glut of returned saws after Irene

[Somesawguy]

One of the problems with commission based sales is that a person will always steer a customer towards more than they need.

That being said, I think it's wrong to buy something, use it, and then return it for a full refund knowing that you didn't plan on keeping the item. The no-hassle returns are nice if you have a problem with something, and they aren't able to fix it. The big box stores would rather you return it, than them try to fix it. They don't really do repairs anyway.

Speaking of big box stores, they just suddenly closed the Lowes nearby.

 

[MacLaren]

One of the problems with commission based sales is that a person will always steer a customer towards more than they need.

That being said, I think it's wrong to buy something, use it, and then return it for a full refund knowing that you didn't plan on keeping the item. The no-hassle returns are nice if you have a problem with something, and they aren't able to fix it. The big box stores would rather you return it, than them try to fix it. They don't really do repairs anyway.

Speaking of big box stores, they just suddenly closed the Lowes nearby.

Seriously? You mean Lowes actually closed one of their stores? Wow.......

 

[Eccentric]

All of my first round of OPE and some of my current stuff when I bought my first house came from Sears's clearnace shelf. My old 42cc 18" Craftsman saw (a wild thing in all green) was $125, still using the leaf blower, the 21" push mower with the 6.5hp Honda engine and my McCulloh straight shaft trimmer came from TSC's returns shelf.

All the stuff is sold at a heavy discount and all my stuff came with full manufacturer's warranty. The Sears return shelf has always been very good to me over the years.

I agree its blatant abuse of the store's return policy...but despite that they're not following the intent of the policy, the customers ARE playing 100% by the rules.

When I worked for Sears Service in the '90s, a good portion of the equipment I repaired was what they called "store stock". Those were returns that we would fix and then send back to the store to be sold as refurbs. Much of this equipment would have nothing wrong with it. The real work was to go through the machine to try to find the mystery problem. The sales people would enter a 'trouble code' in the computer when taking the return, and the 'problem' would be noted on the tag on the machine when we got it.

Unfortunately, most of the sales people didn't know (or care to know) crap about equipment. Often they'd just use the "hard starting" code..............no matter what the real issue was (if there was in fact an issue). People would buy equipment, use it, then bring it right back because they didn't want to pay their CC bill. I'd say that at least 80% of the store stock equipment fell into this catagory. I bought lots of good equipment that was store stock (associate discount applied too).

The funniest example of the sales folks overuse of the "hard starting" code was a store stock chipper/shredder I worked on. It was one of the belt driven machines with a 6hp horrizontal shaft Tecumseh on it. The feed chute/handle angled over the engine towards the opperator (when standing at the rear of the machine, holding the transport handle). The engine was at about kneecap level, and partially obscured by the chute/handle unless you stooped to look closer. The tag had "hard starting" (NOT "will not start") on it. I pulled the rope to see if the machine had compression.............................and was greeted by a loud clanking noise and wetness on my pants leg. Stooped down to see the rod hanging out of a hole in the block. It'd flung oil on me when i pulled 'er through. Should have taken a closer look first. Was in a hurry. "Hard Starting" eh?:jester:

 

[o8f150]

i think i need to make a road trip to get a few deals

 

[bigredd]

Lowes and HD better wise up or they will soon find themselves following Sears that nearly went bankrupt with their former "Satisfaction Guaranteed" slogan. My mom use to be a manager at Sears and had some real tales of people bringing back decades old tools and merchandise to get a refund or new stuff at no cost.

 

[TK]

I dont totally agree with that. I see what you are saying, but its really a double edged sword as well. True, you dont get the customer service at Lowes, but someone like you would see that the customer got the right saw based upon what they told you they needed. Thats all.

Exactly, I try my hardest to get them what the need. Sometimes they still buy something too little or underpowered just because of the money, and that's another understandable decision. Money is tight. Period. When they come back to get the proper equipment they say "well I shoulda listened to you" - I'm not a jerk about it, I just try to continue to help them along their way. No one has tried to return anything to me yet, but I think they know better after what I go through to get them what they really need.

