KiwiBro
Mill 'em, nails be damned.
Thanks. Just visited their site. Looks like they do Speeco splitters as well! I wonder how long before they have the Speedpro flywheel splitter in their line up 
DR Rapid Fire Rack & Pinion
- Thread starter VTWoodChucker
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D&B Mack
Sawin Wit It!
Good Eye, never noticed it. I wonder if they are small enough to not matter?
nysparkie
ArboristSite Member
Why Not?
Why did DR decide not to put a towing capability on these? Just asking. I have one but pushing it up ramps
onto a trailer sort of sucks, especially if you are alone, 490 some pounds. It would have been nice to pull with my ATV or Truck
to get it different parts of the property to use right where I need it.
Why did DR decide not to put a towing capability on these? Just asking. I have one but pushing it up ramps
onto a trailer sort of sucks, especially if you are alone, 490 some pounds. It would have been nice to pull with my ATV or Truck
to get it different parts of the property to use right where I need it.
D&B Mack
Sawin Wit It!
My guess: saves on the design. They can concentrate on how it splits wood rather than it being towed.
Doesn't sound like much at first, but if you think about it, there is a lot of work into getting an "odd shaped" item to be pulled down the road at 50 mph and be liable for it. Also, this splitter sits much higher than the speeco. And to properly balance it for high speed towing, I would guess it would have to have a much wider axle. This would, in turn, make it harder to move around on-site which I believe is what they were aiming for.
BluCllrSchlr
ArboristSite Member
I have an ancient Special Edition model SS built by FXG(Paul's predecessor & father-in-law?). I've been to Paul's shop in Bridgewater, MA, where he was gracious enough to let me come in, ask questions & even let me bring a piece of knarly elm & split it right there in his shop. After I bought mine, I was able to go to Paul & buy some bearings(not back-ordered, no waiting for shipping). Later, he replaced the pinion & bearings for me. My rack was bent, a friend helped me straighten it on a press & at Paul's recommendation, I took a die grinder & dressed the teeth that had started to bend over at the corners saving about $300. I essentially have a brand new Special Edition except for the motor. There is no telling how much wood this machine has split and I have every confidence it will out live me.
I don't have any DR products. My impression is they are aimed at the more industrious weekend warrior. To compare the highly polished info-mercial videos from DR to Paul's demo video, speaking only for myself, does give a relevant indication, in my opinion, of the resources and marketing aspirations of both companies. I think it's a safe bet that I'll never see Paul on some early morning cable channel demo-ing his splitter while I would be surprised if DR doesn't go down that very path(that one's on the house DR).
I don't know how many people work at DR, but am glad to know that they are at least doing what appears to be most of the manufacturing of their splitter in VT. Paul may very well be a one man operation. I hope there is room in the market for both companies. Out of deserved customer loyalty, I do lean toward SS. If I didn't already have a SS, I would consider both DR & SS with price, bearings, quality of castings/machining/assembly being considerations. As I don't presently use my splitter commercially, I'm fully confident I can if I choose & if I did decide to sell my splitter I would be able to get essentially what I have in it.
Concerning operation, I'm vigilant to keep my left hand on top of the wood to hold it in position while my right hand lifts the lever. Doing it this way keeps my hand from being between the wedge & the wood. I'm also able to split the wood exactly where I want it. I split pine for kindling and can safely & quickly split it into 1/2" sticks that are perfect. This wouldn't be possible without holding the wood accurately.
Splitting with the SS compared to a hydraulic is much like the difference between splitting with an ax/maul and a wedge. The wood splits instead of shears.
All that being said, I must say that my biggest issue is that DR uses the term "revolutionary" in their advertising.
I don't have any DR products. My impression is they are aimed at the more industrious weekend warrior. To compare the highly polished info-mercial videos from DR to Paul's demo video, speaking only for myself, does give a relevant indication, in my opinion, of the resources and marketing aspirations of both companies. I think it's a safe bet that I'll never see Paul on some early morning cable channel demo-ing his splitter while I would be surprised if DR doesn't go down that very path(that one's on the house DR).
