Advice for new home

[AllForFun2010]

I have been reading discussions on here off and on for months as I have been doing alittle research regarding heating with wood. So heres the deal...We are in the process of breaking ground in April on a new house. 28x46 ranch with full poured basement under it. The planning process hasn't been to bad until we got to heat. The wife said that I can do whatever I wished as long as I am within budget. So...my orginal idea was to run baseboard and install a OWB for water and heat. After taking a look at a quote on that we needed to take a step back.

I grew up with a wood stove in the living room and absolutely loved it. I enjoy cutting and stacking wood and have done so since I was a little guy. Since I moved out I have complained every winter since that I miss the ambient heat and the glow of the stove. The wife could give two turds how the place is heated as long as she is warm. So. where I am at now is still going with baseboard heat with a wall mounted condensing boiler. Heat water with this unit as well. Bank also reguires a heat source other than wood incase we default on mortgage. Then I am playing with putting a free standing unit in the living/dining/kitchen. Open concept. I would use this stove to supplement the fuel usage but still have backup if we were away. Concerns are over heat in the basement(which hopefully will be finished some day), and how much heat will reach the bedrooms. Decided to go with baseboard as someday I might just be able to afford an OWB but right now it is not gonna happen. What do you guys think about this idea?

 

[Streblerm]

Baseboard with a condensing boiler and a stove in the middle of the house sounds pretty much ideal. If you are worried about heating the extreme ends of the house I would suggest a zone setup so you can run the baseboards only in the cold rooms.

I wouldn't worry about heating the basement now. It should never get below freezing. The old school idea was to heat the basement and let it heat the floor. Now they totally seal the ductwork so there are no leaks or heat loss into the basement. Of course insulation is a good idea and probably code.

You could always add more baseboards in the basement later if you decide to finish it. It would probably be cheaper to add another boiler later if you need it rather than doubling the size now in case you need it later

 

[tld400]

Since its a new home Im sure it will be well insulated so I think a wood stove could heat entire house. I heat a 2000 sq. ranch no basement with one woodstove. House is well insulated and I have burned just over 2 cord so far. The house has electric base board in each room for back up but havent used it since I put wood stove in. I just use one box fan to blow hot air to back of house. OH my house stays in the mid 70s and rooms are 1 degree less. good luck with home

 

[dave_dj1]

Ok, here's my take on it. Being in NY you will have to insulate the foundation either inside or out. (check to see which zone you are in as to what the required R value is). Here http://www.tech.farmingdale.edu/~anderse/NYS ECCC Simplified Prescriptive Provisions.pdf If it was me, I would put radiant heat in the basement floor as well as radiant on the upper floor. If you ever go with an OWB you can tie it in and you will appreciate not having dusty baseboard radiation and not worrying about having drapes or furniture on them or in front of them. I would plan for a wood stove in the basement with the "man cave" along with a good Bilco door to get the wood down there.

Growing up we heated a ranch with an un insulated block foundation with a wood stove and we were never cold. We did put a half door on the cellar door though (kept the little ones from falling down the stairs and let the heat up).

Depending how the house is laid out you could either have a center chimney or on one end.

Have you thought about going with ICF's? (Insulated concrete forms)
Also I think they changed the under slab insulation to 3" now instead of 2"
Good luck and keep us posted.
dave

 

[stihly dan]

How about radiant pex lines run in the two floors, not connected. Then a 98% eff gas furnace with ac, for back up heat--air cond. Then either a wood stove on the main floor for ambiance/heat or an add on wood furnace in the basement. The pex lines will be in and available to use if you do end up getting a boiler.

Also they have the ductless mini split heat pumps. 1 air handler in each rm you will have cooling and back up heat 100% eff. These are also modulating, so if a bedroom needs 2,000 btu's of heat. Thats all the unit will make.

 

[AllForFun2010]

Thanks for the replies thus far...apprecaite the input from people with more experience than myself. Thanks.

 

[zogger]

also see this thread

http://www.arboristsite.com/firewood-heating-wood-burning-equipment/229099.htm

 

[Walt41]

Kinda indirectly heat related...frame it with 2x6 walls, makes a huge difference in strength, heat loss in winter and solar heating in summer...quieter too and a big selling point at cash out time, last two I did this way and could not be happier, especially during the 50 mph winds we are having right now.

 

[skindaddy]

you have to go radiant in all the floors or dont do it , we just built ourselves a new home, this will be the first full winter for us living there. its is the best, the warmest the easiest, stay warmer longer with everything heated. heating air doesnt even make sense at all after youve had radiant.
we went well past or budget but, it was well worth it, and would not have done it without it.

1508 sqft house with 3 car garage
basement floor 70*, upstairs living half 73* , upstairs bedroom side 71*, and garage 59*
right now in the teens-twenty's fill heatmor 200css once every 24hours

 

[Encore]

If it were me, I'd still keep seeing if there was a way to make an OWB work. When you're building the house at the same time of install, it makes it so easy.

I helped a buddy do it and it was a cinch.

Look at used units and consider doin the install yourself as well as using a forced air furnace with a water to air heat exchanger.

Don't get me wrong, I love our wood stove. Just make sure your wife understands how it goes. The heat isn't even throughout the house and she will need to keep the fire going if she wants to stay warm. I've had some friends who got into it and their wives hated it lol. Mine loved it though so it just depends.

