461 break in ?

[Butzer]

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Thanks everyone for help with the decision. My new ms461 arrived yesterday. I've ran a tank through it and WOW what a saw. I bought it with no bar and just use the 25" I had got for my ms390. The 461 doesn't skip a bit with it where the 390 would struggle. The 461 is about the same weight and seems to have less vibrations.

A few questions. I bought it from the local dealer which is a farm Parts/equipment store. They didn't tell me to much. When looking at the 461 I called around to see if anyone had one in stock just to have a feel. One store actually told me there was no such thing. Is this normal for stihl dealers? anyway back on topic

-do I need to run a few tanks with a rich mixture through it? The fuel seemed really rich that was in it.
-I ran it at 3/4 throttle for the first tank. Can I go Wide Open now?

Thanks

 

[Slamm]

Just run it like you are going to always.

There isn't any special break in method that has any more or less proven record than another.

Use good mix oil (synthetic) at 50:1 and you will be fine, as long as its tuned correctly.

Sam

 

[indiansprings]

Just run 50:1 with Stihl Ultra and 91 oct fuel preferably non ethanol, run it like you would any other saw with the exception of do not run it wide open throttle out of wood for periods longer than ten seconds. We've got a couple out with loggers and they are doing excellent. The users are claiming 15-20 percent more power and about 15 percent less fuel use, they are very impressed with the 461,

 

[s219]

-I ran it at 3/4 throttle for the first tank.

Why? Where did you get this idea? I am always amazed when people do this -- the myth has to be coming from somewhere. You need to be cutting at full throttle, regardless of whether it's a new saw or not.

 

[hoeyrd2110]

Why? Where did you get this idea? I am always amazed when people do this -- the myth has to be coming from somewhere. You need to be cutting at full throttle, regardless of whether it's a new saw or not.

it's usually a case of overly cautious. most people don't know saws don't atomize and oil themselves that great until full throttle under load... atleast it was 3/4 he should be ok, anything 1/2 throttle and under is a killer though

 

[Slamm]

I cut at whatever throttle position gives me good cutting without just flogging the crap out of it. I don't just "floor" a saw engine, just because its a 2stroke. I don't see where there is any proviable facts as to why this is better for 2strokes, but is not per say, better for 4 strokes.

The steel, aluminum of the various parts are the same whether its a saw engine or car engine, I don't go around with my auto engine floored just to it will last longer?

Us the throttle amount that gets the work done without excess.

Sam

 

[hoeyrd2110]

does your saw not oil itself and atomize with vaccums and pressures and movement of the piston and on a saw the blow by dynamically changes with engine speed based on the timing. i'm no expert but last time i checked you want the most tumble and swirl to knock the atomized oil onto the surfaces. if your at WOT that would be more air and fuel/oil at the same speed doing the tumble and swirl in the case/cyl, if your at 3/4 throttle you have less air and oil going in but the engine is doing the same movement with less lubricant.

thats atleast how i understand it

 

[Slamm]

does your saw not oil itself and atomize with vaccums and pressures and movement of the piston and on a saw the blow by dynamically changes with engine speed based on the timing. i'm no expert but last time i checked you want the most tumble and swirl to knock the atomized oil onto the surfaces. if your at WOT that would be more air and fuel/oil at the same speed doing the tumble and swirl in the case/cyl, if your at 3/4 throttle you have less air and oil going in but the engine is doing the same movement with less lubricant.

thats atleast how i understand it

And that is logical, but how much oil do you need to lubricate the bearings, piston, rings and cylinder?

I have stopped my saws and taken the muffler's off and even ran a tuned one a little while without a muffler on it, and there was oil coated all over everything, and I have never wore out a 2 stroke engine due to hours of use, and I have several with a lot of hours on them logging. Additionally, my saws don't run hot, so I've yet to see the point proven where I should, in my case, waste more fuel and oil for essentially the same amount to work getting done. Not to mention whatever damage is related to constant over or high reving a saw for no apparent reason. In fact, myself and several other experienced saw runners, note that one thing rookies do a lot is over reving of the engines with no additional work being completed for the horrible screaming that the engine is making.

Sam

 

[hoeyrd2110]

beating the hell out of a saw revving it when not cutting or not cutting properly(theres always time you need part throttle) but when in a peice of wood i go to WOT pretty quick and unless i'm testing a saw or testing time for a mod i don't rev the bejesus out of them and slam em in. hey to each there own, most of my saws are 5-15 years older than me so i would like all the oil i can get in em without fouling or causing issues(32:1). to each there own. that might be YOUR situation, but what is the OP doing with the saw logging?firewood?reving the piss out of it? we don't know. so logic says WOT for best lubrication. plus he breaking the thing in, let him err on the side of safety he'll figure out what he needs to do after he gets it broken in and used to the new girl

 

[Butzer]

Great info
So I'll go 50:1 on the next tank and use as much throttle as needed 3/4 to full

Thanks

 

[Anthony_Va.]

