glut of returned saws after Irene

[GM_DaddyMac]

I think that most of the saws returned after a big storm are bought with the intention that the saw is going to be returned when it is no longer needed. I don't think it is a case of buying the wrong saw at all. It's a case of using the saw at the expense of the retailer and vender. Just another form of stealing.

That about nets it out.


I think most electronics retailers are on to the Super Bowl, March Madness trick in that the return policies are very restrictive to prevent the d-bags of the world to score a 55" plasma for the weekend and return it. Namely you can get store credit but not your money -- provided there is no manufacturers defect with the product.

 

[TK]

There is absolutely NO difference. The store cannot sell the item as new - they take the loss all because YOU didn't do your homework

YOU made the mistake in buying the wrong product in the first place. Why should the store absorb the loss (oh yeah, they pass it on in price markups, so actually I wind up paying for it), all because you made a mistake!

PERSONAL ACCOUNTABILITY - an endangered species in this country.

Wakey wakey - the stores set the rules. They are using the people like you to pay for their generous return policies uttahere2: It is actually more your fault than anything. You pay the price and keep the product, you pay for the return policy. I blame you for shopping at the box store :msp_thumbsup:

 

[Guido Salvage]

Now,now Guido. Dont try and flip what I said. You know what im yalkin about. Its only fair to try and assess a persons needs before selling him or her something they really dont need. But again, according to you "screw em if they dont research it, burn that azz up" Man, Guido, your a stand up guy.
Oh....and now these salesmen suck huh? Yup! Thats the problem. Dadgummit, I should of thought of that! Man, I tell ya the salesman I deal with are pretty danged good. I wont mention names. But on the other hand, sales people at the big box stores could do better i would imagine. Just sayin Guido, there can be "wrongs" from both sides- the store and the customer. IMHO, it boils down to morals and store policies.....

So you are saying that if a person comes into a business establishment and selects a product for purchase you should not sell it to them before conducting an extensive interview to see if really meets their needs? I would contend that a consumer probably has a better idea of the type of work a product will be utilized for than a salesman in a store does.

If you are going to a big box retailer expecting to receive dedicated, experienced, hands on sales support you are living in a dream world. People shop big box retailers for a reason, they are looking for a certain price point or convenience. Ever tried to get a chain from your local saw shop at 11:00 at night or on a Sunday?

Did you ever consider that many sales people are on commission that is based on a volume of sales? So when a salesman suggests a model upgrade that costs more money, whose best interests does he have at heart?

I believe when a natural disaster like a hurricane is declared the store can wright off a certain amount of loss and have a certain time limit to declare said loss and is reimbursed a portion of the loss.

I think you are confused. If the store suffered damage as a result of a natural disaster (i.e. a tornado took off the roof and the stock became rain logged) then they would suffer a loss. However, most businesses have insurance to cover items such as physical damage, inventory loss and business interruption. The dollar amount of any loss would be net of any insurance reimbursement that they would receive.

A write-off is a charge on the books against income and acts to reduce revenues. Other than the aforementioned insurance coverage, I am not aware of anyone that would be reimbursing them for a sustained loss and certainly returns are not covered under a general insurance policy (though they could be under a warranty policy).

 

[MacLaren]

Guido.....

Your too funny, and really not worth the effort to boot. Take it however you like.

 

[dswensen]

Wakey wakey - the stores set the rules. They are using the people like you to pay for their generous return policies uttahere2: It is actually more your fault than anything. You pay the price and keep the product, you pay for the return policy. I blame you for shopping at the box store :msp_thumbsup:

That's the most ridiculous logic I have ever heard/read. I'm gonna guess that the same people who are advocating for taking something back because they didn't LIKE it would send back a restraunt order for the same reason. YOU ordered it - deal with your choice. Good Lord, why is it that some people always want to blame their bad judgement on ANYBODY else.

That said, I CERTAINLY understand a return for a defect, or for not working as advertised. In either of these cases, it's shame on the supplier/retailer.

 

[TK]

That's the most ridiculous logic I have ever heard/read. I'm gonna guess that the same people who are advocating for taking something back that they didn't LIKE it would send back a restraunt order for the same reason. YOU ordered it - deal with your choice. Good Lord, why is it that some people always want to blame their bad judgement on ANYBODY else.