I don't know how many people work at DR, but am glad to know that they are at least doing what appears to be most of the manufacturing of their splitter in VT. Paul may very well be a one man operation. I hope there is room in the market for both companies. Out of deserved customer loyalty, I do lean toward SS. If I didn't already have a SS, I would consider both DR & SS with price, bearings, quality of castings/machining/assembly being considerations. As I don't presently use my splitter commercially, I'm fully confident I can if I choose & if I did decide to sell my splitter I would be able to get essentially what I have in it.
Concerning operation, I'm vigilant to keep my left hand on top of the wood to hold it in position while my right hand lifts the lever. Doing it this way keeps my hand from being between the wedge & the wood. I'm also able to split the wood exactly where I want it. I split pine for kindling and can safely & quickly split it into 1/2" sticks that are perfect. This wouldn't be possible without holding the wood accurately.
Splitting with the SS compared to a hydraulic is much like the difference between splitting with an ax/maul and a wedge. The wood splits instead of shears.
All that being said, I must say that my biggest issue is that DR uses the term "revolutionary" in their advertising.
CampHamp
ArboristSite Lurker
Mini-rails
Yes they are part of the shipping machine - welded on. They slope on all sides (hard to see in the photo). Even though they are small enough to easily pull most pieces over, like a speed bump, the larger pieces and ones with bumps on their surface don't hop over as easily. Only the largest pieces will touch both rails, so they cannot be relied upon for hands-free splitting like one could using the SpeedPro cradle. They're not a big hassle for me, though, and I certainly would prefer these to anything larger (like a cradle).
It might keep the careless user from seating pieces at an angle or if someone doesn't put the log right against the wedge, then it would help prevent the piece from turning during the split. Maybe there are other reasons (?) but if you put the log to the wedge and hold the log until initial contact, then there is no value that I see.
Yes they are part of the shipping machine - welded on. They slope on all sides (hard to see in the photo). Even though they are small enough to easily pull most pieces over, like a speed bump, the larger pieces and ones with bumps on their surface don't hop over as easily. Only the largest pieces will touch both rails, so they cannot be relied upon for hands-free splitting like one could using the SpeedPro cradle. They're not a big hassle for me, though, and I certainly would prefer these to anything larger (like a cradle).
It might keep the careless user from seating pieces at an angle or if someone doesn't put the log right against the wedge, then it would help prevent the piece from turning during the split. Maybe there are other reasons (?) but if you put the log to the wedge and hold the log until initial contact, then there is no value that I see.
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nysparkie
ArboristSite Member
The owners Manual shows having the chunk against the ram vs. the wedge. Doesn't explain why. I believe it is so hands and fingers are not laying about (Wrong place at wrong time) when the ram goes forward. Just saying.
:msp_scared:
:msp_scared:
nysparkie
ArboristSite Member
Rapid Fire after three weeks
Have been using the Rapid Fire for three weeks. Now. I can say that I am able to split at a rate that is X's time faster than my 27 ton Troy Bilt Hyd. When I have a pile of chunks right behind me as I work. I am able to split faster than my wife can stack by her taking three or four split pieces at a time and only walking from 0 ft to 16 ft while stacking. I say X times faster for I never timed myself on a Hydraulic Splitter. I have split 3 cords of timber in under 75 minutes on the Rapid Fire. I know it would have been a couple of hours minimum on the Troy Bilt. When all you have to do is turn, lift, place, ram, slide 1/2 of split on table out of way, place other 1/2 on ram, split, split again. Grab other 1/2, split, split again. Repeat process. A 24 inch slab of Ash is gone in less than 40 seconds. I have gotten to the point where I can hang on to larger pieces, turning them slightly while operating the ram - more or less slicing "Splits" off - one right after the other. So if I can get 4 or 5 pieces off of 1/2 slab and it takes less than 3 seconds for a stroke/retract.....12 to 15 seconds to finish off 1/2 of that chunk. No way in heck can I come close to operating a hydraulic ram that fast. I have tested it on Y branched chunks and real knotty pieces of Chestnut, Walnut, Ash. If it stops, I retract and just hit it a 2d and if needed 