Tongue and groove feeling technique

[chuckwood]

Any comments on this? First time I've heard about it and I'm about to try it. It's supposed to be useful on smaller trees where you really don't have that much room to use felling wedges. I'm clearing out some land that has a lot of smaller sized trees, and I need to put them down very precisely to avoid hanging them up in other trees.

 

[2dogs]

This needs to be in the chainsaw forum. We have all see this before from Ekka. Might be just the thing for palms but not for trees. It pays to be flexible and always learning so here is a trick for you...search.

 

[bitzer]

I used to play around with that. Its very easy to cut one or the other side off or the pressure from the wedge breaks one side off. Thats when the tree goes sideways. The right way to tip small diameter stems: backcut first, wedge, face, then wedge til it tips. Much easier, faster, and safer.

 

[northmanlogging]

Used it a hand full of times, usually when a little stem sits back, Bitz and 2dogs are right though its not real safe, better to back cut first, start a wedge, then face it. Just remember to aim with the back cut and take your time with the face. And leave a little more hold wood than normal.

 

[Gologit]

I tried it also, just out of curiosity. It's very unforgiving of error and doesn't always give reliable results. I think I'll use some of the other tricks in the bag.

 

[madhatte]

I pushed a 15" or so cottonwood 180 degrees against its lean with this method once... that was a lot of pounding on the wedge. It did work, and I got it over without ropes or machinery, but it sure as hell wasn't easy. As noted above, this is another trick in the bag, but certainly not a universal one.

 

[rwoods]

As 2dogs referenced this cut has been discussed elsewhere and may have an application to palm trees. It would be wise to listen to the folks above. Small trees don't give you much room for error and this cut is quite precise. BTW I hate falling plate size trees - many seem to be more dangerous than larger trees to this firewood hack. Ron

 

[northmanlogging]

Modified slightly it can help on bigger stems if your a little slow with the wedges and she sits back you ya, course it requires having another saw/bar+chain to make the necessary plunge for a wedge to fit it, and it is almost guaranteed to smash the rails closed on your bar.

I've only seen this done of course... it would never happen to me, cause I'm like a wanna be pro and stuff...

 

[chuckwood]

As 2dogs referenced this cut has been discussed elsewhere and may have an application to palm trees. It would be wise to listen to the folks above. Small trees don't give you much room for error and this cut is quite precise. BTW I hate falling plate size trees - many seem to be more dangerous than larger trees to this firewood hack. Ron

I'm a hack myself, and I'm real curious as to what can go wrong with these smaller trees.

I'm selectively taking out a big bunch of these plate size trees as you call them, and converting them to firewood. I'm leaving alone and trying to encourage the more desirable trees (at least for me) like wild cherries, walnuts, hickory, etc. and removing trees like box elder, maple, and hackberry. They are spaced close together so I have to be real precise where I land them or I'll damage trees I wish to keep or get them hung up. So far, the thing that seems to work best for me, amateur that I am, is to place an extension ladder on the trunk, climb up and attach a rope. Then put the rope under tension with a comealong. Then do the usual backcut, wedge, and notch routine. So far so good, I've just been interested in shortcuts, but I guess there aren't any.

 

[rwoods]

I'm a hack myself, and I'm real curious as to what can go wrong with these smaller trees.

I'm selectively taking out a big bunch of these plate size trees as you call them, and converting them to firewood. I'm leaving alone and trying to encourage the more desirable trees (at least for me) like wild cherries, walnuts, hickory, etc. and removing trees like box elder, maple, and hackberry. They are spaced close together so I have to be real precise where I land them or I'll damage trees I wish to keep or get them hung up. So far, the thing that seems to work best for me, amateur that I am, is to place an extension ladder on the trunk, climb up and attach a rope. Then put the rope under tension with a comealong. Then do the usual backcut, wedge, and notch routine. So far so good, I've just been interested in shortcuts, but I guess there aren't any.

Basically with small trees you have less wood to cover for your screw-ups and wedging can be difficult even when you make the back cut first. Thus the probability of the tree falling in a direction other than intended is increased.