That said, I CERTAINLY understand a return for a defect, or for not working as advertised. In either of these cases, it's shame on the supplier/retailer.

It's the truth. Sucks, don't it?????

I never said it was the right thing to do, use the tool and bring it back. That's downright dirty. But look at society today. Homeboy lives in the burbs. Tree or part of a tree comes down in the yard. Hire someone to take care of it, pay out the patoot to have it done. Go buy a saw, do the work, and return it. Hmmmm, a little gas and oil and I'm out of this for no cost. That way I can get back to watching Jersey Shore with some cash in my pocket. But hey, it's all good because it's THE RETURN POLICY.

I don't disagree with you that it's just a dirty deed, personally. But it's the way it is.

 

[xjma]

Haven't noticed returned saws, yet, but there have been a ton of returned generators at the HD up the street from work! When the power was out people would do anything to get one, I heard a story of people taking them right off the truck and over to the outdoor register. I know a company that wanted some generators the week before the storm hit (larger, commercial type), they wanted to buy or rent, whatever they could, no luck, nothing anywhere in New England or upstate NY area!! And now everyone got some use out of the generators and returned them!!

And then they complain that that awesome little hardware store downtown that had EVERYTHING crammed into the narrow little isles, and a person that could tell you what you needed and how to do the job, is no longer open for business.

 

[VA-Sawyer]

Ya, but the problem with the awesome hardware store down the street was, "he wouldn't let you return it after using it", so that is why the box stores were able to shove him out of business to begin with. Folks want everything fo nothing! It's the new American Way.

 

[MacLaren]

Ya, but the problem with the awesome hardware store down the street was, "he wouldn't let you return it after using it", so that is why the box stores were able to shove him out of business to begin with. Folks want everything fo nothing! It's the new American Way.

I dont feel that everyone wants everything for nothin.....I surely dont feel its the new American way either. It just is what it is IMHO. Big stores can buy so much,much more and therefor get it cheaper than what the little man can. But at the awesome little man dealer i would imagine returns were not many as the customer service was beyond excellent. Atleast that has been my experience. I know my Stihl dealer and trust him very much. Same with my hometown local hardware. Whenever I have had to ask for advice on what tool, paint- heck whatever the advice given has been spot on! Just like TK, Bob, Tommy Hall and many other dealers would be like as well. They know what the heck thye are talking about and are honest men. In other words I never have had to do homework for anything I wanted to buy from them. But thats not to say I havent researched stuff before. Main thing is IMO, use common sense. If your buying a car or dealing with a huge box store then research stuff if ya want. But its very hard for me to understand why people complain about returns when its the store itself that sets its own policies. Thats all.

 

[Guido Salvage]

Big stores can buy so much,much more and therefor get it cheaper than what the little man can.

Actually if you want to sell your merchandise at Wal-Mart THEY will tell you how much they will pay you for it. I think someone mentioned earlier in this thread about Snapper, they thought their brand image was of a higher quality than Wal-Mart pricing and told them to take a hike.

But at the awesome little man dealer i would imagine returns were not many as the customer service was beyond excellent. Atleast that has been my experience.

It is a fallacy to think all small businesses are customer oriented or provide good service. If that was the case, we would not see the failure rate for small businesses that we do.

In other words I never have had to do homework for anything I wanted to buy from them. But thats not to say I havent researched stuff before. Main thing is IMO, use common sense.

If you fail to do your homework and have no idea of what you want or need when you enter the store, you are placing yourself at the mercy of the sales person. If they are are honest and knowledgeable you may get what you need, if not, you may simply get a product they want gone or that yields the greatest sales commission.

It is naive to think that anyone other than yourself operates with your best interest in mind.

 

[MacLaren]

Actually if you want to sell your merchandise at Wal-Mart THEY will tell you how much they will pay you for it. I think someone mentioned earlier in this thread about Snapper, they thought their brand image was of a higher quality than Wal-Mart pricing and told them to take a hike.



It is a fallacy to think all small businesses are customer oriented or provide good service. If that was the case, we would not see the failure rate for small businesses that we do.