I don't change the way I deal with people or stores based on how deep their pockets are.

If it's a crappy thing to do, then it's a crappy thing to do...period.

Yes, I agree it's a crappy thing to do, personally. But hey, it's the box store mentality that they have created for themselves, on their own. They get what they deserve.

Does the store not have the responsibility to see that the customer atleast get good advice on what to buy. Maybee ask the poor fellow no matter how rich or poor what his needs are then act accordingly?. So Guido, you in essence would have no problem selling a 65 year old man a Husqvarna 395XP for a 20" tree that fell in his yard due to a hurricane? I really dont think any sponsor on AS would do that sir. In essence what you are suggesting is out right robbery. Am I correct?
I know what your saying. But the store IMHO has a responsibility as well.

Box stores have no responsibilities other than to make money.

Your right Jimmy. There are people out there that do it on purpose. I'm just sayin that there are people out there that depend on the salesman to lead them in the right direction. A person IMHO, shouldnt have to research anything, if they have a good store with honest salesmen.

If the customer is strictly depending on the salesman to decide the proper purchase, they went to the wrong store. Granted I understand some independant dealers will get the same bad rap. But I don't look at box stores as buildings full of advice, more like a DIYer warehouse. To me, a DIYer isn't someone who needs complete guidance, but rather a few pointers every once in a while.

One of the problems with commission based sales is that a person will always steer a customer towards more than they need.

That being said, I think it's wrong to buy something, use it, and then return it for a full refund knowing that you didn't plan on keeping the item. The no-hassle returns are nice if you have a problem with something, and they aren't able to fix it. The big box stores would rather you return it, than them try to fix it. They don't really do repairs anyway.

Speaking of big box stores, they just suddenly closed the Lowes nearby.

Suddenly is an understatement! Feel bad for the employees and their families. That is not a way any person should be treated.

 

[Jacob J.]

It's not just the box stores that people are doing this sort of thing at. A good friend of mine owns a ski shop and as a service to the local area he serves, he also has a very limited line of snow blowers. Last winter here was an unusually heavy snow season thanks to La Nina. Many people who bought snow blowers from him last fall tried to return them this spring after they were done. Luckily, printed in large text at the bottom of every receipt he issues, are the words "All OPE sales final." Skis and poles are one thing, a $600-1k snow blower is quite different.

 

[Somesawguy]

Seriously? You mean Lowes actually closed one of their stores? Wow.......

Yeah, it was very sudden as well. A friend of ours from church works there. I hope she can find something else.

Workers, Mayor React To Biddeford Lowes Closure - Project Economy News Story - WMTW Portland

 

[shelbythedog]

My background comes from corporate owned restaurants which tend to operate in a similar fashion to box stores when it comes to complaints/returns. I would agree fully that no one is to blame other than the corporation itself. My employer puts me in a position where I have to tolerate even the most frivolous complaints from customers or risk getting myself in trouble. I can gurantee that no employee at HD or Lowes would risk losing their job over something like a chainsaw return. Wouldn't even matter if the employee was following the rules and the customer was wrong, corporate would still side with the customer, stating that the employee had not taken the necessary steps to make the customer happy. Basically, the corporations have created a situation where the person who complains the loudest gets the most consideration. Myself, I like to sleep at night, and being ethical when buying/selling items goes a long way in helping the cause.

 

[Hank Chinaski]

When I worked for Sears Service in the '90s, a good portion of the equipment I repaired was what they called "store stock". Those were returns that we would fix and then send back to the store to be sold as refurbs. Much of this equipment would have nothing wrong with it. The real work was to go through the machine to try to find the mystery problem. The sales people would enter a 'trouble code' in the computer when taking the return, and the 'problem' would be noted on the tag on the machine when we got it.