3d time. I have never had to hit it 4 times. The machine is stable, doesn't vibrate, is loud for the motor is up high closer to your ears. The handles are great. It moves like a loaded contractor wheel borrow. Feels just as heavy when moving it around. I wouldn't have one after owning one with the table and handles. It is too convenient and may I say necessary for fast splitting. Let alone moving around. I couldn't imagine moving this thing without the handles. You are talking about close to 500 pounds. One xtra item. When using the hydraulic splitter, did you ever find yourself leaning over and placing you hand somewhere on the splitter as you waited for the cycle to complete. I have. By doing so I used my inside thigh to keep pressure on the Hydro handle to keep the ram moving. Back was always just short of kinking up when using the hydro splitter. I'm 6 ft tall. Well this hasn't been an issue on the Rapid Fire. Stand Tall while using the ram. No bending over "while in use" issues. Only when to pick a chunk up off the ground. There is an issue with larger chunks. I mean the 30 or more inch ones. I am pretty strong but I am not picking those up off the ground. Now I have to use Maul and Wedges first to get it to "Pick me Up Size". I am also looking into build a small welders type table to place next to the Rapid Fire Table. I believe this might facilitate the splitting by giving me a completely different spot to place 1/2 splits, especially the larger ones, where I don't have to worry about them being pushed off the Rapid Fire Table by just split "rammed" pieces. Happiness factor 9.5 out of 10. Wow factor on time saving 9.9 out of 10. Durability factor - that is why I bought it now! For the THREE YEAR FREE WARRANTY.
Have been using the Rapid Fire for three weeks. Now. I can say that I am able to split at a rate that is X's time faster than my 27 ton Troy Bilt Hyd. When I have a pile of chunks right behind me as I work. I am able to split faster than my wife can stack by her taking three or four split pieces at a time and only walking from 0 ft to 16 ft while stacking. I say X times faster for I never timed myself on a Hydraulic Splitter. I have split 3 cords of timber in under 75 minutes on the Rapid Fire. I know it would have been a couple of hours minimum on the Troy Bilt. When all you have to do is turn, lift, place, ram, slide 1/2 of split on table out of way, place other 1/2 on ram, split, split again. Grab other 1/2, split, split again. Repeat process. A 24 inch slab of Ash is gone in less than 40 seconds. I have gotten to the point where I can hang on to larger pieces, turning them slightly while operating the ram - more or less slicing "Splits" off - one right after the other. So if I can get 4 or 5 pieces off of 1/2 slab and it takes less than 3 seconds for a stroke/retract.....12 to 15 seconds to finish off 1/2 of that chunk. No way in heck can I come close to operating a hydraulic ram that fast. I have tested it on Y branched chunks and real knotty pieces of Chestnut, Walnut, Ash. If it stops, I retract and just hit it a 2d and if needed 3d time. I have never had to hit it 4 times. The machine is stable, doesn't vibrate, is loud for the motor is up high closer to your ears. The handles are great. It moves like a loaded contractor wheel borrow. Feels just as heavy when moving it around. I wouldn't have one after owning one with the table and handles. It is too convenient and may I say necessary for fast splitting. Let alone moving around. I couldn't imagine moving this thing without the handles. You are talking about close to 500 pounds. One xtra item. When using the hydraulic splitter, did you ever find yourself leaning over and placing you hand somewhere on the splitter as you waited for the cycle to complete. I have. By doing so I used my inside thigh to keep pressure on the Hydro handle to keep the ram moving. Back was always just short of kinking up when using the hydro splitter. I'm 6 ft tall. Well this hasn't been an issue on the Rapid Fire. Stand Tall while using the ram. No bending over "while in use" issues. Only when to pick a chunk up off the ground. There is an issue with larger chunks. I mean the 30 or more inch ones. I am pretty strong but I am not picking those up off the ground. Now I have to use Maul and Wedges first to get it to "Pick me Up Size". I am also looking into build a small welders type table to place next to the Rapid Fire Table. I believe this might facilitate the splitting by giving me a completely different spot to place 1/2 splits, especially the larger ones, where I don't have to worry about them being pushed off the Rapid Fire Table by just split "rammed" pieces. Happiness factor 9.5 out of 10. Wow factor on time saving 9.9 out of 10. Durability factor - that is why I bought it now! For the THREE YEAR FREE WARRANTY.
