Ethanol-Out

[promac850]

I would rather put that money into a better highway system around LA and Chicago. Those traffic jams waste more gas than anything else, so the problem should be solved by eliminating the traffic jam, not by hybrids. You're supposed to fix the problem at the source, not by piling something else on in hope to make things better.

 

[WillBrayJr]

Boy did I ever open up a Can O' Worms:msp_ohmy:

 

[promac850]

Boy did I ever open up a Can O' Worms:msp_ohmy:

:msp_laugh:

 

[Modifiedmark]

Not to be a smartass, but how can you test it with a non-running saw? :msp_confused:

Use a crappy HD Poulan for the tests, people throw those away all the time.

No your not trying to be a smartass just your just showing how little you know about it there young man. Dose your momma know you use words like smartass?

For your info you need a non running saw to do that test. If it will actually run or not makes no difference.

The ethanol only seperates in long term storage and if moisture is introduced to it does it faster and at a higer rate.

From what I've read so far, ethanol wreaks havoc on parts like fuel lines.

High concentrations of Ethanol will do just as you have heard.

One guy here does this... he lets the container sit for at least a week undisturbed, the ethanol settles to the bottom and then he siphons off the top 2/3 of the can of gas off of the top of the ethanol.

A sealed container will not just allow the ethanol to seperate completly in a week. Your guy there saying he does that is full of bull.

And the ethanol won't seperate just sitting there. I've got a jar that sat for about 9 months, undisturbed, and nothing happened.

Yep as long as its setting in that sealed jar it probably will not separate. Take the lid off of it and let it set open for awhile and then come back later and tell us what happend to it.

 

[Mad Professor]

Yes..ethanol does indeed wreak havoc on fuel lines and doesn't store well.
Didn't mean that Wal-Mart only sells crap stuff..but they do sell their fair share.
Bad part is you ask an employee about it..and they probably wouldn't have a clue?
I really wish there was a way to remove ethanol from E-10...but...HOW??
Thanks for posting about seeing this product...but wish you had bought some to try out for us readers..actually you should go back and do just that..:msp_wink:
Otherwise you should not have started this new thread...IMHO..you try it first!!!

J2F

You can extract out the ethanol using water. Several extrcations will get rid of all the ethanol.

The remaining fuel will have a questionable composition, octane rating unknown. Might run great, might knock like a hammer???

How do I know? I teach organic chemistry....

P.S. If you decide to run extracted fuel, dry it with MgSO4 or Na2SO4.

P.P.S. 100 LL AV gas is cheaper and runs great, with NO ethanol or water

 

[ZeroJunk]

You can extract out the ethanol using water. Several extrcations will get rid of all the ethanol.

The remaining fuel will have a questionable composition, octane rating unknown. Might run great, might knock like a hammer???

How do I know? I teach organic chemistry....

P.S. If you decide to run extracted fuel, dry it with MgSO4 or Na2SO4.

P.P.S. 100 LL AV gas is cheaper and runs great, with NO ethanol or water

If you get bored go to Star Trons website and see if their claim about the enzyme makes any sense to you.

 

[BigMoneyGrip]

Yep as long as its setting in that sealed jar it probably will not separate. Take the lid off of it and let it set open for awhile and then come back later and tell us what happend to it.

But who leaves fuel in an open container? I was talking about normal use. I know that my cans and even the tanks aren't completely sealed but, under normal conditions, the fuel won't seperate. In fact, the tanks at the station are vented way better than any of my stuff.
I'll put some gas in the jar tomorrow and leave the lid off just to see what happens, not doubting you. I won't put much in it though, that junk is starting to get too expensive!

 

[Modifiedmark]

But who leaves fuel in an open container? I was talking about normal use. I know that my cans and even the tanks aren't completely sealed but, under normal conditions, the fuel won't seperate. In fact, the tanks at the station are vented way better than any of my stuff.
I'll put some gas in the jar tomorrow and leave the lid off just to see what happens, not doubting you. I won't put much in it though, that junk is starting to get too expensive!

You said it well, most tanks are vented and will draw moisture from the air. Unless let in a closed container it will seperate. You would be surprised how many people do not have a good tightly sealed container to leave it in. You are also right about the service staitions, there a big problem as well, and you can almost bet that the fuel you buy from there will have some water in it. Did you ever see the tanker truck filling the staitions tanks on a rainy day?

Once moisture hits it, it will seperate. Take it to the bank.

 

[Mad Professor]

If you get bored go to Star Trons website and see if their claim about the enzyme makes any sense to you.

HA HA Ha.......!!!!!


I got my B.S. in Biochemistry. And that is BS

But I have this REALLY GOOD snake oil.......

It will almost cure, liberalism, one dose!!!


