beastmaster
Addicted to ArboristSite
I remember when an ISA certification was impressive as hell and meant something.
A new thread for oldies.....Check in if you remember when.....
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Treepedo
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When MA meant 7 men.
Jane n finchers would show up in a beater, sneakers and high as kites
to pull the tree over or rig the top off for a swing and then drag brush for awhile
then take off as fast as they came.
The B-team/suby meant all hell is gonna break loose.
Jane n finchers would show up in a beater, sneakers and high as kites
to pull the tree over or rig the top off for a swing and then drag brush for awhile
then take off as fast as they came.
The B-team/suby meant all hell is gonna break loose.
TreeAce
Addicted to ArboristSite
when...There was 3-4 guys and only one hard hat, I had a 4 point hand saw, pole saws were for bad climbers ( its what they told me!), pole pruners and pole saws were 12 ft wooden and often square...no attaching them together, A self feeding chipper was like magic and using one was like being on easy street, and my personal favorite....a new hank of white safety blue was something to get excited about.
I remember those. I still see a few around. In fact there is one about two miles from where Im sitting. I don't think its moved for years. We call them hoopies. First job I ever cut was skidded out behind a 10 wheel truck that once plowed the township roads. Which were and still are gravel fro the most part. Im trying to remember what the truck was. An Oshkosh maybe? Don't know if that's right or not.
TreeGuyHR
ArboristSite Guru
Similar experience back in 1987 at an Oregon company that will go nameless. I signed on as a groundie climber/trainee for $6 an hr.
The below are not exaggerations, and I left a lot out!
Lot crew: we used busted down old skidders to transform a nice wooded lot into a wasteland with a few barked trees and a log deck at the street (helped expand urban sprawl in the Portland area). The climber was "anti-drug", but woofed Percodan for his rotting teeth. Free climbed just using the bark until he got up in the fir crown, and then free climbed to his TIP. Saw him dump a 40 ft. top on a windy day by waiting for just the right gust to push it from the back cut side. He also tossed a saw that wouldn't start onto a rock, purposely breaking a chunk out of the body, and once ran a "dull" one down the sidewalk at full bore because it wasn't sharpened to his liking. No wire core lanyards -- just a single big manilla one tied into the D ring on one side with that little tuck knot so that you could adjust it (clipped to the other side. You hugged the tree with an arm over some limbs to re-set the lanyard.
I learned climbing from this guy.
First fir I took down took me most of a day, with the boss driving up and yelling at me from the ground to hurry up several times. I just had to cut and drop everything, but I probably took a 12 ft. top after limbing up the 100 foot tree. Before then, I had climbed twice: once to cut one low limb out of maple on spurs (ugly--- must have made 50 holes in the bark of the poor tree), and another time to hang a cable from the skidder winch in an alder (spurs kicked out, and I slid 25 ft. to the bottom even though I hugged the tree for dear life, the smooth wet bark offering just enough resistance to scrape up my arms; I stabbed my ankle with one of the hooks, and was told to just go back to work).
No helmets, just caps; no chaps, and usually no eye protection (they had it, but told us to keep it in the truck so we wouldn't break it :confused2:. If we forgot to grab some disposable ear plugs at the shop, we made do with cig filters or a strip of T-shirt or TP.
My hearing loss I have now probably mostly dates from that time -- the "big chipper" was a modified blades-in-your-face (horizontal cutting drum right at the end of the chute) run on a cadillac 450 (500?) cube engine with straight 4 ft. pipes, rolled over at the ends so the rain wouldn't run in. Standing in front of it (which wasn't the nest idea, as sometimes it would spit out the butt of a small log sharpened to a point) the noise felt like it was turning your brain into a Slurpee.
On one job, we got the skidder and chipper stuck in the mud, and then the second skidder as well -- we finally winched our way out. That job was totally illegal -- the lot was obviously a forested wetland, bottomless black organic peat soil with Oregon ash.
Driving the flat-bed back to the shop with the skidder on it (or maybe it was the loaded chip truck), the linkage to the brakes fell out on the floor approaching an intersection -- the other guy was driving, and downshifted rapidly and leaned on the horn going through the intersection without stopping, red light and all. After a bit we could pull over and find the parts and put them back together.