D&B Mack
Sawin Wit It!
Still waiting on mine, been two weeks. :msp_razz:
Gamedic
ArboristSite Member
There is a DR Rapidfire video on youtube. It's not a video from the company, but an actual owner. Sorry I don't know how to post it and am really busy right now. So no time to learn. It's under DR rapidfire log splitter. Maybe someone else can post it. The owner is splitting a large stringy piece of elm and it looks to do a pretty good job.
D&B Mack
Sawin Wit It!
Yeah, a member here.
[video=youtube_share;iFiPurAkeso]http://youtu.be/iFiPurAkeso[/video]
[video=youtube_share;YTXnqz78KzA]http://youtu.be/YTXnqz78KzA[/video]
D&B Mack
Sawin Wit It!
Finally Arrived!!!
Glad to hear, now let's see it in use
nysparkie
ArboristSite Member
Great and now lets see video
Did you get the splitting Table with handles? My opinion: You will want/need it. Invaluable to jockey the whole thing around and speed up the splitting process. Mine is working like a Cheetah. I can split 3 cords of Ash in as little as 75 minutes. That is at least 75 minutes faster than with
a Hydraulic Splitter, mine anyways. I'll try, with smart phone, to get some video up here showing how I just roll a chunk and just keep whacking on the edge. Taking a 4 or 5 inch split off each ram stroke. It makes for a very quick split movement. Did you get the special price? The Special One year hands on use/return if not satisfied? 3 year extended warranty? You may have paid more but I believe the xtra is worth it for the one year use and 3 year warranty. Lets see Super Split or Speeco match that warranty? I have other DR Equipment and their Tech support is excellent. I am cleaning up and painting my 27 Ton Troy Bilt and the "FOR SALE" sign is going on it. For those larger stumps I'll just split it with maul and wedges so I can lift. Hi Ho, Hi Ho, its off to work I go.
Did you get the splitting Table with handles? My opinion: You will want/need it. Invaluable to jockey the whole thing around and speed up the splitting process. Mine is working like a Cheetah. I can split 3 cords of Ash in as little as 75 minutes. That is at least 75 minutes faster than with
a Hydraulic Splitter, mine anyways. I'll try, with smart phone, to get some video up here showing how I just roll a chunk and just keep whacking on the edge. Taking a 4 or 5 inch split off each ram stroke. It makes for a very quick split movement. Did you get the special price? The Special One year hands on use/return if not satisfied? 3 year extended warranty? You may have paid more but I believe the xtra is worth it for the one year use and 3 year warranty. Lets see Super Split or Speeco match that warranty? I have other DR Equipment and their Tech support is excellent. I am cleaning up and painting my 27 Ton Troy Bilt and the "FOR SALE" sign is going on it. For those larger stumps I'll just split it with maul and wedges so I can lift. Hi Ho, Hi Ho, its off to work I go.
D&B Mack
Sawin Wit It!
Did you get the splitting Table with handles? My opinion: You will want/need it. Invaluable to jockey the whole thing around and speed up the splitting process. Mine is working like a Cheetah. I can split 3 cords of Ash in as little as 75 minutes. That is at least 75 minutes faster than with
a Hydraulic Splitter, mine anyways. I'll try, with smart phone, to get some video up here showing how I just roll a chunk and just keep whacking on the edge. Taking a 4 or 5 inch split off each ram stroke. It makes for a very quick split movement. Did you get the special price? The Special One year hands on use/return if not satisfied? 3 year extended warranty? You may have paid more but I believe the xtra is worth it for the one year use and 3 year warranty. Lets see Super Split or Speeco match that warranty? I have other DR Equipment and their Tech support is excellent. I am cleaning up and painting my 27 Ton Troy Bilt and the "FOR SALE" sign is going on it. For those larger stumps I'll just split it with maul and wedges so I can lift. Hi Ho, Hi Ho, its off to work I go.