Not a short cut and I don't know that a pro would do it this way, but when I am cutting small live trees around structures (only do that for kin folks) I often make a tall face cut (forget the name for it) so I end up with a long/tall hinge which allows me to gently pull the stem over without breaking the hinge. Once down, I cut the hinge.

Ron

 

[treeslayer2003]

Basically with small trees you have less wood to cover for your screw-ups and wedging can be difficult even when you make the back cut first. Thus the probability of the tree falling in a direction other than intended is increased.

Not a short cut and I don't know that a pro would do it this way, but when I am cutting small live trees around structures (only do that for kin folks) I often make a tall face cut (forget the name for it) so I end up with a long/tall hinge which allows me to gently pull the stem over without breaking the hinge. Once down, I cut the hinge.

Ron

are you meaning an open face? if i am pulling one {skidder] i will make a big open combo face so the hinge can fold until its about on the ground.

little trees also like to bend and spring and jump back at you like a spear..........spring poles from hell while topping.......i hate um. rather fall over size stuff any day.

 

[northmanlogging]

with small stems you either go with the lean, or pull em. Wedging works, but its certainly not as effective as on a larger tree, couple of 8" k+h red heads work good on small timber (short and fat) Oregon has a little yellow wedge that would maybe work good too? its like 5" or something.

Other wise nothing wrong with putting a line in em.

By plate size ya talking dinner plate or tea plate?

 

[Trx250r180]

If i ever fall a tree in front of taco bell ,this may come in handy ,only place in town i have seen a palm .

 

[rwoods]

Mike, I believe the cut I am describing is close to what you would call a block face. Not sure the term applies to small stuff but it is just a way to ease a small tree to the ground with a rope without breaking the hinge. If you make the hinge too tall it can twist resulting in a falling direction you were trying to avoid. Also you certainly don't want a hinge so thick that the tree doesn't stay down when you release the rope otherwise as you noted you have created a spring pole. Or were you talking about push back from the canopy? Another hazard. Did I say I hate cutting small trees?

NM, plate as in paper plate - 8" or so. The cut I mentioned above is what I employ from time to time on smaller than plate size. You know the size you can almost manhandle but is just big enough to ruin the rose bush or fence if it should land there.

Ron

 

[2dogs]

I also hate those 8" to 14" trees. They don't have enough weigh to make it through limbs of surrounding trees and you can't wedge them hard or you'll break the hinge. I have had several Lodgepole pines and small white firs break the hinge and end up sitting on top of the wedge.

 

[bitzer]

Fall em with the lean, cut the hinge off when they're committed, and usually they will roll through the other standing timber. Usually. Small dbh can make a fool out of anyone.

 

[2dogs]

Fall em with the lean, cut the hinge off when they're committed, and usually they will roll through the other standing timber. Usually. Small dbh can make a fool out of anyone.

No lean, dense stands of Lodgepole (aka Tamarack pine in the Sierras) mixed with White fir and Incense cedar so canopy is very crowded, no weight. When these trees die they lose water weight very quickly and what weight remains is very low in the stem, like the bottom 15'.

Cutting the hinge can help though.

 

[Gologit]

Fall em with the lean, cut the hinge off when they're committed, and usually they will roll through the other standing timber. Usually. Small dbh can make a fool out of anyone.

That dog-hair crap always gave me more problems than the big stuff. I've set daily personal best records for hung trees cutting those whips.
On one job I started out telling the skidder that I'd buy him a beer for every one he had to knock down for me. I had to quit offering though...as many as I hung up I would have had to buy him a whole damn brewery.

 

[Trx250r180]

Whats the trick to keep your bar tip from being pinched cutting cedar limbs ? Slow down a little ?

 

[Westboastfaller]

Whats the trick to keep your bar tip from being pinched cutting cedar limbs ? Slow down a little ?

Don't cut in the compression! lol
..I suppose. ..like gologit is stating in his motto...."Don't cut quicker than you can think". It seems most times you get pinched its because you didn't bother to look if that branch was held up by sometime and assumed you would be cutting the tension like the majority you just cut.