anyone not been hurt?

[Tree Machine]

I'm outta here.

 

[Jumper]

WTF? Are you retarded?

My thought as well. Some "free spirits" just do not get the gist of laws, and regulations, not to mention common sence that govern the activities of workers in high risk industries. This is the same bunch thay finds fellers pants "too hot", steel toe boots "too uncomfortable, or I might get my toes amputated", disdainfull attitude towards PPE in general, and a total disregard for their own well being. Caulks around wood in the bush sound like a good idea to me, though they might be overkill on someone's manicured lawn in Westchester County for eg. What does HC have to do with this discussion aside from the fact that she too comes accross as being a know it all. I do not have to agree with clearance's methods(but I likely would have a greater appreciation of them if I saw him in action), but I am not the one doing his job. Does a Beverly Hills plastic surgeon use the same techniques as Medicins san frontieres doctoring to the sick and dying in the Sudan?

 

[Jumper]

xtreme, you make me laugh, I have a hard time figuring out sometimes if you are :
a- a troll
b- actually believe the nonsense you preach
c- a hopeless poser wannabe
And before all the AS feelgooders jump on me for flaming him, I'll remind everyone of his statement that the only way to survive a fall is to land on your feet.

Doesn't hurt as much if you combine it with a good parachute landing roll, difficult to do with a chain saw I suppose

 

[coydog]

WTF? Are you retarded?

not to mention clearance posts from canada

 

[trees4est]

good god, you guys are literal. I'm just pointing out that Clearance will cry about these supposed impingments on his liberties that aren't even mandatory (i.e. the use of spurs or not, the perennial b.s.) that the tree hugger, liberal elite etc. ad nauseum tries to foist on him, and then say, well, I gotta wear these, it's the regulations."H.Clinton was very much part of the crowd that wants to tell you how and what to do in your own life, thats what, kind of like you and your fellow spurless zealots." "The PC, Hilary Clinton, takes a village, big brother knows best crowd can take a flying leap. Spike if you want, hump ropes if you want, do whatever turns your crank" Except wear non-caulk boots. I mean, I know I shouldn't even try to reply to whatever that is. It's just too funny. I love it how Hillary Clinton somehow comes into play. Yeah, man, just lump everyone who isn't you or thinks like you into one big demon ball.
Jumper says,"Some "free spirits" just do not get the gist of laws, and regulations, not to mention common sence that govern the activities of workers in high risk industries."
Of course regulations are there for a reason. Sometimes they get extreme, but more often they just try to direct people into safe working. You need to recognize "tongue in cheek", dude. There is no law against using spurs, it's just discouraged if you are someone working to preserve trees. Which is not what you do, Clearance guy. You do windfirming (which is arguably stand preservation) and utility work. So be it.
And by the way, there are plenty of people who could climb any tree you climb without spurs. Faster? I don't know, it's not a race. But what does that matter? This thread is about injuries. Shouldn't have hopped on the derailment in the first place, sorry. Carry on.

 

[clearance]

So you have spurless climbed with caulks, wow, you the man, tell us about it, big old red cedars too, damn, where abouts?

Never got an anwer, lets hear it, anyone now. Plenty of people according to trees4est, where?

 

[xtremetrees]

Clearance Ive heard you whine and justify you spikeing trees because of chalks or whatever but chacks dont get you up the tree dude spikes do and its much easier to climb them trees you climbing without um, unless theres dense undergrowth and is throwballing nightmare.
Can you spike 80 feet up in 8 seconds(ok be realistick and not a comp climber and say 18 minutes) safely,
The point is being we work on a rope which is primarely used to catch us if we fall. I support the ideal of spikeless climbing simply because theres a safety to catch us if we fall. I know its a hassle tending the rope and flip core at the same time, those who love you will glad you did.

 

[woodchux]

I can spike my way 80 ft up in under 5 minutes.
Probably more like 15 minutes for me to climb spur less.