No safety meetings, almost no training. If you weren't gone in a week or two, you must have learned some skills, quit, or were fired. I was an old timer after a year (then quit).
Residential crew: old step van without windows (great for "smoke breaks") held the equipment. This was the "A team" that did the "detail work" if they could get there on time. I think everyone in this company was abusing one or more "substances". I was on the crew a few times, and we never seemed to get to the job on time because at least someone had to be found at home and woken up.
If I go on much more, someone here may figure out what company this was!
Toddppm
Addicted to ArboristSite
I wouldn't worry about that, sounds like alot of companies, even now.
beastmaster
Addicted to ArboristSite
I remember, before whoopy and loopy and eye slings we had an assortment of cable slings, we made ourselfs to hold the massive blocks we would catch wood with. Removed thousands of big beetle trees throu decks and over houses using them never had one fail. Broke a few 7/8 in. three strand bullines though. Had a pretty good brakeing system to slow down those big chunks. The rope man would take one rap around a big tree role up 10 or 20 feet of slack then take another rap around the tree, as the top or chuck came over he would time it perfectly as he tossed,the slack towards the tree with the raps, the piece would run tell it hit the second wrap then stop. first rap would slow it down as the slack was used up.
Part of out training of new climbers was the wind test. The new climber was sent up a skinny, tall pine to place a tipping line, after the line was in, rest the crew would grab the rope and start pulling that SOB. More so then not the poor terrified climber would be clutching the tree crying like a girl. God we were mean:msp_tongue:but it weeded out the faint of heart.
Part of out training of new climbers was the wind test. The new climber was sent up a skinny, tall pine to place a tipping line, after the line was in, rest the crew would grab the rope and start pulling that SOB. More so then not the poor terrified climber would be clutching the tree crying like a girl. God we were mean:msp_tongue:but it weeded out the faint of heart.
RAG66
ArboristSite Operative
Yeah I had a smartass ground guy start pulling the rope a few months back. I told him to just knock that off for a bit while I come down and cram this chainsaw down your throat! He said he was sorry... I didn't think he believed me. Maybe I am old enough to sound surly.
treemandan
Tree Freak
Gee, I don't feel so bad now, in fact, I AM MODEL ####ING CITIZEN by the sound of it. I hate these pretty boy CA's that can't hold their liquor and wear coordinated Arborwear outfits like it was Prada.
JBA
ArboristSite Operative
This isn't my gig(union carpenter) but heard plenty of stories from my retired uncle. Had the driver pull the bucket over in town so he could run in and have a shot or two of liquid courage for breakfast at a open at 7local bar. Or a crew of guys killing a case of beer on the way to the parking lot . said the lot was 7 or 8 miles away. Not a drop left when they got there. I couldn't hang with that crew.
Climbing with an 090, but really that long ago!
mike515
ArboristSite Operative
Man...I remember so many things in this thread! I recently was looking at an equipment catalog and they were selling 3 strand rope and described it as "vintage"...if you want to have some "old school" rope. I was like....wth...that's what I learned with. I'm not that damn old. And I still have a drum chipper. I love 'em. I've used plenty of disc chippers but I still prefer a good drum chipper. A friend recently told me I was living in the stone age with that chipper. I told him he could stand there and wait for those wheels to grab brush and get clogged and have to spit all that stuff back out so he can chip, etc. I'll have my stuff chipped in 5 minutes and be done with it.
beastmaster
Addicted to ArboristSite
I remember when everyone used those chuck and dives. The worse was chipping those pollarded malberry whips. They were10 ft long and would slap you several times on their way in. there might be thousands of them. Youd be coverd in welts after chipping them. Or back in the day you could take a guy out behind the truck and deal with it. solved a lot of petty arguments. The boss would act like he didnt know what was happening. I once had my rope tangled in some brantches and the ground men was off smoking a ciggeritte. I pulled those branches up 60ft or more. When I got down, well lets say it didnt happen again. Now we have to be politcolly correct.
I took a formen job a few year ago. These guys were out of control. They tryed evertthing to run me off.i could of fired them, but I sence they were good kids just a little wild. They had familys and there wasnt much work in those mountain. I one day went old school on them . Throw my helmet on the ground said whos first. Any one of them could of problably klcked my ass, it didnt come to blows but they told my old lady later at the christmas party, thats when they started likeing me. They dont teach that in managers classes. Had one of the best crews out there. Back in the day you had to earn respect. Be it by example or?