It is banned by Nancy Pelouesy and Dingy Harry Reid

 

[ZeroJunk]

You said it well, most tanks are vented and will draw moisture from the air. Unless let in a closed container it will seperate. You would be surprised how many people do not have a good tightly sealed container to leave it in. You are also right about the service staitions, there a big problem as well, and you can almost bet that the fuel you buy from there will have some water in it. Did you ever see the tanker truck filling the staitions tanks on a rainy day?

Once moisture hits it, it will seperate. Take it to the bank.

Here is Star Tron's claim.

Ethanol / E10 fuels increase the amounts of water and sludge in your fuel tank.
Star Tron breaks down this excess water and sludge to sub-micron size allowing it to be safely burned away during normal engine operation.
Therefore Star Tron prevents phase separation and fuel gelling, eliminating ethanol fuel problems.

As you can see there is no claim to remove the ethanol, it is actually more about the water that ethanol will attract and an ability to keep that water and ethanol mix from separating.

As I said earlier, small engine manufacturers are recommending it. So, since there is little in this thread other than uninformed opinion I am going to use the stuff. Can't see what it will hurt.

 

[Modifiedmark]

Here is Star Tron's claim.




As you can see there is no claim to remove the ethanol, it is actually more about the water that ethanol will attract and an ability to keep that water and ethanol mix from separating.

As I said earlier, small engine manufacturers are recommending it. So, since there is little in this thread other than uninformed opinion I am going to use the stuff. Can't see what it will hurt.

I cannot see what it will hurt either, and might just actually help. I seen another product advertised (cannot remember the name) that is suppose to encapsulate itself around any water in the fuel to keep the ethanol from seperating from the gasoline to begin with. That sounds like a even better deal to me.

You are absolutely correct on all the uninformed opinion that has been posted on this thread. As for myself posting, I don't claim to be a expert, far from it in fact, but my postings come from some rather long conversations with the good folks from the Blount/Orgon corporation who make a big share of the fuel lines sold in this country.

There the ones spending the bucks trying to combat this stupidity of ethanol laced fuels today. I do tend to take there commments alot more seriously then the comments of 18year olds and such who post on a internet board.

I myself have had first hand experiance with what the long term storage of E-10 will do to small equipment and its not pretty.

 

[RiverRat2]

Fire in tha hole!!!!!!!!

:agree2::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::msp_biggrin:

 

[WillBrayJr]

There the ones spending the bucks trying to combat this stupidity of ethanol laced fuels today. I do tend to take there commments alot more seriously then the comments of 18year olds and such who post on a internet board.

Please tell me this comment isn't directed towards me. First and foremost, I'm 27 years old. Secondly, I only glanced at the product. I didn't take a real good look at it but I will in a few minutes as I'm heading to Wal-Mart soon.

 

[WillBrayJr]

It's called "Ethanol Shield". I knew it was Ethanol something but I wasn't paying too much attention to the full name. Sorry for the mix-up.

 

[promac850]

I do tend to take there commments alot more seriously then the comments of 18year olds and such who post on a internet board.

Hmmm... who you throwing that frag at?

 

[Modifiedmark]

Please tell me this comment isn't directed towards me. First and foremost, I'm 27 years old. Secondly, I only glanced at the product. I didn't take a real good look at it but I will in a few minutes as I'm heading to Wal-Mart soon.

Hmmm... who you throwing that frag at?

I wasn't thowing that at anyone in particular.

Just pointing out that some inexpericed people are blowing alot about something that know nothing about.

No offense meant to anyone.

 

[andrethegiant70]

Hey River! Damn good to see you!

I actually think this is a pretty good thread, though it might be better in the off-topic area (where it will wither and die in short order, of course). There's couple things I'd like to throw in....

1. I have to agree with ProMac, the CRX's and the Civics of a few years ago are SMOKIN' cars.. I have one that gets 41mpg. They are shaped to cut the air well, they are light, and handle like go carts. It's no accident that the kids make 'em into rods. They are near-perfect cars. The Fit, Yaris, Versa.... I don't know what to say, I just am not going to buy something that ugly for that kind of money. They are bad fashion statements, at least as far as looks go. I'll drive old Civics until they quit shoving those refrigerators down my throat.

2. I DISagree with ProMac about "CLIMATE CHANGE," but it's a free country and he's welcome to his opinion. And let's face, it's a chain saw forum, we're probably not going to figure that one out here.

3. I hear what folks say about E10 being fine for small engines and I agree with the caveat that it needs to be fresh. Otherwise, I'm right in there with Mark, the stuff will eventually cream a small engine. I have first handle experience with this also.... E10 has caused me a lot of grief.