Chainsaws are meant to be ran at WOT in the cut. They have two speeds: idle and WOT. Thats why you tune them at, you guessed it, WOT. The carb has an idle jet and a WOT jet. If you're cutting at 1/2-3/4 throttle, you're just overheating and prematurely wearing out your saw.

 

[s219]

Carbeurated two strokes tend to have a single design point where efficiency is maximum (ie, power = work/time is optimal). I believe most chainsaws are tuned to that point, which would be just shy of the max free-air RPM. So in other words, when the saw is under load at full throttle. Everything else is considered an "off-design" condition. That's not a bad thing, it just means you are falling off to one side of the peak efficiency.

There are definitely many cutting situations where you don't want full throttle, whether for control, finesse, or strategic cutting (like maybe nibbling away at a cut in a delicate or dicey situation). But if you're making a bucking cut, for instance, or putting in a standard face or back cut in big wood, you may as well go full throttle and run the engine at the most efficient point. It basically means you'll be getting the most amount of work done in the least amount of time.

Where it becomes wasteful is when you allow the RPMs to exceed the full-throttle under load condition. There's no point to it, and it's also potentially bad for the saw. I've watched plenty of people mangling a cut where the saw is going from load to no load at full throttle, and it's dumb. That would be a situation to back off the throttle for sure. But I don't tend to get myself into those situations in the first place. It normally happens when the idiot running the saw has a dull chain, keeps binding the bar, the wood is moving around, or the bar doesn't have a good purchase in the cut. That's more about technique than anything else.

 

[Magnumitis]

i purchased a ms461 today as well. asked the dealer a similar question. he told me to run 92 octane. manual calls for 89 octane minimum. i use stihl ultra oil. bought some with the saw for extended warranty. though i doubt i need it. in the past i have run 89 octane non-ethanol in my saws. WOT? question. just run it in wood.. break-in period is gonna be in several tanks of gas..

 

[s219]

Boy, lots of new 461 owners these days! It's a fun saw, you'll like it. Break-in goes pretty quick, since the saw also has a pretty good thirst for fuel.

WOT = wide open throttle

I run either 89 or 91 octane. I prioritize non-ethanol if I can get it.

 

[Magnumitis]

Boy, lots of new 461 owners these days! It's a fun saw, you'll like it. Break-in goes pretty quick, since the saw also has a pretty good thirst for fuel.

WOT = wide open throttle

I run either 89 or 91 octane. I prioritize non-ethanol if I can get it.

I dont think the 461 burns any more gas than my 260, cutting the same amount of wood. just cuts it faster. burns gas faster. think about it. same amount of energy required to cut the same amount of wood. and yes i know what WOT means, that wasnt a question.

 

[Philip Wheelock]

-do I need to run a few tanks with a rich mixture through it? The fuel seemed really rich that was in it.
-I ran it at 3/4 throttle for the first tank. Can I go Wide Open now?

Here's what the dealer (factory-certified) told me when I bought my Stihl 260 Pro: 1. Run saw WOT in the cut, but no winding up the saw WOT to max rpm's with no load; 2. No long cuts; 3. Run 50:1 fuel mix. Also, I'm pretty sure the dealer initially set up the saw to run rich (he didn't know me or whether I would abuse the saw). I remember it 4-cycling a lot; not exactly a pig but not a lot of pep either. Asked the dealer about that and he said bring it back after 7 gallons of fuel and he would give it a final tuning. Whole different saw after that. If your saw seems to be running rich (carburetor, not gas/oil mix), maybe the dealer set it up this way for break-in; you might ask him.

 

[speeco]

Spending the extra money on high grade gas , is not worth it in my opinion. here's what i've been told. 87 octane is more fresh, cause this is the most sold grade . High octane does nothing to improve cutting performace. I learned this at sthil training. but on the other hand it does contain, more additives. Were i buy my gas 87 oct. is about all:msp_thumbup: that they sell, I have a friend that works at the gas station.

 

[s219]

I dont think the 461 burns any more gas than my 260, cutting the same amount of wood. just cuts it faster. burns gas faster. think about it. same amount of energy required to cut the same amount of wood. and yes i know what WOT means, that wasnt a question.

Well, I go through tanks in my 461 much quicker than my 261, which I'd expect. More cc means more volume in the cylinders on every stroke. At similar RPMs, the 461 has to consume more fuel, give or take 15-20% for differences in technology, etc.