Some good things about newer saws

[B_Turner]

I've been spending a bunch of time lately in a particular application that has me spending a couple hours at a session with a saw held in close to my chest.

This has reminded me about one aspect of the newer saws that I am starting to appreciate more - less fumes.

Mostly I have been using a 346 doing this work, and they are great to run. Very civilized and clean burning. (I also run a 339, and a bunch of small redmaxes).

Yesterday I spent a fair bit of time with a 7900 doing the same job (42 inch bar) and holy carp. I love those saws dearly, but having my face so close to the exhaust for so long had my eyes burning.

It made me really appreciate how clean my 346xp(s) burn, and look forward to that aspect even getting better in the newer strato saws.

I have high hopes for the Stihl 261, for example. And it will take all my stihl bars which will be nice as well....

Now if they can only get rid of the extra bulk on the new saws. The tech at Mdsns was telling me the trend is toward integrating the second air intake instead of having the near redundant second intake as is the most common strato setup now. Maybe that will allow the strato saws to be a bit narrower and lighter.

 

[Modifiedmark]

Did you ever get that long bar project for the 346 going?

If so what did you use and how did it work out?

 

[ticat928]

My 681 has very little fumes (no more than the 600 Echo which has limiters),

I can only think of 2-differences, my saw has the Walboro carb instead of the 7900's Zama carb, and I use Amsoil 100:1 oil at 75:1

Flat out I get some unburnt hydrocarbons (fumes), but with the power it has I find bigger chips and less fumes lugging it down a bit on 80-90% throttle.

I run 36" skip 8-pin in the cold weather; outside temps hardly ever above 20-degrees

It would probably run hot if I did this in the Summer (not recommended), by then I will be back to 7-pin running 100% throttle (recommended).

But hotter ambient temps should provide cleaner burn / less fumes, we will see. My 681 has a 135-hr CARB certification and no limiters

 

[Banshee]

My 681 has very little fumes (no more than the 600 Echo which has limiters),

I can only think of 2-differences, my saw has the Walboro carb instead of the 7900's Zama carb, and I use Amsoil 100:1 oil at 75:1

Flat out I get some unburnt hydrocarbons (fumes), but with the power it has I find bigger chips and less fumes lugging it down a bit on 80-90% throttle.

I run 36" skip 8-pin in the cold weather; outside temps hardly ever above 20-degrees

It would probably run hot if I did this in the Summer (not recommended), by then I will be back to 7-pin running 100% throttle (recommended).

But hotter ambient temps should provide cleaner burn / less fumes, we will see. My 681 has a 135-hr CARB certification and no limiters

Too bad your not closer me. I have a 7900 with a Walboro carb to be a good comparison to which one has less fumes is there is a differance.

 

[ticat928]

When the Mosquito's are out in full force I use up my old oil at 34:1 in the 3200 Mac, keeps them away

 

[Hddnis]

I really like the new cleaner burning OPE. My throat and nose like it a lot at the end of a day.

I have one old Echo brush cutter that smokes like Obama after a Republican victory. I use it to chase away hornets and wild dogs.



Mr. HE

 

[CentaurG2]

You would have a hard time convincing me either strato charging or 4-mix technology is a great step forward in fuel economy or emissions. I have a big stratocharged blower (redmax ebz8001) and that just plain drinks fuel. It will drain its 78oz tank in about an hour. My fs130 will drink its 18oz tank dry in about 18-20 min of brushcutting. Either, if used up against a building or in a blind alleyway will produce enough fumes to knock a buzzard off a manure truck. The companies say that stratos and 4mixers are producing less emissions and get better fuel mileage but I have yet to see it in any of my ”green” pieces of equipment.

 

[Hddnis]

Are they set too rich?

I know I can sure tell a difference, that is good enough for me.



Mr. HE

 

[CentaurG2]

I don’t think so. Plugs look great and neither has ever given me reason to play with the carb. Not trying to start a war on the green movement here but again I just do not see either the fuel savings or lower emission from the “greener” units. Do we even know how much more efficient a strato charged engine is over a comparable 2 stroke and how much “cleaner” it actually runs?? As of yet, I have not seen any data other than a summary of a study by Porsche on the br600 that was next to useless.