4. I wish the government would get the heck out of the fuel business, subsidizing fuel the way it does is very SOCIALIST. Maybe sometimes things need some intervention, but this is one area in which the market should really be allowed to work it's magic. We should be getting ready for the huge economic battle over fuel that is coming (I'm guessing this summer) instead of encouraging people to waste it like water.... I think the E10 issue would sort itself out nicely also.

 

[ZeroJunk]

As far as the additives. They either work and this is the reason why, or they don't work and this is the reason why. I don't know either reason.

 

[zogger]

public oil and fuel

I am of the opposite opinion when it comes to oil and natural gas taken off of public lands. You can call that socialist all ya want, but I'd rather the government didn't just give it away for a pittance/chump change to the international oil companies, I mean they charge very little for the privilege of pumping it out, then have those valuable resources run through the further megaprofit extraction of the wall street speculator gangsters, who do practically nothing to deserve all that money they make.

I'd rather our public lands fuels be refined and offered to the domestic market at just a little above cost somehow, perhaps just contracting out the refining and distribution for a fair but modest profit, and the profit be put back into more exploration, etc, for our common good rather than some 1% of the public huge profit.

They way it is now, we get little to no economic benefit from our oil and natgas being given away almost free to those fatcats who are already millionaires or billionaires.

We have a precedent in electricity supply with some areas being served by municipal coops, meaning a decent price for kilowatt hours, and also with public water delivery. Is that really some bugabear "socialist" or just being smart and the local communities being efficient and taking care of their citizens better? We have a further precedent with common roads, as opposed to having every single road being privately owned with toll booths at every place that crosses a new property line.

Off their own private land, sure, whatever the market will bear for crude or natgas (or other commodities), off of public lands..nope..I want cheaper fuel that is "ours" collectively to begin with and should remain "ours" all the way to our fuel tanks.

I *dislike* paying global speculator prices for our own oil, just doesn't make any sense to me at all to give it away so cheap to them guys, just to have them sell it back to us for hugemongous profits.

 

[promac850]

I am of the opposite opinion when it comes to oil and natural gas taken off of public lands. You can call that socialist all ya want, but I'd rather the government didn't just give it away for a pittance/chump change to the international oil companies, I mean they charge very little for the privilege of pumping it out, then have those valuable resources run through the further megaprofit extraction of the wall street speculator gangsters, who do practically nothing to deserve all that money they make.

I'd rather our public lands fuels be refined and offered to the domestic market at just a little above cost somehow, perhaps just contracting out the refining and distribution for a fair but modest profit, and the profit be put back into more exploration, etc, for our common good rather than some 1% of the public huge profit.

They way it is now, we get little to no economic benefit from our oil and natgas being given away almost free to those fatcats who are already millionaires or billionaires.

We have a precedent in electricity supply with some areas being served by municipal coops, meaning a decent price for kilowatt hours, and also with public water delivery. Is that really some bugabear "socialist" or just being smart and the local communities being efficient and taking care of their citizens better? We have a further precedent with common roads, as opposed to having every single road being privately owned with toll booths at every place that crosses a new property line.

Off their own private land, sure, whatever the market will bear for crude or natgas (or other commodities), off of public lands..nope..I want cheaper fuel that is "ours" collectively to begin with and should remain "ours" all the way to our fuel tanks.

I *dislike* paying global speculator prices for our own oil, just doesn't make any sense to me at all to give it away so cheap to them guys, just to have them sell it back to us for hugemongous profits.

Exactly. This is all about ripping us off and them greedy bastards making more money. I am sick of it. I would love to show those selfish people how the rest of us live. We live in houses where the driveway is all cracked and messed up, the siding doesn't quite match, the deck is well past it's prime, and many more problems. And they get several multi-million dollar houses on the shore of the oceans and lakes, and fly their damn jet all over. I despise them. All they are trying to do is make more money, they don't care about anyone but themselves.

I think we need a few honest oil-drilling companies to be started up and producing oil, inside our own borders. We have the world's largest oil reserve, it's right under North Dakota/South Dakota. There is enough oil there to supply us fuel for over ~100 years at the rate we consume it now.

Conspiracy... those elites are literally trying to force us to be dependant on oil from other countries... as of right now, it's illegal to drill for oil in the lower 48, because of all of those damn environmentalists. They think we'll destroy everything to get some oil, and that is not true. It is quite easy to drill for oil without doing severe damage to the environment.

The whole Gulf incindent could've been completely avoided, and those cheap bastards thought 10,000 bucks for a valve was too much. Hell, they make that every five seconds. We cannot repair the damage that has been done to the swamps down south. Also, the whole situation could've been contained, but our socialist leader didn't let the Dutch ships into our waters so they could start sweeping the oil up. He let that ride for two months before he let them in to clean the oil up. I am sick of people being blind to what the elites and socialist bastards are doing to us.

:rant: :angrysoapbox:

Alright, I'm done.