I took a formen job a few year ago. These guys were out of control. They tryed evertthing to run me off.i could of fired them, but I sence they were good kids just a little wild. They had familys and there wasnt much work in those mountain. I one day went old school on them . Throw my helmet on the ground said whos first. Any one of them could of problably klcked my ass, it didnt come to blows but they told my old lady later at the christmas party, thats when they started likeing me. They dont teach that in managers classes. Had one of the best crews out there. Back in the day you had to earn respect. Be it by example or?
mike515
ArboristSite Operative
I've been whipped by branches plenty of times when I was a new groundman but it doesn't happen to me very often anymore.
Funny story about that....when I was a groundman I was chipping one day and I got whipped on the ****. Like....right where the head and the shaft meet. It hurt sooo bad that I dropped to the ground immediately. After a few seconds I got up and had to get to the side box because I was sure it must have sliced into my ****. That's how bad it hurt! I didn't even bother shutting the chipper down or telling the other guys what happened. I had to check it out...right now! It was fine but...man....that's about the time I stopped getting whipped very often because I learned to move.
Funny story about that....when I was a groundman I was chipping one day and I got whipped on the ****. Like....right where the head and the shaft meet. It hurt sooo bad that I dropped to the ground immediately. After a few seconds I got up and had to get to the side box because I was sure it must have sliced into my ****. That's how bad it hurt! I didn't even bother shutting the chipper down or telling the other guys what happened. I had to check it out...right now! It was fine but...man....that's about the time I stopped getting whipped very often because I learned to move.
millbilly
ArboristSite Guru
I remember cleaning paint pots in gas every Friday. You know the ones you carried on your saw scarab to paint your cuts. Then they came out with aerosol cans, that every now and then you would puncture with your hand saw while you putting it back in the scabbard. Almost forgot: putting a pin hole in the spray can and tossing it down to a ground man telling him you needed a new can. How many days did I go home looking like Howdy Duddie, if anyone remember who Howdy was. How about a boom over log truck? Yes I still use 3 strand safety blue, picked up 600 ft. role off the bay last year for 235 dollars.
beastmaster
Addicted to ArboristSite
3strand maybe thought of as out dated by some. But that was all we used in the day and we removed some of the biggist baddist trees around. I still use it for dirty harsh situations, itll take a beating, its cheap. 1/2 in. 3 strand is still the best for lowering brantches using natrual crotches. I use to love repalling down a three strand tipping line100 feet down using an eight plate(home Made). Don't sell 3 strand short.
mike515
ArboristSite Operative
I still have a few 3 strand ropes but I don't use them for much weight anymore. They are old but I love them and can't bring myself to just throw them away. But they're still fine to trust for light stuff (just because of their age). They're almost symbolic to me. I have a friend who is in upper management at one of the very large companies and he was telling me one time "Guys like you are a dying breed. If all of my guys were like you....my life would be a lot easier. We have "specialists" who are very book trained and can pass all the tests but don't have the hands-on experience. We no longer have tough, trained-in-the-trenches tree guys who can just get the job done because they've done it so many times".
That might seem a little egotistical to say but it struck me...he's right....I was trained by tough guys who had been doing this for longer than I had been alive. They smoked 2 packs of cigs a day and didn't care if it was zero degrees outside. Too bad! Everyone is cold. Deal with it or go work somewhere else. They trained me but there wasn't a lot of testing back then. Maybe a little. I definitely felt like a boy among men until I got a little older and tougher. But those old ropes take me back to that era. I remember one time...I was 18 or 19 and one of those older guys said (about me) "I know a lifer when I see one". I said "I'm not a lifer. This is just a decent job for me". I'm still doing it and it's literally the only job I've ever had for my entire adult life. So...dangit...I keep those old ropes around but rarely use them.
millbilly
ArboristSite Guru
Yeah! and if you were beat up and frozen fingered they would tell you to rub them in snow to warm them up, my hands still look like Alligator skin at 61 and did at 19. I never worked the woods, but remember working in my friends dads mill that had a split block Minneapolis Moleen motor running one hell of a big saw blade. If you ever had a bark slab pass your head and go through the wall at 7 to the 10th power you've been there.
