She sounds pretty good for a 45 year old saw, I can tell she`s a little low on comp but still running quite strong. Did you check your compression ? Sounds around 125 in the video, thanks for posting it.
Pioneerguy600
1957 IEL Pioneer RA 100cc project/restoration
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She sounds pretty good for a 45 year old saw, I can tell she`s a little low on comp but still running quite strong. Did you check your compression ? Sounds around 125 in the video, thanks for posting it.
Pioneerguy600
SilverBox
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No I didn't, but I looked in the exhaust and intake and it looks real good in there. I live at 3000 ft, so you can expect a 10-15 PSI drop in compresion just from that.
mtfallsmikey
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Jerry; what's the ideal compression hot/cold for an RA?
Brmorgan
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Mine is 130 cold, that seems to be the common neighborhood for others I've seen on this site, but Jerry would know more probably. I'm also at ~3000ft altitude, so results may vary I guess.
That's a helluva lot of weight for a little Mini-Mill! Seems to be pulling alright though, but a 660 would out-cut it in wood of that size while being half the weight!
The clutch on mine is acting funny and keeps snapping open really hard, and also kills the engine dead if i horse down on the cut too hard, so something's up. The clutch is in near-brand-new condition though, so I don't know what the deal is. I took it apart and noticed that the drum's needle bearing had a worn groove where it had been catching on the key that holds the clutch itself, so I replaced the bearing and ground the key a bit shorter so it wouldn't do the same again, but the clutch is still acting the same. The springs seem nice and tight - I got a spare clutch unit from my friend and its springs were the same. Ideas?
That's a helluva lot of weight for a little Mini-Mill! Seems to be pulling alright though, but a 660 would out-cut it in wood of that size while being half the weight!
The clutch on mine is acting funny and keeps snapping open really hard, and also kills the engine dead if i horse down on the cut too hard, so something's up. The clutch is in near-brand-new condition though, so I don't know what the deal is. I took it apart and noticed that the drum's needle bearing had a worn groove where it had been catching on the key that holds the clutch itself, so I replaced the bearing and ground the key a bit shorter so it wouldn't do the same again, but the clutch is still acting the same. The springs seem nice and tight - I got a spare clutch unit from my friend and its springs were the same. Ideas?
SilverBox
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It actually balances perfectly and works very well, the slow torque pulls it right along the cut, you don't even have to push it really, just hold er wide open and pump the manual oiler every 5-10 seconds.
The manual`s say that 125-145 is the service limit for these saws but I have seen much more diverse readings and the saws would still run decently. I have readings of 130- 155 on my saws and they power themselves through wood at about the same rate with the same bar and chain on them. One of my saws runs much higher comp but is modified and not stock so that don`t count but they are capable of holding much higher comp than stock.
Pioneerguy600
If your clutch springs are good then the clutch shoes could be worn where the springs hook into the holes and this causes some loss of spring pressure but the clutch can only spring or move with centrifugal force. At slow rpm the clutch is held closed by the springs and as the rpm increases centrifugal force opens the clutch shoes outward against the drive drum to turn the sprocket and chain. So the speed which = rpm governs the clutch, higher rpm opens and lower rpm closes the clutch. If you bog down the saws rpm too much in the cut the clutch will close and you loose drive to the chain. Does this make sense in your application?
Pioneerguy600
Brmorgan
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Yeah, I know how they work but no, that doesn't really explain it. It's like the clutch is STICKING to the drum if I push too hard, so it can't slip and allow the engine to continue running while stalling the chain. Instead the whole works stalls out. Mind you, I haven't spent much time with it in the last few weeks, it's way down the list of things to do right now. As for the condition, the shoes are in as-new condition as far as I can tell. They aren't missing even a tiny part, and the epoxy that holds them to the assembly is even still visible. It's very clean so I'm not sure WTF. I'll check out the spring mounts though, never though of that since the rest of the assembly seems to be in excellent shape.
As for compression, the old guy I get parts from used to drop trees professionally with these saws back in the 50s when they were first introduced, and he told me that they would just keep on chuggin' with next to no compression, as he said less than 100 PSI which would render most other saws unusable. He just said it made them a ##### to start.
The newer sintered iron clutch shoes that were developed for the 600 series saws and the girdle spring they used work better than the stock bonded shoes and three separate springs the RA`s came with. If you could find one of these newer setups they are better for every day cutting. I can post a pict of one but you probably know about them already.
Pioneerguy600
Pioneerguy600
crane
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Glad to see another old saw out working again. Thanks for posting the video. Tried to rep you, but it says I've got to spread the wealth. Next time for sure!
Drew
Brmorgan
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Well, I did get a spare unit from my friend from a 600 series saw, but it was in worse shape, also had the 3 springs, and was of significantly smaller diameter, probably 3/16", so I didn't even bother trying it & gave it back. Never saw one with a single spring though. I still have the clutch from my 1450 which is like that, but very different otherwise!
stinkbait
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Need a RA top cover
Does anyone have a spare top engine cover, not the silver cylinder cover, the one that has the IEL logo on it, they are willing to sell? I don't care if it has the emblems or not, I just need a solid cover that isn't cracked up. [email protected]
Does anyone have a spare top engine cover, not the silver cylinder cover, the one that has the IEL logo on it, they are willing to sell? I don't care if it has the emblems or not, I just need a solid cover that isn't cracked up. [email protected]
Brmorgan
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For an RA? I don't think mine has an IEL logo of any kind, just the "Pioneer" cast diagonally across the top. That, and the green Castrol sticker which seems to be common on the RAs.
hoss
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Brad, the clutches from the 600 series are exactly the same size as the RA clutches but have three separate iron shoes with a center carrier held together with a girdle spring. If the spare clutch you have is smaller in size from the RA clutch it is not a 600 series clutch. I will show some RA and early 600 lined clutches and the later iron shoe clutches for the 600 series.
Collection of RA and 600 series clutches
RA and early 600 clutches
Later iron shoe clutches
Brmorgan
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I might have spotted the problem - I don't remember seeing any of those washers with the keyway cut out like you have in the lower pic. I'll take another look sometime though.
Brad ,your clutch does not use a washer with the keyway cut in it, it has only a sprocket washer like the one that is in between the clutch drums in the picts of the older clutch setups. The washer with the keyway cut you refer to is the inner plate used with the newer iron shoe clutch setup. Just thought I should clear this up.
Pioneerguy600
Brmorgan
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Well, I dunno. But RE: the smaller size of the other clutch I had, we pulled it straight off of a 600-series saw, so I know that's what it came from. The saw was mostly like my RA, but had the new Pioneer "tree" logo on the top cover, which was green, and had the "squared" rear handle, that was not round like my RA. It also had a different air filtration system altogether. The clutch would fit on the shaft, but I never bothered due to its smaller size. Maybe that extra clearance would have helped the problem though. I just can't imagine that the clutch on mine has seen enough use to be worn out - it looks like brand new in all regards.
I'll get it figured eventually!
I'll get it figured eventually!