The reason I really like our OWB is there is all the mess outside, less processing of the wood, free hot water, and much much longer burn times between filling. I run a plow in the winter as well as run my own business so I'm not home all the time to keep the fire going and it got super old getting home late and the house being cold (my wife works a lot as well)

However, for the least expensive and most minimal maintaince you can't go wrong with a wood stove. I'll never get rid of ours, even though we only use the OWB, we still light a fire in the stove every once in awhile.

Another deciding factor is figuring if you intend on heating solely with wood or just as a secondary. We heat only with wood.

 

[kennyl70]

If it were me, I'd still keep seeing if there was a way to make an OWB work. When you're building the house at the same time of install, it makes it so easy.

I helped a buddy do it and it was a cinch.

Look at used units and consider doin the install yourself as well as using a forced air furnace with a water to air heat exchanger.

Don't get me wrong, I love our wood stove. Just make sure your wife understands how it goes. The heat isn't even throughout the house and she will need to keep the fire going if she wants to stay warm. I've had some friends who got into it and their wives hated it lol. Mine loved it though so it just depends.

The reason I really like our OWB is there is all the mess outside, less processing of the wood, free hot water, and much much longer burn times between filling. I run a plow in the winter as well as run my own business so I'm not home all the time to keep the fire going and it got super old getting home late and the house being cold (my wife works a lot as well)

However, for the least expensive and most minimal maintaince you can't go wrong with a wood stove. I'll never get rid of ours, even though we only use the OWB, we still light a fire in the stove every once in awhile.

Another deciding factor is figuring if you intend on heating solely with wood or just as a secondary. We heat only with wood.

I agree. I would check around more and get many more qoutes on an OWB. Love mine and wouldnt trade it for anything. we have backup ventless wall heaters and i removed the central propane unit myself.. gutted it and left the blower workings so my OWB could utilize it.
I belive if you check around and maybe do alittle of the install on the OWB yourself...... you might be able to get it in there under budget.... but then again i dont know what ur budget is.
another reson for the ventless propane heaters is no electric no problem... and u dont need alot of them to heat a home a couple will keep ur from freezing til the electric comes back on.

 

[excess650]

If you have a ''walk out basement" where moving wood in/ashes out isn't an issue, put a woodstove in the basement with the chimney centered in the house. We currently have a hardcoal stove in one corner of our basement and it keeps most of the house 26'x48' toasty. We had another house built 32'x40' with 2 flue chimney and put a woodstove in the basement, and propane stove in the living room. The primary heating/cooling is by way of a heat pump, but the woodstove makes enough heat to keep the heat pump from cycling once the basement gets some heat in it. With heat in the basement, the house feels warmer because the floor is warm. Heat rises, so some simple floor vents and an open stairway allow heat to circulate. Even with no power, a radiant woodstove keeps the house warm, and gives you a place to do a little cooking should it become necessary.

 

[blackdogon57]

Radiant/hydronic heats rules. If I were you I would beg, borrow or steal the extra money to put pex loops in the slab and under the main floor. You can always tie into OWB if you decide to go that way later or add a stand alone wood stove.

 

[philoshop]

My 2 cents. Overinsulate the heck outta the place and run pex tubing in the basement slab for the future. You can retrofit the radiant heat in the floor above before you finish the basement. Radiant in-floor all the way!! It's amazing how warm you feel when your feet are nice and toasty.
All of the tubing can be connected to an OWB or a geothermal system pretty easily at a later date. In the meantime, whatever boiler or other heat source is most efficient cost-wise in your area. My folks heat with electric:msp_ohmy: and it' pretty economical for them.
I love my woodstove and wouldn't give it up for anything. It's the only heat I have, but it's not 'free' heat. Do you have the gear, time, and energy to heat with wood? Chainsaw(s), splitter, truck, trailer, stove and pipe, storage space for wood, etc. I'm not tryin' to talk you out of it, just stuff to think about. You should also check with the local building inspector and planning/zoning folks to make sure they won't ban an OWB next year like they're doing in a lot of places around the state.
Sorry for the long post but I'm a buider and I deal with this all the time.

 

[skindaddy]

2" foam under all slabs of concrete and tubing stapled to that, at least for future use. 2" foam outside around footers to prevent heat leaking out,2" foam outside basement walls. i actually use gypcrete on top of my main floor , was a big expense but worth it. lower water temps , and twice the heat transfer versus under 3/4" osb.

warm floors are ridiculously nice

 

[aokpops]

Don,t know if you want central air or not ? I sure enjoy it.

 

[woodfarmer]

IFC foundation
4" Dow styrofoam
Pex in the slab and the underside of the sub floor
Empyre elite boiler in my shop and backup propane condensing boiler in the basement

 

[Pleasant Ridge]

A thought to take advantage of the basement during the cooling season.... I put a 12x12 return at floor level in the basement. This helps keep the chill off the basement when the heat is on, but it also helps cool the upstairs during cooling season. I'm heating with an OWB and cooling with a 5 ton split system.

 

[T. Mainus]

I have to agree with skindaddy. The best way is to pour 3/4 gypcrete on the first floor and put the radiant tubes in the gypcrete. By far the most efficient way of doing it. Also probably the most expensive as well. If you want AC you are still going to need a forced air furnace with ducts. There goes the budget:msp_smile:

Tom

 

[skindaddy]

i planned having a/c anyway, but turns out our code does not consider an outdoor burner a primary source of heat so i would have had to put in forced air system even if i didn't want a/c.
but it worked out for me.