Got the table, electric start and maintenance meter. Got the 3 year warranty.
nysparkie
ArboristSite Member
OUTSTANDING AND THE ELECTRIC START...now i am jealous....:msp_smile:
Dozer Man
ArboristSite Operative
This bus is heavy...lol
For curiousity's sake, when a rapidfire breaks down, where do you take it to get fixed. And also, I've gone all over the dr webpage and I can't find any commitment as to whether there products are 100% made in the USA. I know when I talked to paul at SS he said when he decided not to help dr to build/commercialize there product, that he couldn't stop dr from "buying" two brand new machines. At which they did and proceeded to reverse engineer(copy) it. Paul also questioned there vendors for there manufactured hard parts(pinion,rack,flywheels,etc...). He knew they weren't using the same vendors that he used. After looking through dr's website, seeing nothing about made in usa, I questioned where there parts are made also.
DR offered me no discounts, although they did point out that I didn't have to pay sales tax, and there shipping quote was $100 more than SS. I still saved $1000 compared to the dr and $1300 compared to the SS. Even if I had the extra grand, I would have shelled out another $300 to get the original SS, not the copy. But that's the problem, I didn't have that extra $1k, so I went with the SpeedPro from my local TSC store. My only other option was a hydraulic unit. Kinetic vs. Hydraulic??? No brainer there. And not to mention it has to be towable to me (fabbing would've been required on ss or the dr). No issues whatsoever so far with my speedpro either. Yes, I'm concerned with quality issues, but isn't everyone with everything they purchase?? I would have the same concerns with the DR.
Sorry all for the rant, I went through the dilemma of deciding which kinetic splitter to buy a couple months ago, and these were just some of the things I based my decision on. To each there own! I honestly wish you all good luck with your rapidfire splitters. I never wish ill will on anyone. I wonder how many they've sold so far??
Hmmm, this bus that I've been thrown under aint so heavy after all !!!
For curiousity's sake, when a rapidfire breaks down, where do you take it to get fixed. And also, I've gone all over the dr webpage and I can't find any commitment as to whether there products are 100% made in the USA. I know when I talked to paul at SS he said when he decided not to help dr to build/commercialize there product, that he couldn't stop dr from "buying" two brand new machines. At which they did and proceeded to reverse engineer(copy) it. Paul also questioned there vendors for there manufactured hard parts(pinion,rack,flywheels,etc...). He knew they weren't using the same vendors that he used. After looking through dr's website, seeing nothing about made in usa, I questioned where there parts are made also.
DR offered me no discounts, although they did point out that I didn't have to pay sales tax, and there shipping quote was $100 more than SS. I still saved $1000 compared to the dr and $1300 compared to the SS. Even if I had the extra grand, I would have shelled out another $300 to get the original SS, not the copy. But that's the problem, I didn't have that extra $1k, so I went with the SpeedPro from my local TSC store. My only other option was a hydraulic unit. Kinetic vs. Hydraulic??? No brainer there. And not to mention it has to be towable to me (fabbing would've been required on ss or the dr). No issues whatsoever so far with my speedpro either. Yes, I'm concerned with quality issues, but isn't everyone with everything they purchase?? I would have the same concerns with the DR.
Sorry all for the rant, I went through the dilemma of deciding which kinetic splitter to buy a couple months ago, and these were just some of the things I based my decision on. To each there own! I honestly wish you all good luck with your rapidfire splitters. I never wish ill will on anyone. I wonder how many they've sold so far??
Hmmm, this bus that I've been thrown under aint so heavy after all !!!
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nysparkie
ArboristSite Member
From Visitor DR POWER:
"Hope you don't mind me jumping in - I'm Michael, the Product Manager for the new Rapid Splitter product line from DR.
