M-Tronic - Avoid? Or Acquire?

[lone wolf]

When the new M tronic saws work as designed they are fine but when they act up you need dealer support. The good thing about the older carbed saws is you can fix them yourself with basic hand tools. If you have a good dealer close by that can get the Mtronic saws fixed and back out quickly it would not be so bad owning them. For my own use I will stay with carb saws, fuel economy does not amount to a hill of beans for me.

Yup!

 

[pioneerguy600]

Yup!

I know I am in a different category saw wise than most cause I have all the saw sizes covered in multiples, can choose from more than 50 running modern work saws and play with more than 50 oldies, they are all carb saws and I fix all my own stuff. Kind of set for life with all the saw stuff I own but never know, one day I might try an Mtronic , def don`t need one but...LOL

 

[lone wolf]

I know I am in a different category saw wise than most cause I have all the saw sizes covered in multiples, can choose from more than 50 running modern work saws and play with more than 50 oldies, they are all carb saws and I fix all my own stuff. Kind of set for life with all the saw stuff I own but never know, one day I might try an Mtronic , def don`t need one but...LOL

Get a little 241 C and save your lower back.

 

[pioneerguy600]

Get a little 241 C and save your lower back.

I cut frequently with a guy that runs one, its a fine saw and has been very dependable so far. I have light weight saws but lift and move objects on a daily basis that weigh 60 lbs or more, my portable tool boxes and sliding miter saws bolted to their stands for example. On the weekends I wrestle 200 - 300 lb rocks into the backhoe loader bucket so a 12 lb chainsaw feels like a feather for now.

 

[pioneerguy600]

You guys make m-tronic and auto-tune sound like some type of black magic, while you use a computer controlled truck or car, personal computer, calculator or cell phone daily. All have been out for years and work well.

Until they don`t, then its a trip to a dealer with the right equipment to see what needs replacing, or just replace the whole saw when the bill runs up.

 

[lone wolf]

I cut frequently with a guy that runs one, its a fine saw and has been very dependable so far. I have light weight saws but lift and move objects on a daily basis that weigh 60 lbs or more, my portable tool boxes and sliding miter saws bolted to their stands for example. On the weekends I wrestle 200 - 300 lb rocks into the backhoe loader bucket so a 12 lb chainsaw feels like a feather for now.

Fortunate for you, most people in the Tree or log business has bad lower backs.

 

[farmer steve]

I cut frequently with a guy that runs one, its a fine saw and has been very dependable so far. I have light weight saws but lift and move objects on a daily basis that weigh 60 lbs or more, my portable tool boxes and sliding miter saws bolted to their stands for example. On the weekends I wrestle 200 - 300 lb rocks into the backhoe loader bucket so a 12 lb chainsaw feels like a feather for now.

I thought that guy ran a ryobi.

 

[lone wolf]

Until they don`t, then its a trip to a dealer with the right equipment to see what needs replacing, or just replace the whole saw when the bill runs up.

But 2 of them then parts can be swapped to self trouble shoot.

 

[lone wolf]

I cut frequently with a guy that runs one, its a fine saw and has been very dependable so far. I have light weight saws but lift and move objects on a daily basis that weigh 60 lbs or more, my portable tool boxes and sliding miter saws bolted to their stands for example. On the weekends I wrestle 200 - 300 lb rocks into the backhoe loader bucket so a 12 lb chainsaw feels like a feather for now.

 

[pioneerguy600]

I watched Eddie set the new world record in 2016 of 1102 lbs deadlift, that night was fantastic!

 

[Mad Professor]

Levi, I have worked at a Stihl dealership for over 40 yrs. I'm the saw mechanic. All the qualifications.
I see hundreds of saws a year. Not just one I own. When the M-Tronic came out, there were a few problems.
Those have been fixed. The only problem I see are solenoids. Mostly because a "Pro" does -0- to the saw except ***** and whine like a schoolgirl. Solenoid problems show mostly on a MS201T. But that saw is used the most, by a great margin, in my area. Whats the symptom? Wont run on start and wont idle. All M-Tronics STILL have carbs. They aren't as mysterious as some of these guys are making them.
But the dealer network for outdoor power equipment is collapsing at a alarming rate. Majority in the industry are incompetent idiots. The dealer you choose is more important than the product.
Listening to some of these responses..... we'd still be using candles and chitting in a hole.
Any modern saw has electronics on it.

And soon there will be no need for mechanics. The salesman will plug the saw into a $$$ device and simply say it's not worth fixing, but we'll sell you a new one.

BTW, I have lots of old stuff that still run point ignitions quite well, some are ~80 years old and still running on a farm fine. A 6V +ground ignition on my 9N ford starts well at below zero weather. I can fix most anything with the tools in it's lunchbox size toolbox.

