Beautiful Topping

[fishercat]

My GF parents have a white pine topped every few years.

Two LICENSED ARBORISTS do it for them and charge big money.So much for that regulation theory in the other thread.

it looks absolutely horrid! i have tried to talk them out of doing it and it goes in one ear and out the other.

 

[outofmytree]

I usually never say know. Custumers ask for topping from time to time but 99% of the time when you take a minuete out of there day to let them know a few good reasons that topping can basicly ruin a tree, they get real exited at the sound of a crown reduction. H/Os usualy see the light once you show it to them. In an older part of town around here topping is almost an acceptible practice. If a H/O in the area wants a tree topped I will show them one or refer them to one that has had this done to it many years ago. The results are usualy self explanitory, even to an uneducated H/O. If they insist on a nice topping job, always refuse.

Congrats on taking the moral high ground at the potential loss of immediate gain. In the long term you, the client and the tree are winning.

 

[outofmytree]

Two LICENSED ARBORISTS do it for them and charge big money.So much for that regulation theory in the other thread.

it looks absolutely horrid! i have tried to talk them out of doing it and it goes in one ear and out the other.

The key here FC is that YOU know there is a better way. We will never be able to convince all the people that topping is wrong but if we can win over most of em that's a good start. After all there are still people who believe that Neil and Buzz didn't walk on the moon!

 

[fishercat]

i hear ya.

The key here FC is that YOU know there is a better way. We will never be able to convince all the people that topping is wrong but if we can win over most of em that's a good start. After all there are still people who believe that Neil and Buzz didn't walk on the moon!

he offered to start using me but i told him i will not top trees.no way,no how!

i also do not have a state arborist license so legally i cannot trim or prune.i unlike many who do have one,try to follow the rules or just do what i know in my heart is right.

living in east Tennessee really turned me off on topping.i hated looking at topped trees when i lived there and they are everywhere down there.

 

[outofmytree]

he offered to start using me but i told him i will not top trees.no way,no how!

i also do not have a state arborist license.i unlike many who do have one,try to follow the rules or just do what i know in my heart is right.

living in east Tennessee really turned me off on topping.i hated looking at topped trees when i lived there and they are everywhere down there.

Careful mate. You are starting to sound like a liberal tree hugging nancy boy. Like me!

 

[teamtree]

You would hate Southern Indiana if you don't like "topped" trees.

We are trying down here but topping is not going away anytime soon. We can convert some but I try to steer customers away from it.

My dilemna is this......we get many calls to trim trees that were previously topped (say 10 years ago) and now all you have is a short trunk with numerous "knuckles" and then long limbs with very little limb structure until you get to the end. I like to save trees and if possible rehab these trees but sometimes you can't do much with them.

We have tons of Silver Maples in yards around here. Other trees are easier to rehab after a severe topping.

I am beginning to think that is is better to go ahead and top the tree again and then come back the next year to thin to allow for better branch structure.

I am sure it is hard to put a picture to this but I just feel like it is impossible to do a crown reduction (on a tree that has been topped previously) in a manner that is within professional standards. We try but many times there is not a lateral limb 1/3 of the size of what you are cutting in these trees of which I speak.

Well...all I can say is I try to do the right thing but sometimes I feel like it is too hard to accomplish given the situation that I am presented with.

 

[treevet]

You would hate Southern Indiana if you don't like "topped" trees.

We are trying down here but topping is not going away anytime soon. We can convert some but I try to steer customers away from it.

My dilemna is this......we get many calls to trim trees that were previously topped (say 10 years ago) and now all you have is a short trunk with numerous "knuckles" and then long limbs with very little limb structure until you get to the end. I like to save trees and if possible rehab these trees but sometimes you can't do much with them.

We have tons of Silver Maples in yards around here. Other trees are easier to rehab after a severe topping.

I am beginning to think that is is better to go ahead and top the tree again and then come back the next year to thin to allow for better branch structure.

I am sure it is hard to put a picture to this but I just feel like it is impossible to do a crown reduction (on a tree that has been topped previously) in a manner that is within professional standards. We try but many times there is not a lateral limb 1/3 of the size of what you are cutting in these trees of which I speak.

Well...all I can say is I try to do the right thing but sometimes I feel like it is too hard to accomplish given the situation that I am presented with.

While you try to wean them off topping try to wean them off Silver maples as well.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Commonly called crown restoration, wait 2-3 years to thin the sprout branches out.

 

[BC WetCoast]

Two LICENSED ARBORISTS do it for them and charge big money.So much for that regulation theory in the other thread.

it looks absolutely horrid! i have tried to talk them out of doing it and it goes in one ear and out the other.