 

[clearance]

Like I have said, we have to wear caulk boots (if you guys had ever worked in the bush you'd understand why)' some of the cedars have no good branches for over 70' and the live ones all droop down untill you get near the top, trees are like 150'. Can you climb spurless with caulks? How are you going to get your throwline past the dead branches and around something that doesn't droop down?. Why not just admit you can't do it?

 

[xtremetrees]

I can see you have no injuries from chawk boots. Today I spiked my boot only you can see we live in a dangours world. It shte guys on the ground that suffer us contatly managing heavy loads while flying thru the air.
:monkey:
How many groundmen last years, some do..

 

[trevmcrev]

Trev, thanks, well written, legitimate points, I'll explain. Throwlines around power, 25kv line for example, the rule is that nothing can come closer than 4' to the line that is unisulated, a tool that is insulated (trimsaw, polepruner) can come as close as 11/2'. So by chucking a throwline higher than the primary there is a chance it could come in contact with the lines or wrap around them, even if it came closer than 4', it would be a violation of provincial work laws and the utilities rules. Making you liable for suspension or revocation of your ticket to work around power, at the very least a note in your file. Caulk boots, simple, the law is "workers required to walk on logs, timbers, shall wear caulks." That basically means the whole time you are away from the pickup, not going to change my boots on and off all day long for anyone, impratical and most likely violating the law some of the time. Trees-we work in an old growth rainforest, the trees are tough, the growing season for them is at least 11 months a year. I see trees all the time that have big damage, big tops ripped off by the wind, co-doms with one stem busted off from being hit by another tree, trees growing with 40' catfaces, etc. Growing well, hundreds of years old, still going strong. Spurring them is like jabbing an elephant with a paper clip.

Ok i here ya, sounds like you work in a very different environment to the average suburban arborist and have fair enough points to do what you do, that in many of our own working situations would be 99.9% of the time un called for.

 

[ArborCore]

I always climb spikeless when trimming, and most of the time on removals. I have done A LOT of trimming which allows me to climb spikeless on removals too. Of course the only benifit I can think of for spikeless removals is comfort and no chance of stabbing yourself in the leg.

Does anyone else prefer to climb without spikes.

Don't get me wrong I am quite proficient with the spikes too. Just if I don't NEED them I don't use them.

 

[clearance]

I leave the spikes in the truck every chance I get. Rope climbing without spikes makes it much more enjoyable limb walking and getting out to the tips.

Dan

Try limb walking with caulks.

 

[Tree Machine]

Right in the middle of my lower right leg, below the knee, inner side, toward the front, I have a bony knob there and a climbing spur, the pressure and the rubbing of it, it grinds the skin off, causing much pain.

I didn't use to care for spikes on removals, normally it would be climb and crown out spikeless, come down help brush pilot, climb back up with spurs and be an aerial firewood factory. Now I have to really, really, really need them to wear them.



Just yesterday I got rid of my old thrashed pads and installed the big, thick cadillac pads. I had them out and nearby today's takedown, but I just grit my teeth thinking of putting them on. I cheated and used a ladder on blocking out the lower trunks (triplet).

 

[TreeTopKid]

I try to climb spikeless on any tree I trim, but if I cannot do it efficiently, the spikes go on. Now for a little reality beyond the pc bs. Show me one tree, just one, that has died due to spike marks...and I will buy into it full heartedly.

.

Does the tree have to die in order for the procedure to be incorrect. Spikes Should only be used in a take down situation. Any damage to the Cambium is going to cause death on some part of the tree, given the type of damage that can climbing with spikes on diagonal timber i.e. cuts right across the Cambium the die back could be quite extensive.

As I understand it has always been considered malpractice. I was first told about it by an older generation arborist in the early eighties. In my opinion if you truly love trees you should climb properly or is it just a question of time & money?

 

[clearance]

Does the tree have to die in order for the procedure to be incorrect. Spikes Should only be used in a take down situation. Any damage to the Cambium is going to cause death on some part of the tree, given the type of damage that can climbing with spikes on diagonal timber i.e. cuts right across the Cambium the die back could be quite extensive.