When car companies started to put useless crap on, I started acquiring GMs with the 1-wire distributor. I keep a spare behind the seat/in trunk. If it craps out I switch it. No emmission wires/hoses. Simple carb and mech fuel pump, on the block, NOT in the gas tank.

One of those GMs is a full size PU, it gets ~21-22 mpg unloaded, how are the new ones doing?

Saws, before limiter caps for me.

 

[catbuster]

Everything has a failure mode.

I’ve been running 441s for years. Lots of them. Since they came on the scene in 2008 or so. The M-Tronic system has only failed due to smokey air, and it didn’t cause the saw to fail, it just didn’t run correctly. I’ve seen a lot of standard carbureted saws fail due to operator error.

If you have a saw that gets used my multiple people, and may not get regular service outside of the air filter being cleaned/under the chain cover/sharpening the chain but those multiple operators can’t tune to save their lives, an M-Tronic machine, in my case the 441s, are a great option.

They’re the way things are going now. You can get on board or be left behind. Eventually parts will go away and everyone will end up with current technology. I know, I’m probably the hardest guy ragging on the new 462, but I’ll probably end up with one at some point.

 

[stihl86]

And soon there will be no need for mechanics. The salesman will plug the saw into a $$$ device and simply say it's not worth fixing, but we'll sell you a new one.

BTW, I have lots of old stuff that still run point ignitions quite well, some are ~80 years old and still running on a farm fine. A 6V +ground ignition on my 9N ford starts well at below zero weather. I can fix most anything with the tools in it's lunchbox size toolbox.

When car companies started to put useless crap on, I started acquiring GMs with the 1-wire distributor. I keep a spare behind the seat/in trunk. If it craps out I switch it. No emmission wires/hoses. Simple carb and mech fuel pump, on the block, NOT in the gas tank.

One of those GMs is a full size PU, it gets ~21-22 mpg unloaded, how are the new ones doing?

Saws, before limiter caps for me.

There will always be a need for mechanics/technicians. Now a "salesman" ............, haven't found a use for them yet.
Just how often do you need to change distributors?????? On the road yet.
Maybe stop with the GM turdmobiles and buy a car made in America. Like Toyota, Honda or Hyundai.

 

[chipper1]

Levi, I have worked at a Stihl dealership for over 40 yrs. I'm the saw mechanic. All the qualifications.
I see hundreds of saws a year. Not just one I own. When the M-Tronic came out, there were a few problems.
Those have been fixed. The only problem I see are solenoids. Mostly because a "Pro" does -0- to the saw except ***** and whine like a schoolgirl. Solenoid problems show mostly on a MS201T. But that saw is used the most, by a great margin, in my area. Whats the symptom? Wont run on start and wont idle. All M-Tronics STILL have carbs. They aren't as mysterious as some of these guys are making them.
But the dealer network for outdoor power equipment is collapsing at a alarming rate. Majority in the industry are incompetent idiots. The dealer you choose is more important than the product.
Listening to some of these responses..... we'd still be using candles and chitting in a hole.
Any modern saw has electronics on it.

Are you saying that the solenoid problem is caused by the operator/lack of maintenance.

Seems you are just like so many dealers, downplaying the negative experiences so many have had with mtronic/autotune saws. It's important to remember that once someone has a bad taste in their mouth because they have had real issues that they want to stick with what they know will work and what they can fix(because they may only own one saw). Why do you thing stihl manufactures the standard carb saws still, I believe it's because they recognize that and want to be sure they don't loose that segment of the market, good for stihl(I prefer husky though if it's above 40cc). Also there are conditions that they still haven't figured out how to make the mtronic/autotune work, that's why many guys who work in smoky conditions still use a standard carb saw.
It's important to remember that not everything works for everyone even if it may work for you.
Stihl did good listening to their customers and holding out on 100% mtronic, listening to a persons request and hearing who they are/what they prefer is one of the keys to making a sale where both the seller and the buyer are pleased.
I'm hoping the 500i does good myself, I'm not afraid of change, but I don't want to be the beta tester and have to pay full price, I'll wait a bit. Similarly many want to stay away from the mtronic, and I don't blame them one bit. As I said earlier the old tech always seems to rescue the new tech.

 

[chipper1]

Everything has a failure mode.

I’ve been running 441s for years. Lots of them. Since they came on the scene in 2008 or so. The M-Tronic system has only failed due to smokey air, and it didn’t cause the saw to fail, it just didn’t run correctly. I’ve seen a lot of standard carbureted saws fail due to operator error.