Thought I could answer a couple of the questions raised. First thing I'd like to point out is that we actually manufacture most every product we sell under the DR brand right here in our factory in Vermont. The final assembly line for the new Rapid-Fire is actually being tuned up right now, and with a few exceptions most of the components are US made (one notable exception is the superb Subaru engines)
While the product was definitely inspired by the amazing Super-Split,"
Also from DR POWER: As for the price and quality of DR products I'd like to think our reputation speaks for itself. Over 25 years we've serviced almost 1 million customers, and our owner satisfaction surveys report that on average 95% of customers tell us they would recommend their DR to a family member or friend (and they do!), which we think is the ultimate test. Do they cost more than the average box store product? You bet. But it's not because of our advertising -- we actually spend less on advertising than the discount we need to give to retailers when we sell our products to them wholesale. The reason (FOR THE HIGHER PRICE) is because we build them to last, and because we'll stand behind them to the end. We have DR Trimmer Mower customers like zogger who have machines from 20+ years ago that can still call us toll free to order spare parts or receive knowledgeable tech support. We know not everyone BUYS EQUIPMENT TO LAST A LIFETIME BUT WE SLEEP BETTER KNOWING THAT OUR EQUIPMENT STAYS OUT IN THE FIELD AND NOT IN THE REPAIR SHOP.
From Another DR POWER POST:
Dr commercial warranty
Thanks for welcoming me!
This is a commercial machine and we're offering a full 2 year warranty. We also have our 1 year "Hands On Trial" -- buy a Rapid Fire and if it doesn't meet all of your expectations than We'll take it back for a full refund (less return shipping).
Another one answer a question from SUNFISH: You're right the DR is pretty darn close in design to the SS (we've made some improvements including more HP and others already discussed) -- but we took the "if it ain't broke don't fix it" approach. Paul, and his father before him, build an awesome machine and it's design has proven extremely durable. Why change that?
What we've set out to do is make these machines more broadly available, at a reasonable Price and backed-up by exceptional customer service.
One more please:
There have been a lot of good questions about the DR Rapid Fire. Let me answer some of them directly:
Why the log stabilizers? Two reasons: #1 it’s a voluntary industry standard that all logs must be “self stabilizing” on the splitting beam. #2 In a head-to-head comparison our testers preferred to use the machine with the stabilizing bars.
Does the DR auto-cycle? The cam assembly on the DR is spring loaded. Once your hand is removed from the lever it automatically retracts to the neutral position – about 1 second into the splitting cycle! This is also an industry standard that requires the activating lever travel in the same direction as the RAM.
Is it a 1-Year or 6-Month Hands on Trial? We’re so confident in the DR Rapid Fire that if your not 100% satisfied then we’ll take it back – no questions asked – anytime in the first full year that you own the machine (less return shipping).
Does the DR have a clutch? Yes, we use a Noram centrifugal clutch.
Why does the DR only have bearings on 1 side when the Super Split has them on both sides? The DR and Super Split have 2 bearings, 1 on each side of the beam.
More generally, I’d like to acknowledge that the Super Split is an exceptionally well-built machine and I wouldn’t hesitate to recommend it to anyone. At the same time, we’re proud of the machine we’ve built here in Vermont. Enough so that we’re offering a free extended warranty – A FULL 3-YEARS – even in commercial use!
I own and use other DR Power Products. I have always been extremely pleased. Their Customer Service doesn't have to take a back seat to anyone. Parts you need a delivered quickly. They have a network of Dealer Authorized Repair Centers where you can have your machine fixed. Kinetic Splitters are so simple you probably can do almost everything yourself.
I have read that the FlyWheels are from China but as far as I can find out that is all. Except the Subuaru Engine.
KiwiBro
Mill 'em, nails be damned.
Has anyone expressed an issue with excessive shaking resulting from poorly balanced flywheels? I ask because it's a PITA for quite a few SpeedPro owners. It may just be SP have sold way more than DR, but it might also be b/c DR QC better than SP before delivering to the customer.
Sorry I didn't read all of these threads so this might have been asked. correct me if I an wrong but didn't wood wolf come out with the rack & pinion spliter first? I seen a old pitcher of one I thought it was a wood wolf.
now here is a little more on dr. I have the paper hear!
Intell nov 30 if you order a dr you will get it for 2295 or 2459 with elect. start. 3 year warranty & a 1 year hands on trial warranty. If you don't like it in a year send it back.
A warranty like that is heard to beat! Just my 2 cents!
now here is a little more on dr. I have the paper hear!
Intell nov 30 if you order a dr you will get it for 2295 or 2459 with elect. start. 3 year warranty & a 1 year hands on trial warranty. If you don't like it in a year send it back.
A warranty like that is heard to beat! Just my 2 cents!
