or cookie cutting, doesn't mean that the 441 is less of a saw, just because that person doesn't need or desire that benefit that the 441 provides at the same weight with more comfort.

I think its interesting to watch the two schools of thought, as I can't see that any other 70cc saw has as much going for it as the Mtronics 441 (Exception would be the 576AT, but not sure of its mileage or dependability), and yet there are others that can't see how on earth someone would be caught dead with a 441, LOL.

Different strokes for different folks,

Sam

 

[Bowtie]

My Dad was a high school drop out and later got his GED in the military. The thing of it is, he was a mechanical genuis, and tested as such. He just never had the upbringing and life chances. Sometimes you have to play the hand you're dealt with. I worked in manufacturing until I was 32, and went to school part time. I finally decided I had to finish up, and finally got my bachellors degree at the age of 32. It was the best thing I could have ever done with myself. That's not always possible to do though. I was fortunate enough to be able to make it happen.

Sounds familiar. I dropped out of high school my Junior year, got my GED and went straight to college. I then partied like a rockstar, while on Kings honor roll, until I pissed away my grant and loan money.

Then I quit college and went to work full time (I was working full time during college most of the time.)

I spent 12 years building everything from houses to multi-million dollar warehouses to billion dollar bridges using tools from an Estwing hammer to a 100 ton crawler crane. Now I am a mechanic that works on a lot of high dollar complicated rental equipment.

Sorry but Andy's statement pissed me off. Not trying to piss on anyone's parade.

 

[Stihlman441]

if you sawzilla 441 saws are so mean lets compare them to other 70cc class saws like for instance an xpw like one of mine. youll find out what getting your azz handed to you is really like.

I did a vid today stock 441 v ported 441 C v stock 460 so hang on while it loads.

 

[tlandrum]

ported saws vs stock saws are not what i want to see. i want to see the sawzilla against another 70cc class ported saw from a reputable porter. i should hope that your ported saw is faster than a stock saw.

 

[Metals406]

Sounds familiar. I dropped out of high school my Junior year, got my GED and went straight to college. I then partied like a rockstar, while on Kings honor roll, until I pissed away my grant and loan money.

Then I quit college and went to work full time (I was working full time during college most of the time.)

I spent 12 years building everything from houses to multi-million dollar warehouses to billion dollar bridges using tools from an Estwing hammer to a 100 ton crawler crane. Now I am a mechanic that works on a lot of high dollar complicated rental equipment.

Sorry but Andy's statement pissed me off. Not trying to piss on anyone's parade.

I don't think he meant it as an insult to all loggers everywhere, just thought I'd give him a heads up on how it read.

Me thinks he busted out the 12" heavy nap roller, and meant to use a 2" sash brush.

 

[Bowtie]

I don't think he meant it as an insult to all loggers everywhere, just thought I'd give him a heads up on how it read.

Me thinks he busted out the 12" heavy nap roller, and meant to use a 2" sash brush.

Understood. Not a big deal. I like the comparison! Not that anyone asked for my stupid teenage story anyway, and that was yearssss ago, lol.

 

[Andyshine77]

Ya, I wish they had those when I had my 441, but I got rid of it. The weight is the weight, like you said. possibly how it will be until technology changes that issue.

The added weight is a real turn off for me, if it had everything it does without the weight it would be a true game changer.

 

[Bowtie]

The added weight is a real turn off for me, if it had everything it does without the weight it would be a true game changer.

441 is smooooooth in the cut and powerful. Weight is an issue to me now, it did not used to be, but in the past few years it has become such. And, i will admit, Im old school. I work on stuff everyday that is more high tech than I would like it to be, so i enjoy my 044 and 026 and L-head Briggs engines. Maybe I was born a decade too late? Hahaa.

 

[Andyshine77]

Sounds like a personal issue.I am a Firewood cutter and Tree Service and I dont see why you would broadside all loggers because what one or two said?:angry2:

If you didn't realize I was just trying to otstir: well.:msp_tongue:

Now do you guys have any tips on porting these saws? Who's getting the best gains out of them? I could see an electrical engineer easily changing the the parameters to really wake things up.

 

[blsnelling]

If you didn't realize I was just trying to otstir: well.:msp_tongue:

Now do you guys have any tips on porting these saws? Who's getting the best gains out of them? I could see an electrical engineer easily changing the the parameters to really wake things up.

I don't see any reason to go inside the electronics. Max RPMs under any load is a perfect tune, and that's what M-Tronic is doing.

 

[MacLaren]

Be careful guys. Is it not a Federal Offense to port an Autotune/M-Tronic?

Just sayin......

 

[Metals406]

Be careful guys. Is it not a Federal Offense to port an Autotune/M-Tronic?

Just sayin......

I think they have their hands full with an ever failing dollar, protesters in every major city, and that pesky war against all North Africa thing.

 

[Stihlman441]

ported saws vs stock saws are not what i want to see. i want to see the sawzilla against another 70cc class ported saw from a reputable porter. i should hope that your ported saw is faster than a stock saw.

Sorry mate cant help ya with a ported 70cc class saw to compare to there is not a lot of ported saws around me that i know of.
Cant get a stock 441C in Australia yet
Vid is still coming.:msp_wink:

 

[Stihlman441]

Vid stock 441 V ported 441CRM-Tronic V stock 460 all with a 20'' bar and Carlton chisel chain and 8 pin sprockets.Well i have to say i was disappointed with the stock 441,played with the tune ended up at 13500 w/o and even checked the comp which was 155 psi,460 is at 13400 w/o and 170 psi.

[video=youtube;epG-kuAGRyI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epG-kuAGRyI[/video]