 

[ticat928]

You would have a hard time convincing me either strato charging or 4-mix technology is a great step forward in fuel economy or emissions. I have a big stratocharged blower (redmax ebz8001) and that just plain drinks fuel. It will drain its 78oz tank in about an hour. My fs130 will drink its 18oz tank dry in about 18-20 min of brushcutting. Either, if used up against a building or in a blind alleyway will produce enough fumes to knock a buzzard off a manure truck. The companies say that stratos and 4mixers are producing less emissions and get better fuel mileage but I have yet to see it in any of my ”green” pieces of equipment.

You need to try the Solo 471 KAT it is the cleanest engine (car, saw, trimmer, whatever) I have ever experienced

http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=123271 see post # 12

 

[CentaurG2]

Thanks for the info. I am not really looking to “go green” on any/all of my equipment. I run 3 cylinder diesel powered lawn mowers not cuz they are green but because they do the most amount of work in the least amount of time. Likewise, I prefer the highly pollutive fs250 trimmers. I like a 395xp or a dolmar7900 for the flush cut for the same reason. Less run time=fewer emissions. Sure I could make that flush with an ms441 and be all green and happy for the 3 hours it would take for that saw to get the job done but I am an environmentally conscious fellow. I will stick with the 395xp.

“It ain’t easy being green” Kermit the Frog

 

[Hddnis]

Going green has nothing to do with it for me.

My motivation is user comfort and saving money on fuel. I'm sure many of the claims made about burning cleaner is hype. You get that anytime there is a popular movement.

I took down some small cedars in a hedge row once between two houses. One side was buried in blackberry vines about twelve feet deep. It was a hot day and no wind at all. I was getting lightheaded from the exhaust as I got closer to the ground. That was the first time we used backpack blowers to create our own wind to make the job safer and more comfortable. I've used the blower trick many times in the years since because I hate choking on fumes.

Our newest hedge shears are cleaner for sure. I don't really know if they use less fuel, since I never measured it.



Mr. HE

 

[B_Turner]

Did you ever get that long bar project for the 346 going?

If so what did you use and how did it work out?

I bought up through 28 inch k095 bars, and had a custom 28 inch hardnose carving bar with a k095 mount made for me.

But I am still waiting for the echo branded oregon powermatch d176 bars to be made, I guess. I think I ordered 5 or 6 weeks ago, and I am told I will have to about that long again.

Hope I can get them to work on my 346, as I'm queued for a few of them both in 32 and 36.

Depending on how they work out, maybe another custom 44 ish long k095 bar or maybe pick up a 261 when they come out and use my exisiting long stihl bars.

Interestingly (to me) when I gave the guy the specs for the custom long carving bar k095 mount, it never occurred to me that it would come with through oiler holes. The outer "bar plate" on some of my smaller saws like my 339 are really short and don't cover the outside hole. Oil everywhere but on the chain. I plugged the outside hole up and it's working fine.

 

[B_Turner]

My 681 has very little fumes (no more than the 600 Echo which has limiters),

I can only think of 2-differences, my saw has the Walboro carb instead of the 7900's Zama carb, and I use Amsoil 100:1 oil at 75:1

This is a pretty restriced use of the saw I am referring to, and I never really notice the fumes from my 7900 when I am running it normally (once it's warmed up).

Reminds me of milling in terms of the steady exhaust in the face, but worse.

Ironically, my 395 and 3120s both run pretty clean under normal use even though they are old technology.

But the strato saws I've run seem extra clean running to me.

At some point maybe I'll post a pic or vid of the project. These days I am actually wearing one of those funky resp o rators which helps alot since the exhaust is always in front. But the 7900 had enough exhaust that my eyes were burning (as compared to my 346).

Part of the issue is that this operation is a lot of partial throttle, and saws like the 7900 don't burn clean getting on and off so much.