Once you have topped a conifer, the branches that assume the leader role have poor attachments to the main stem and susceptible to failure. Retopping back to the original topping cut should be done for safety reasons.

 

[treevet]

Two LICENSED ARBORISTS do it for them and charge big money.So much for that regulation theory in the other thread.

it looks absolutely horrid! i have tried to talk them out of doing it and it goes in one ear and out the other.

In theory with the new "Pledge" you sign as a CA.....it is compulsory that you turn the two (if they were ISA) licensed or certified arborists and their certification becomes in jeopardy or discontinued. In a perfect world that is.

I have not seen this "contract" yet nor has my CA groundman.

 

[treevet]

Like to add something else to this thread. Was watching the news as the aftermath of the earthquake found the cameras panning the front of the White house.

There in the right center of the screen, right in front of the White house is a huge tree completely topped.

 

[Rftreeman]

Just remember sgreanbeans, when one of the epi growths on one of his topped tree's fails and hurts someone, he's going to sell his new shop and everything else he owns just to pay the damages. Stick to your guns, do quality work, preach good practices to anyone who will listen and word will eventually get around.

That'll never happen. It might fall and hurt someone, but not within any timeframe that would cause the tree trimmer to be liable. Especially for doing what would be "an industry standard practice".

"What's that?", you say; "Not and industry practice!" ?

Drive around the midwest USA, and look around. Granted, there are fewer now than some years back.

Eventually one day it will happen but until it does........I'll be making payments on my new $500,000.00 shop......lol.:rockn:

 

[clearance]

Once you have topped a conifer, the branches that assume the leader role have poor attachments to the main stem and susceptible to failure. Retopping back to the original topping cut should be done for safety reasons.

This is true. Re topped or cut down.

 

[teamtree]

I pretty much tell any customer that has a Silver Maple that the tree is a poor selection and will develop many problems no matter how you prune it....unless is has been pruned for structure early in it's life.

I really hate working with them.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

I don't understand why people hate silver maples??? The idea that they are weak and brake up more then other species is BS, in my experiance it is only those that are butchered that have a lot of problems.

As for needing a lot of early training, that is any tree. I've been in many hard maples that are junk because there was no early care.

 

[treevet]

I don't understand why people hate silver maples??? The idea that they are weak and brake up more then other species is BS, in my experiance it is only those that are butchered that have a lot of problems.

Silver maples are more prone to damage than other trees. They have been banned by the city of Cincinnati just for that reason. If you want more impressive opinions just read any book on high risk trees and they will verify that opinion.

They over grow out of symmetry, have weak wood, get leaves too early and keep them too late so they hold wet early or late snows respectively. Quite often they have not even been topped but rather cut back after they have busted up from insignificant (to other trees) winds or light loads of snow or ice on them.

If there is a "rat" in the animal world then the Silver maple is the rat in the tree world.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

If there is a "rat" in the animal world then the Silver maple is the rat in the tree world.

You could substitute that with box elder, willows, red maple, ailanthus, green ash, river birch, poplars except for the asymmetry...

I've worked with hundreds of silvers that have survived our heavy winds, and taken down quite a few red oaks that lost canopy in a storm or unseasonal snowfall. Ooo they hold onto dead leaves, which collect snow....

 

[treeseer]

You could substitute that with box elder, willows, red maple, ailanthus, green ash, river birch, poplars except for the asymmetry...

And I understand that there are people called arbolistos who can actually prune silver maples to restore and maintain symmetry.

Any of them folks in Cin city?

 

[treevet]

And I understand that there are people called arbolistos who can actually prune silver maples to restore and maintain symmetry.

Any of them folks in Cin city?

I knew this one would bring you out because we have done this dance before.

You would not have to be a arbolister if the damn tree did not break up so much or grow out of symmetry or a more appropriate was planted now would you?

PS. You prune a Silv. maple and it is gonna grow faster than the usual break neck speed.

 

[treevet]

Ooo they hold onto dead leaves, which collect snow....

Ooooo I said "hold on to live leaves and get leaves early at a time that wet snows are common then"'''

Evaluation of Hazard Trees by Matheny and Clark, pg 80...."Acer Saccharinum- Branch and scaffold failure due to poor branch attachments and decay often in snow and ice storms: Trunk failure from internal decay (Robbins,Smiley) high rate of failure for old mature individuals.

Dirr's Hardy Trees and Shrubs, pg. 25, Acer saccharinum...."once the most widely planted native maple, fallen into disfavor....Broken limbs, limited ornamental attributes, and a gross feeding root system that buckles sidewalks and clogs drains have inhibited its planting. The fastest growing maple species..it is at the same time the most susceptible to breakage in storms......"

I could go on and on but you both know you are fighting a weak fight at best.