If you fail to do your homework and have no idea of what you want or need when you enter the store, you are placing yourself at the mercy of the sales person. If they are are honest and knowledgeable you may get what you need, if not, you may simply get a product they want gone or that yields the greatest sales commission.

It is naive to think that anyone other than yourself operates with your best interest in mind.

Your being silly Guido, and just flat out wrong to boot. In my hometown, I TRUST those ole boys to tell me right, and they always do. I grew up with them. Secondly, Wal Mart has put many,many businesses out of business by just as i described. They buy more and cheaper therefor the little man just cannot compete. And yes, i understand about Snapper. I will take the little man and trust him over big business any day of the week. And if that is being naivethen so be it. Its actually a faliacy to think that small business isnt customer oriented.
Guido, ole buddy I guess we shall just have to agree to disagree....

 

[Guido Salvage]

Your being silly Guido, and just flat out wrong to boot. In my hometown, I TRUST those ole boys to tell me right, and they always do. I grew up with them. Secondly, Wal Mart has put many,many businesses out of business by just as i described. They buy more and cheaper therefor the little man just cannot compete. And yes, i understand about Snapper. I will take the little man and trust him over big business any day of the week. And if that is being naivethen so be it. Its actually a faliacy to think that small business isnt customer oriented.
Guido, ole buddy I guess we shall just have to agree to disagree....

I am wrong??? While you may still be living in Mayberry, the rest of the world has changed around you. I applaud you for trusting those in your isolated community, but the real world now operates on a different set of values. Perhaps I am more self reliant or confident than you are which allows me to make informed choices on my own without having someone else do it for me. We called it growing up.

Did Wal-Mart really put anyone out of business? Certainly that is the claim that is widely used, but what empirical data do you have to support this statement? There can be many factors that contribute to the failure of a business, many of which have no origin with any big box retailer. Yes, perhaps a small store can't compete on price but maybe they can on product knowledge, convenience, service, product selection or brand. Many people don't want the cheapest item and there are many retailers happy to oblige.

Since I doubt that you are a trained economist and have provided no supporting evidence other than your own anecdotal observations, why is your position any better than mine? You can call me "silly" all day long, but without any evidence behind your words they are simply your opinion and every one has one.

 

[MacLaren]

I am wrong??? While you may still be living in Mayberry, the rest of the world has changed around you. I applaud you for trusting those in your isolated community, but the real world now operates on a different set of values. Perhaps I am more self reliant or confident than you are which allows me to make informed choices on my own without having someone else do it for me. We called it growing up.

Did Wal-Mart really put anyone out of business? Certainly that is the claim that is widely used, but what empirical data do you have to support this statement? There can be many factors that contribute to the failure of a business, many of which have no origin with any big box retailer. Yes, perhaps a small store can't compete on price but maybe they can on product knowledge, convenience, service, product selection or brand. Many people don't want the cheapest item and there are many retailers happy to oblige.

Since I doubt that you are a trained economist and have provided no supporting evidence other than your own anecdotal observations, why is your position any better than mine? You can call me "silly" all say long, but without any evidence behind your words they are simply your opinion and every one has one.

Now now guido, dont get your blood pressure up.....

 

[D&B Mack]

My 2 cents:

1. A big box store should be ready to take returns since there is no ability to actually try something hands on. This is the trade-off they make themselves with lack of customer support and salesmen. I agree, buying a saw to use for an emergency and returning it when done is just like stealing, but yet the customers are playing by the rules.

2. My wife has expressed her opinion on this topic. Many of her clothing stores now limit the number of returns a customer can make in one year. As you know, it is very common for a woman to buy a nice dress for a special occassion, leave the tags on, and return it following the one night out. However, for my wife, it has become a hassle. She used to buy the clothes and take them home to try them on, if they didn't fit, she would exchange for the correct size. This makes it easier than going in and out of the changing room with our daughter tagging along. Now that our daughter is older, she says it's not as much an issue anymore, but when we have an infant again, I am sure it will be. I wouldn't be suprised if Hardware stores began to enact a similar policy, or at least, a hefty re-stocking fee.