As I understand it has always been considered malpractice. I was first told about it by an older generation arborist in the early eighties. In my opinion if you truly love trees you should climb properly or is it just a question of time & money?

Blah,Blah,Blah, hey Kid, its always time and money, more time more money, and the customer in most cases wants to spend less money. If you are so passionate about trees and the damage spurs do, you should be able to tell Old Ugly of trees that have been spurred to death. Or post a picture of one, maybe it does happen, one in a million. And, in some cases spurs are about safety. Its not good enough to just spout the party line, back up what you say.

 

[1I'dJak]

be adaptable... be realistic...what clearance and I do...windfirming... is impossible without spikes... some of you guys say you could do it... sure maybe you could do one a day...that production's gonna get you canned... i was at work yesterday looking at a big balsam and wondering how you could ascend it spikeless....not impossible but very time and energy consuming and very very sketchy as the bottom limbs were dead or dying...you'd be searing around for hours, f'n around with your throwbag and line all tangled up in the slash and nearby insanley branched cedar trees... i taught myself to spikeless climb and it defiently is easier on deciduous trees (of which i think most work on)... alot of big, thick branches to isolate your line on...as far as treeco's ponderosa pine... ponderosa's are significantly more decurrent than most conifers... plus those guys had all day....if the tree is a nice ornamental yard tree i'd attempt to spurless (not the most skilled)... but if i'm up in northern vancouver island and my friend who lives surrounded by big trees wants a line of them trimmed for view i'd spike up them... more thanb likely i'd spike up one, then use my claw (grapple) and ascender to swing to the next trees... as clearance said... here on the coast the growing se3ason is long, the winters are mild, the trees are hardy, and everything just grows and grows....

 

[rebelman]

You're on point treetop. It is malpractice. Residential malpractice. I'm not gonna say it's windfirming malpractice, or even utility. It's preventable residential malpractice. It contributes cumulative stress to the tree. Wow, if these guys have never noticed spike marks on a dead tree they probably don't really do that much residential. I'll try to snap a photo of the next one and show them.

 

[clearance]

You're on point treetop. It is malpractice. Residential malpractice. I'm not gonna say it's windfirming malpractice, or even utility. It's preventable residential malpractice. It contributes cumulative stress to the tree. Wow, if these guys have never noticed spike marks on a dead tree they probably don't really do that much residential. I'll try to snap a photo of the next one and show them.

Seen spur marks on dead trees, proves nothing. Nothing. Time for some critical thinking and logic boys, you are like a woman that sees her husband talking to another woman and concludes he is fooling around. The tree may be dead from various other reasons. Out the many hysterical tirades about spurring trees that have taken place on this website, the proof that spurring kills trees is weak, to say the least. Granted, its not good for them, like the scars I have, doesn't mean fatal. Calm down.

 

[clearance]

be adaptable... be realistic...what clearance and I do...windfirming... is impossible without spikes... some of you guys say you could do it... sure maybe you could do one a day...that production's gonna get you canned... i was at work yesterday looking at a big balsam and wondering how you could ascend it spikeless....not impossible but very time and energy consuming and very very sketchy as the bottom limbs were dead or dying...you'd be searing around for hours, f'n around with your throwbag and line all tangled up in the slash and nearby insanley branched cedar trees... i taught myself to spikeless climb and it defiently is easier on deciduous trees (of which i think most work on)... alot of big, thick branches to isolate your line on...as far as treeco's ponderosa pine... ponderosa's are significantly more decurrent than most conifers... plus those guys had all day....if the tree is a nice ornamental yard tree i'd attempt to spurless (not the most skilled)... but if i'm up in northern vancouver island and my friend who lives surrounded by big trees wants a line of them trimmed for view i'd spike up them... more thanb likely i'd spike up one, then use my claw (grapple) and ascender to swing to the next trees... as clearance said... here on the coast the growing se3ason is long, the winters are mild, the trees are hardy, and everything just grows and grows....

Hey Treeco, or any one else, what you got to say to this? Said much better than I have, should have more wieght for you tree huggers, as Jak spurless climbs sometimes. Well? Lets hear it.