Accurately Measuring Tree Height

[Hexa Fox]

Hey the guys here have been pretty helpful and I'm hoping maybe someone could help me out again. To make a long story short I might be getting a tree removal job early this Spring. However as a lot of you know from seeing me other places around here I am not insured so I will not take a risky job. This is a very large Oak Tree on about an acre of property and I am almost positive that it is well out of range of the customers property.

Like many of you have probably already guessed I can not afford to be almost positive. I know of many ways that I can measure the height of a tree from the ground. I know that one of the most popular methods is to use the trees shadow mixed with a number or other factors to estimate. Now my problem with this is how accurate is this estimate? So is there any method out there that is relatively easy to do that will be accurate? Also can you tell me how accurate the method actually is if used correctly? I would estimate by looking that this tree is around 50-60 feet tall and would easily clear all property. I would like to be 100% sure that it is going to miss the house by a fair distance if it were to accidentally start falling that way.

 

[sgreanbeans]

Climb to the top, drop a 100ft tape.

 

[Pelorus]

Get a large 45 / 45 / 90 protractor.
Walk away from the tree.
Aim the tip of the longest side (the hypotenuse or some other Greek term) at the top of the tree while keeping the other sides perpendicular and parallel to the ground. Put a little level on the protractor for more accuracy.
Tree may possibly end up within a couple of feet more or less of where you end up. Theoretically.
nb. I have never done this, and got terrible marks in math / trigonometry in school.

 

[beastmaster]

buy a cheap leval with a bubble for 45 on it. sight down it why'll holding it at a 45 to the top of the tree. follow the imagenary line from top to ground , then pace it off to the trunk. you'll have your hight.

 

[beastmaster]

Get a large 45 / 45 / 90 protractor.
Walk away from the tree.
Aim the tip of the longest side (the hypotenuse or some other Greek term) at the top of the tree while keeping the other sides perpendicular and parallel to the ground. Put a little level on the protractor for more accuracy.
Tree may possibly end up within a couple of feet more or less of where you end up. Theoretically.
nb. I have never done this, and got terrible marks in math / trigonometry in school.

you beat me to it by a few min.

 

[ATH]

I'd say buy a clinometer...but you shouldn't buy anything until you can afford a couple of hundred for insurance... A clinometer is a tool that makes what everybody else has said easier. You measure a set distance from the tree then measure to ghe top...without any more math. The key with any of the methods is make sure you are maesuring the highest part of the tree. that is usually the top center. that is ideally centered over the trunk...so you measure you horizontal distance from the center of the trunk. Howeverf if (as is often the case) the highest point is not over the center of the trunk, you need to set you hoizontal measurement accordingly.

 

[woodchuck357]

The stick method is quick, accurate and simple. This video shows it better than I can explain.

 

[mesupra]

I also was taught to use the stick trick, it has proven very useful many times. It works great, usually within 1-3 feet, great way to win a net or two as well.

 

[Hexa Fox]

I'd say buy a clinometer...but you shouldn't buy anything until you can afford a couple of hundred for insurance... A clinometer is a tool that makes what everybody else has said easier. You measure a set distance from the tree then measure to ghe top...without any more math. The key with any of the methods is make sure you are maesuring the highest part of the tree. that is usually the top center. that is ideally centered over the trunk...so you measure you horizontal distance from the center of the trunk. Howeverf if (as is often the case) the highest point is not over the center of the trunk, you need to set you hoizontal measurement accordingly.

Sorry I should have explained this but we posted over in another forum and here in Charles Town, WV Arborist Insurance is not affordable for a small time guy like my self. My Insurance agent told me that it would cost me roughly $6,000 a year. He said that is if I can even find someone around here to insure me. He said they do things like this to keep "some random Joe" from going out and trying to do what I am doing. He said he was not trying to be offensive but that is the way it was. I have done all my research on the insurance side and there is not hope for me.

There is landscaping insurance which covers very small trees and basically sticks. So I could offer tree trimming but never anything commercial. I am pretty sure the tree or limb has to be under 5" in diameter here. Anything else is considered commercial tree removal.

Like I said I have done very, very well in the past by making sure to not take jobs that are liabilities. I would say I am about 98% sure that despite how large this tree is it can not reach their back porch which is what I am scared of. However I would like to be at least 99.99% sure before I did this. The last thing I need is one of the larger limbs breaking off and gaining a little more distance and landing on their porch or roof and easily putting me out of business forever and having to rebuild whatever damage was done.

 

[Hoowasat]

Hexa - If there is doubt ... and i sense a lot of it in your words ... why not dismantle the tree, drop limbs as you climb, take out its top, and then fell the remainder? It may seem like a lot of extra work, but the peace of mind could be worth it.

 

[Hexa Fox]

Hexa - If there is doubt ... and i sense a lot of it in your words ... why not dismantle the tree, drop limbs as you climb, take out its top, and then fell the remainder? It may seem like a lot of extra work, but the peace of mind could be worth it.

Hey Hoowasat and thanks for the reply. I already thought of this and still thinking about it. This tree would be extra tough as considering how high it is the bottom most part is too tall to even begin to start climbing without equipment. I am still thinking about it.