3. Our saw shop will allow returns on any saw (or other item) within one week as long as you upsize and pay the difference. So if you buy a saw and it is "not enough" for you, you can get what fits. This goes for any Stihl, Husky or Echo equipment. But they also let you try the saw out on some real wood, so you will pretty much know what you are getting.

I think big boxes are going to start to dwindle over the next decade. All of their "issues" are beginning to wear on the people who really spend the money at these places. I bet in the near future, we will begin to see local places starting to pop up more and more. It may not be in the form of "John Doe's Hardware", but more places like ACE and True Value for example; franchised with the bulk purchasing power, but family operated. It has already started in the grocery market chain around here, big stores are consolidating and the smaller regional places are rising.

On a side note, I do like our Sears Hardware(s). Not the stores in the malls, just the straight hardware stores. We have very few left around here, but I have found they tend to hire people that have some clue (many are former hardware store owners).

 

[Guido Salvage]

I think big boxes are going to start to dwindle over the next decade. All of their "issues" are beginning to wear on the people who really spend the money at these places.

Being a "big box store" is no guarantee of success just the same as owning a small business does not mean you will fail. Think about G.C. Murphy, Woolworth's, Woolco, W.T. Grant's, Montgomery Ward, Bradlees, Heck's, Dart Drug, Trak Auto, Hill's, Ames, Zayre's, McCrory's, Best Products, Jefferson Ward, Caldor, etc., etc.

Somehow I forgot Circuit City, the other Richmond based retailer that failed (in addition to Best Products) as well as Jamesway.

 

[russhd1997]

Being a "big box store" is no guarantee of success just the same as owning a small business does not mean you will fail. Think about G.C. Murphy, Woolworth's, Woolco, W.T. Grant's, Montgomery Ward, Bradlees, Heck's, Dart Drug, Trak Auto, Hill's, Ames, Zayre's, McCrory's, Best Products, Jefferson Ward, Caldor, etc., etc.

And Lowes is in the process of closing 20 stores right now. Who will be next? Tractor Supply, Home Depot?

 

[Guido Salvage]

And Lowes is in the process of closing 20 stores right now. Who will be next? Tractor Supply, Home Depot?

I think that Barnes and Noble, Rite Aid and Radio Shack are far better candidates for bankruptcy than these two. Actually, I think that Sears has a better chance of bankruptcy than any of the three you mentioned.

 

[s219]

Being a "big box store" is no guarantee of success just the same as owning a small business does not mean you will fail. Think about G.C. Murphy, Woolworth's, Woolco, W.T. Grant's, Montgomery Ward, Bradlees, Heck's, Dart Drug, Trak Auto, Hill's, Ames, Zayre's, McCrory's, Best Products, Jefferson Ward, Caldor, etc., etc.

Boy, those names bring back many memories -- those were all booming businesses when I was a kid, but I remember when Caldor, Ames, and Woolco all went out of business when I was in my teens.

 

[Guido Salvage]

Boy, those names bring back many memories -- those were all booming businesses when I was a kid, but I remember when Caldor, Ames, and Woolco all went out of business when I was in my teens.

You must have had a very lengthy teenage experience! Woolco closed its American stores in 1982, Caldor filed bankruptcy in 1995 and closed in 1999 while Ames filed bankruptcy twice (1990 and 2001) and closed in 2002.

I also realize that as the business faltered that all were closing non performing stores. I think the Woolco in Charlottesville closed in the summer of 1978 (it may have been 1979).

 

[powerking]

Does the store not have the responsibility to see that the customer atleast get good advice on what to buy. Maybee ask the poor fellow no matter how rich or poor what his needs are then act accordingly?. So Guido, you in essence would have no problem selling a 65 year old man a Husqvarna 395XP for a 20" tree that fell in his yard due to a hurricane? I really dont think any sponsor on AS would do that sir. In essence what you are suggesting is out right robbery. Am I correct?
I know what your saying. But the store IMHO has a responsibility as well.

I would have to say that most of these "hurricane buys" were made out of impulse by some people that don't know flat head from phillips! Most of these big box stores were deluged with people frantically thinking the world was going to end. Most of them bought generators too, and just locally a family almost died because the owner didn't know "you cant run a generator in a house"!!