 

[ticat928]

Thanks for the info. I am not really looking to “go green” on any/all of my equipment. I run 3 cylinder diesel powered lawn mowers not cuz they are green but because they do the most amount of work in the least amount of time. Likewise, I prefer the highly pollutive fs250 trimmers. I like a 395xp or a dolmar7900 for the flush cut for the same reason. Less run time=fewer emissions. Sure I could make that flush with an ms441 and be all green and happy for the 3 hours it would take for that saw to get the job done but I am an environmentally conscious fellow. I will stick with the 395xp.

“It ain’t easy being green” Kermit the Frog

By using the "right" tool for the job "to get it done"
You are in effect greener (MS441 40% less pollution 100% more run time to get the job done) if my math is right.

The bonus toward the point being made in the original post, your eyes may not be watering for as long or lungs not consuming as much pollution in total (employing a more powerful tool like the 395xp).

My Efco MT8200 or Solo694 will easily cut through any log in the time I can hold my breath (I do not want to close my eyes holding on to 7HP though)

 

[B_Turner]

By using the "right" tool for the job "to get it done"
You are in effect greener (MS441 40% less pollution 100% more run time to get the job done) if my math is right.

The bonus toward the point being made in the original post, your eyes may not be watering for as long or lungs not consuming as much pollution in total (employing a more powerful tool like the 395xp).

My Efco MT8200 or Solo694 will easily cut through any log in the time I can hold my breath (I do not want to close my eyes holding on to 7HP though)

I hear what you are saying, and I wish I were strong enough and skilled enough to do the hollowing with one of my 3120s. In theory it could happen pretty fast with fewer emmisions.

 

[ticat928]

This is a pretty restriced use of the saw I am referring to, and I never really notice the fumes from my 7900 when I am running it normally (once it's warmed up).

Reminds me of milling in terms of the steady exhaust in the face, but worse.

Ironically, my 395 and 3120s both run pretty clean under normal use even though they are old technology.

But the strato saws I've run seem extra clean running to me.

At some point maybe I'll post a pic or vid of the project. These days I am actually wearing one of those funky resp o rators which helps alot since the exhaust is always in front. But the 7900 had enough exhaust that my eyes were burning (as compared to my 346).
Part of the issue is that this operation is a lot of partial throttle, and saws
like the 7900 don't burn clean getting on and off so much.

I posted some Dyno charts that indicated a 394xp was running much more efficiently than the 066 or 088 or any other saws over 6-hp

 

[teacherman]

I noticed a major difference in the fume level when I switched to Stihl Ultra synthetic oil. I used to hate the exhaust smell whenver I ran 2 stroke engines, now I hardly notice it. I have no strato saws, but I bet they do burn more completely. I have so many saws, it would be stupid to buy more just to have a cleaner burn.

 

[tdi-rick]

Also with a larger saw = more power = greater exhaust emission's and at a rough guess a 7900 would be about double that of a 346.

and as teacherman said, mix type can make a huge difference too.
I used to get quite queasy and off breathing the fumes from Castrol TTS but very little to no effect on me from the Motul 800 2T I currently use.

 

[Modifiedmark]

I bought up through 28 inch k095 bars, and had a custom 28 inch hardnose carving bar with a k095 mount made for me.

But I am still waiting for the echo branded oregon powermatch d176 bars to be made, I guess. I think I ordered 5 or 6 weeks ago, and I am told I will have to about that long again.

Hope I can get them to work on my 346, as I'm queued for a few of them both in 32 and 36.

Depending on how they work out, maybe another custom 44 ish long k095 bar or maybe pick up a 261 when they come out and use my exisiting long stihl bars.

Interestingly (to me) when I gave the guy the specs for the custom long carving bar k095 mount, it never occurred to me that it would come with through oiler holes. The outer "bar plate" on some of my smaller saws like my 339 are really short and don't cover the outside hole. Oil everywhere but on the chain. I plugged the outside hole up and it's working fine.

I can only guess where you ordered the Echo bar from. I have Husky parts backordered from November from the same place.

Yeah surprising on the oiler holes on the K095 bars. You could have just made a sheet metal bar plate for the outer side. In fact I hope the Echo bar don't have through oiler holes. It shouldnt, I have not seen a late model D176 bar that way for sometime. The later ones all seem to have holes only on 1 side.