If you have a saw that gets used my multiple people, and may not get regular service outside of the air filter being cleaned/under the chain cover/sharpening the chain but those multiple operators can’t tune to save their lives, an M-Tronic machine, in my case the 441s, are a great option.

They’re the way things are going now. You can get on board or be left behind. Eventually parts will go away and everyone will end up with current technology. I know, I’m probably the hardest guy ragging on the new 462, but I’ll probably end up with one at some point.

441 is one of the smoothest saws out there, other than my 576 .
I've had a few, both mtronic and non. Guys always talked about how the 461 has more power, but as you said that's great if the operator knows how to tune it and tunes it for each situation so he can get the full power out of it, other than that the 441 will run right with a 461 and get great fuel economy doing it, guys don't like it, but that's just how it is.
The 462 is crazy light, will it hold up is the question, I'd rather take my chances with a 572 myself, little heavy, but man they feel good cutting and they are agile for a saw that weighs a good bit.

 

[Cliff R]

I asked the same question to the owner of the company who just logged a new piece of property I purchased in April. He's been at this deal for quite a while and pretty much exclusively he uses Stihl MS 660's. Only having one model saw keeps things pretty simple for him, but he did have two of them that were M-Tronic (MS-661 ?).

I asked and he gave me a very educated and honest opinion. One of them has been pretty good and after he got thru the learning curve of using it no major issues. The second one he purchased at the same time has been nothing but a huge PITA. It doesn't do anything right and he lost count how many times he dropped it off at the dealer and they can't do squat for it. He swears it's possessed!

The dealer is an Amish shop, so not sure how that plays into recipe for success or not? In any case he isn't even overly happy with the one that doesn't give troubles other than power. He says that he has to start them up and let them "warm-up", and in really cold weather he leaves them run or they can be difficult to re-start.

Although he is not much of a mechanic and admits it, he's good enough to put P/C's on his 660's and various other repairs if/when needed. He told me he has a shed full of parts and parts saws, almost all are 660's.

He also just started dabbling with the Farmer Tec 660 clones and actually had one with him the last day he worked on my property. He said the P/C's are just so-so but for the most part all the parts interchange with the Stihl which makes that deal pretty convenient and attractive...........Cliff

 

[Levi of the North]

@stihl86 Ironically I'm a salesman! (it's a profession full of hacks, I don't blame you)

Really appreciate all the insight so far. Currently I'm leaning away from the M-Tronic based on what I've heard to date, but I'd like to hear more.
Sounds like the 461 has a good reputation among folks here. Any particularly great saws I should look for as a smaller/lighter companion?

 

[chipper1]

@stihl86 Ironically I'm a salesman! (it's a profession full of hacks, I don't blame you)

Really appreciate all the insight so far. Currently I'm leaning away from the M-Tronic based on what I've heard to date, but I'd like to hear more.
Sounds like the 461 has a good reputation among folks here. Any particularly great saws I should look for as a smaller/lighter companion?

As far as a pro saw that's non-mtronic the 261 is the only 50cc option available that I'm aware of(I like a nice 50/70 two saw combo myself), that is unless you decide to jump outside the box and consider saws other than stihls .
As I said before I'm not opposed to the mtronic saws, I just don't think they are the best option for everyone considering the potential issues/having to get dealer support. Going based on your statement that you generally prefer your equipment to be low-tech and easy to fix, the mtronic saws are not low tech, as far as easy to fix you'd have to cross that road if you get there. It's nice that many on the forums can help out, but the stihl info is the hardest to get your hands on as stihl doesn't release it all to the public.

 

[Mad Professor]

There will always be a need for mechanics/technicians. Now a "salesman" ............, haven't found a use for them yet.
Just how often do you need to change distributors?????? On the road yet.
Maybe stop with the GM turdmobiles and buy a car made in America. Like Toyota, Honda or Hyundai.

There are quite a few stihl places that only have salesmen, rather than tech/mechs nearby. Tech/Mech is being downgraded to a "burger flipper" status. Soon they will be like a supermarket, where you click what is wrong and they sell you a part, or a new saw.

Glad you got 40 years in as the future is bleak.

My GMs were made in USA , as were my Willys/Jeeps, Ford tractors. I can fix them all with my tool box. I have a stash of service parts, from when USA made, not Mexico or Chinesium.

My saws? I have gasket sets, carb kits, some NOS P/C assys, rubber stuff. I'll be dead before I don't have a little/big saw I can't fix by me.

P.S. is your son looking into being a saw mech? McDs might be better

 

[holeycow]

Ask about non-moronic at the corporate level.

Inquire to the members who have been exporting brand-new old models. Check out the trading post. “Chainsaws”. You’ll have to dig around a bit..