Unfortunately, most of the sales people didn't know (or care to know) crap about equipment. Often they'd just use the "hard starting" code..............no matter what the real issue was (if there was in fact an issue). People would buy equipment, use it, then bring it right back because they didn't want to pay their CC bill. I'd say that at least 80% of the store stock equipment fell into this catagory. I bought lots of good equipment that was store stock (associate discount applied too).

The funniest example of the sales folks overuse of the "hard starting" code was a store stock chipper/shredder I worked on. It was one of the belt driven machines with a 6hp horrizontal shaft Tecumseh on it. The feed chute/handle angled over the engine towards the opperator (when standing at the rear of the machine, holding the transport handle). The engine was at about kneecap level, and partially obscured by the chute/handle unless you stooped to look closer. The tag had "hard starting" (NOT "will not start") on it. I pulled the rope to see if the machine had compression.............................and was greeted by a loud clanking noise and wetness on my pants leg. Stooped down to see the rod hanging out of a hole in the block. It'd flung oil on me when i pulled 'er through. Should have taken a closer look first. Was in a hurry. "Hard Starting" eh?:jester:

I bet it was pretty hard to start with the rod hanging out...

 

[brendog84cj8]

Seriously? You mean Lowes actually closed one of their stores? Wow.......

Maybe that is part of their business plan..... Every time Jimmy Johnson hits the wall a store closes.....haha.... I believe he hit the wall this weekend and ended up out of the race...

On a serious note that sucks for all the people who probably lost a job.

 

[Ambull]

Stealing from a store is wrong.

Buying an item and then returning it under the store's policy is not wrong.

Everything I have ever returned to HomeDepot, they ask one simple question. "Is the item good or defective?" That is it. They never ask if the item was misused or anything.

 

[Guido Salvage]

So Guido, you in essence would have no problem selling a 65 year old man a Husqvarna 395XP for a 20" tree that fell in his yard due to a hurricane?

So you are saying that you would not sell a saw to someone based on their age. What sort of B.S. policy is that. For all you know he could have run saws all his life or could have been specifically asked to buy it by someone else.

In case you have not noticed, some retail outlets seem to specialize in price (mostly, national "big box" stores) while others specialize in service (mostly local "mom and pop" operations). It is difficult to find those that do both well, so take your pick.

A person IMHO, shouldnt have to research anything, if they have a good store with honest salesmen.

I would rather know what my needs are and buy accordingly rather than have a salesman tell me and end up with the wrong product. Perhaps relying on a "salesman" that is why all these people brought their saws back.

Seriously? You mean Lowes actually closed one of their stores? Wow.......

The announced today they were closing 20 stores, 10 of them immediately, laying off 1950 employees.

Lowes and HD better wise up or they will soon find themselves following Sears that nearly went bankrupt with their former "Satisfaction Guaranteed" slogan. My mom use to be a manager at Sears and had some real tales of people bringing back decades old tools and merchandise to get a refund or new stuff at no cost.

Don't confuse the "lifetime" warranty that Sears had on Craftsman tools with gaming the system.

 

[justtools]

Menards Had the same problems with ope returns. They now have a new policy If Gas is put in the unit it cannot be returned. If it is defective. They will give you the location of the closest repair shop. It makes a few people angry but I can see why they do it. It is not fair to the store for someone to buy a saw. Cut up some trees with it and then return it. Every consumer who shops their pays for that abuse. Home depot and Lowes will likely follow the no return trend on OPE.

 

[SawTroll]

ALL SALES FINAL in my store year round. Every once in a while you get someone that says 'well you didn't tell me that', and I respond 'you didn't ask'. Goodbye!

That's how it should be - of course all sales are final, unless something else is stated by the seller, or agreed upon!

 

[MacLaren]

So you are saying that you would not sell a saw to someone based on their age. What sort of B.S. policy is that. For all you know he could have run saws all his life or could have been specifically asked to buy it by someone else.