 

[Hoowasat]

You're near my ol' stompin' grounds (Williamsport, MD) and I'd gladly offer to give ya' a hand if I was still up that way. If I had that many doubts over getting it done without damage, and wasn't equipped or able to climb, I would pass on the job. I'm no professional, and I've turned down friends who've asked me to help with jobs that are simply beyond my comfort level. Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[Hexa Fox]

Hexa - If there is doubt ... and i sense a lot of it in your words.

Well there is not a lot of doubt. There is actually very, very little however it is the fact that there is any at all. Because the 0.1% chance that it could fall and damage property is too much for me... That is why I was looking for a way to measure it.

 

[BC WetCoast]

There are phone apps that will measure tree heights for you. They act like clinometers and you need to know the horizontal distance to the tree.

Not sure about Iphones but I have one for my android.

 

[ATH]

Find a new insurance man. My liability (if I had just that without auto coverage...) is about 10% of that. When I was starting out years ago, it was a little harder to find things online...so I called all over town (live in a town of about 50,000). Most agents couldn't offer anything. A few came back with huge numbers but I stuck with it. I have Westfield insurance through Huntington insurance. The Hartford advertises they cover arborists. Make more phone calls and do some online searching.

Maybe you already went through this elsewhere...so sorry if I am rehashing something you have already been through.

 

[Hexa Fox]

Find a new insurance man. My liability (if I had just that without auto coverage...) is about 10% of that. When I was starting out years ago, it was a little harder to find things online...so I called all over town (live in a town of about 50,000). Most agents couldn't offer anything. A few came back with huge numbers but I stuck with it. I have Westfield insurance through Huntington insurance. The Hartford advertises they cover arborists. Make more phone calls and do some online searching.

Maybe you already went through this elsewhere...so sorry if I am rehashing something you have already been through.

No, any opinion/advice is advice I appreciate even if it is repeated. Because that just makes the argument for whatever you're saying stronger, simply because there is one, two, or more people saying the same thing. So anyway I appreciate it. I looked into the Hartford and I am pretty sure they were the ones that would only insure a bigger business with 10+ employees in it. Although you are telling me what my insurance agent did. He did advise me to look around and try to find someone. He said that my chances weren't good. You just don't know until you try. Maybe I will make some more phone calls tomorrow.

Just this business has treated me very well in the past and I have done very well by not taking jobs that even made me think for a second "could that reach their shed, house, or anything else worth money?". Because like it was said before I could even sue them if something happened to me just obviously the chances of the worker with no insurance getting sued are much greater.

Like I have said over and over I am over thinking this whole ordeal. Because it is not going to reach their house and I am not even planning on felling it in that direction. It is just the thought of what if 3 feet of that tree does not clear the deck and it causes more damages to their property than I have made in my lifetime of this work? That is where I am coming from and from what a lot of you have to say I am right to be paranoid.

Thanks for the reply ATH. The few I got told me that was just for liability I am pretty certain... or maybe they told me I needed to be fully covered or something. Anyway I have been told several times to make 100% certain that for what I am doing I get insurance for commercial tree removal. Because there are a lot of programs were people misunderstand what we are doing for work and then that person goes out with a lot more confidence because they are now insured. Then drop a tree on a house and realize they were not actually covered for that sort of work. Either way I will make a few phone calls here soon. As I made a few before and lost hope based on what I had been told.

Another thing I learned is it can be very different based on where you live. For example if you live in New York City your insurance is going to be a retarded number compared to someone like me that has a lot more open space. Because obviously you are prone to do a lot more damage where there is property such as houses, cars, other structures, and especially for bodily harm to a living person.

 

[Hexa Fox]

There are phone apps that will measure tree heights for you. They act like clinometers and you need to know the horizontal distance to the tree.

Not sure about Iphones but I have one for my android.

I have several ways to measure the height of a tree... The problem is I do not know how reliable they are. Because I want to be sure.

So how reliable can I expect something like this will be?

 

[beastmaster]

I have several ways to measure the height of a tree... The problem is I do not know how reliable they are. Because I want to be sure.

So how reliable can I expect something like this will be?

I had several on my iphone, they work pretty good but you still need to know one ,''known" distance. You use how many feet or meters from the trunk your standing and the angle your looking at the top. Those two will give you hight. It as accurate as you are steady.
If your just sweating a few feet, why not just take a small top?
I make a 45 deg. with my thumb and forefinger and sight down it to get a ball park figure.

 

[BC WetCoast]

I have several ways to measure the height of a tree... The problem is I do not know how reliable they are. Because I want to be sure.

So how reliable can I expect something like this will be?

The clinometer app is accurate (based on the leveling sensor in the phone). You sight along the edge of the phone. It then becomes an issue of how accurate you measure the distance to the tree and take into account slope, height of your eye above ground etc.

An easier way would be to take the phone and measure a 45* angle to the top of the tree. The tree should land about 5' (depending on how tall you are) past where you are standing. Of course this will depend on how tall you make the stump.

If you are going to be this close, you need to climb the tree and blow out a top.

 

[jimmycrackcorn]

The stick method is quick, accurate and simple. This video shows it better than I can explain.

Yes! I was just going to go look this up! Nice find.. This video seemed pretty well presented & accurate to his theory.. I haven't been able to try it yet though... ***wishing this snow away isn't working***