In case you have not noticed, some retail outlets seem to specialize in price (mostly, national "big box" stores) while others specialize in service (mostly local "mom and pop" operations). It is difficult to find those that do both well, so take your pick.



I would rather know what my needs are and buy accordingly rather than have a salesman tell me and end up with the wrong product. Perhaps relying on a "salesman" that is why all these people brought their saws back.




The announced today they were closing 20 stores, 10 of them immediately, laying off 1950 employees.



Don't confuse the "lifetime" warranty that Sears had on Craftsman tools with gaming the system.

Now,now Guido. Dont try and flip what I said. You know what im yalkin about. Its only fair to try and assess a persons needs before selling him or her something they really dont need. But again, according to you "screw em if they dont research it, burn that azz up" Man, Guido, your a stand up guy.
Oh....and now these salesmen suck huh? Yup! Thats the problem. Dadgummit, I should of thought of that! Man, I tell ya the salesman I deal with are pretty danged good. I wont mention names. But on the other hand, sales people at the big box stores could do better i would imagine. Just sayin Guido, there can be "wrongs" from both sides- the store and the customer. IMHO, it boils down to morals and store policies.....

 

[zogger]

not just saws and not just hurricanes

I have spoken to two different BOXSTORE department heads about returned powertools, they have a HUGE problem with "recent arrivals" working in the various trades who buy a tool, wear it out, bring it back for a refund. If they don't get it, they go nuts at the counter and they threaten a racial discrimination lawsuit, so BOXSTORE caves.

Note, more than ten years old now story,this is anecdotal, can't prove it, could be BS, but what they told me off the record, and I have for sure seen some questionable returns before where the tool in question was obviously just clapped out.

Heard the same thing from my GF when she worked in a clothing store, right before some holiday or "dress up" day, they sell a lot of outfits, then after the holiday is over some huge percentage come back with stories like "wrong color, didn't fit" etc. Same sort of deal, the store caves or faces a discrimination lawsuit, which even to defend against, would cost them four figures easy just to save two or three figures.

 

[mt.stalker]

That's a big problem that our country faces now , peoples complete lack of morals and knowing right from wrong . Me me me , thats's all they think about , and how to get what they want for free . I personally know several people who have purchased big screen Tv's to watch the superbowl , then returned them . The same thing with camcorders and other expensive electronics . Buy them for a one time use , then return them . Then there's the people that buy an item , take out one of the components that they need (to replace one that they have ) and return the item and say it doesn't work . :msp_mad:

 

[nhlogga]

Does the store not have the responsibility to see that the customer atleast get good advice on what to buy. Maybee ask the poor fellow no matter how rich or poor what his needs are then act accordingly?. So Guido, you in essence would have no problem selling a 65 year old man a Husqvarna 395XP for a 20" tree that fell in his yard due to a hurricane? I really dont think any sponsor on AS would do that sir. In essence what you are suggesting is out right robbery. Am I correct?
I know what your saying. But the store IMHO has a responsibility as well.

9 times outta 10 the box stores dont have anyone smart enough to give that advice. I was at HD once fresh from work and covered in sawdust wearing my jred hat and suspenders. A customer was lookingat chainsaws and wasnt sure what to buy, saw me and asked my opinion. he wante something that would last many many years and what he wanted to spend. I sreferred him to the Stihl/Husky dealer 10min up the street.

 

[MacLaren]

9 times outta 10 the box stores dont have anyone smart enough to give that advice. I was at HD once fresh from work and covered in sawdust wearing my jred hat and suspenders. A customer was lookingat chainsaws and wasnt sure what to buy, saw me and asked my opinion. he wante something that would last many many years and what he wanted to spend. I sreferred him to the Stihl/Husky dealer 10min up the street.

I understand. Like I said before, the big box store salesmen could do better I would imagine. Most times, ya cant even find anyone to help ya in a big box store much less really know anything the products. But I also think thats part of the big box stroes problem as well, I mean it dosent seem they train their people very well.