I didn't catch what type of trees you are cutting, but when bucking a conifer watch the chips coming from your saw(also watch your tip) when they change color you know that you're getting to the bark usually from white to orangish brown on a ponderosa.
Bucking ? for the pro's
- Thread starter lostone
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Thank you for the info. Also, I've been cutting Pine (Louisiana). Its about a month old now. Just didn't have time to get out there and finish the hauling.
Anyhow, the reason I asked about the possibility of dirt actually stopping the chain, is because that is exactly what has happened to me several times now.
The story: I'm no pro, but I do run a lawn service and from time to time, I have to do storm clean-up etc. Never needed more than my 10 year old Poulan 16" homeowner saw.
So about a month ago, I decided to take several Pines out of my yard. Bought a brand new Stihl MS390. Dropped the trees and they laid there for several weeks.
So last week, I get time to start sawing and hauling. About half a tank full, and suddenly, right in the middle of my cut (full throttle) the chain comes to a sudden dead stop. So, I'm pissed off of course, but I figure I should just take the saw to the shop and let them worry about it since its under warranty. The guy takes the chain off and cleans the bar, gets the end sprocket freed, and I'm off, happy.
Next day same exact thing happens again. This time I get to go to the back and talk to the mechanic. He's never heard of this. Asks how old is the wood, etc. (I'm thinking, age of the wood has nothing to do with this, because I've sawed up old logs many, many times with my junk Poulan and this has never happened). Anyhow, he fixes it, I go home, start sawing again. What do ya know! 5 minutes of sawing and the same thing happens.
Once again, back to the shop. Finally, after lots of interrogation, he asks if I got the saw in any dirt. "Well, yeah once in a while I run into a little becaues the logs are lying on the ground. The saw kicks up a quick cloud, no big deal. . ." He says, oh no, ANY dirt that gets in this thing is going to do this. . .The he and the other mechanic swear up and down that this is a NoNo. I told them I've done this for years in normal use with my junk homeowner Poulan and it has never even bogged down from it. . .just tore up the chain. . .They go on to say, well yer just gonna have to keep it out of the dirt. Prop up the logs or do whatever you have to do, but keep the chain out of the dirt.
So I finished the rest of my work (on the same old logs that are the same age as the ones that I had trouble with, didn't hit and dirt, and the saw now works great.
My question is: Have you ever heard of a little dirt stopping a chainsaw????????? Are they feeding me crap. . .did I buy a junk saw or are they telling me like it is???
Thanks in advance.
Anyhow, the reason I asked about the possibility of dirt actually stopping the chain, is because that is exactly what has happened to me several times now.
The story: I'm no pro, but I do run a lawn service and from time to time, I have to do storm clean-up etc. Never needed more than my 10 year old Poulan 16" homeowner saw.
So about a month ago, I decided to take several Pines out of my yard. Bought a brand new Stihl MS390. Dropped the trees and they laid there for several weeks.
So last week, I get time to start sawing and hauling. About half a tank full, and suddenly, right in the middle of my cut (full throttle) the chain comes to a sudden dead stop. So, I'm pissed off of course, but I figure I should just take the saw to the shop and let them worry about it since its under warranty. The guy takes the chain off and cleans the bar, gets the end sprocket freed, and I'm off, happy.
Next day same exact thing happens again. This time I get to go to the back and talk to the mechanic. He's never heard of this. Asks how old is the wood, etc. (I'm thinking, age of the wood has nothing to do with this, because I've sawed up old logs many, many times with my junk Poulan and this has never happened). Anyhow, he fixes it, I go home, start sawing again. What do ya know! 5 minutes of sawing and the same thing happens.
Once again, back to the shop. Finally, after lots of interrogation, he asks if I got the saw in any dirt. "Well, yeah once in a while I run into a little becaues the logs are lying on the ground. The saw kicks up a quick cloud, no big deal. . ." He says, oh no, ANY dirt that gets in this thing is going to do this. . .The he and the other mechanic swear up and down that this is a NoNo. I told them I've done this for years in normal use with my junk homeowner Poulan and it has never even bogged down from it. . .just tore up the chain. . .They go on to say, well yer just gonna have to keep it out of the dirt. Prop up the logs or do whatever you have to do, but keep the chain out of the dirt.
So I finished the rest of my work (on the same old logs that are the same age as the ones that I had trouble with, didn't hit and dirt, and the saw now works great.
My question is: Have you ever heard of a little dirt stopping a chainsaw????????? Are they feeding me crap. . .did I buy a junk saw or are they telling me like it is???
Thanks in advance.
Newfie
Addicted to ArboristSite
Keep your chain out of the dirt!! Practicing that will certainly help you keep more in tune with what the he!! is actually going on and may save you from pinching the bar or having it kick back and bite you. Doing stupid stuff and getting away with it so far doesn't mean it's the right way to do it.
Crofter
Addicted to ArboristSite
It is not dirt that is stopping the saw but after you have hit dirt, your saw is dull. Not maybe! It is no longer fully sharp and as such it will need to be forced into the wood. It will cut much finer and powdery chips that such up the bar oil and the heat produced bakes the wood dust and pitch into the bar groove and especially the area around the sprocket nose. This causes more friction and more heat and you are in a vicious circle that was started the second you hit the dirt and took the edge off your cutters. It is only the edge that does the cutting; the rest of the cutter merely wedges and guides the severed wood. There is no such thing as being a little bit dull. You also should have your saw sharpened so that you do not have to push any more than the saws weight since forcing the bar against the chain also creates heat. You may be bogging out the cluch in addition.
Thanks for the adivce. The last thing I ever want to so is put my self in a position to get hurt. I read the owner's manual and took it to heart. But obviously it didn't tell me everything I need to know. However, trying my best to cut a log that is 80 feet long and lying on the ground in an indention that is left several inches deep shouldn't count as being stupid. As I said in my original post, I'm not a pro. Just looking for some answers.
Crofter, thank you. That makes alot of sense. I'm learning alot as I go along, especially from the friendly folks here in Arborsite.
Ok. . . getting the chain in dirt is bad for the chain, the saw, etc.
But have any of you guys actually had dirt STOP your chain?
Ok. . . getting the chain in dirt is bad for the chain, the saw, etc.
But have any of you guys actually had dirt STOP your chain?
Crofter
Addicted to ArboristSite
"But have any of you guys actually had dirt STOP your chain? "
NO!
Woodpeckers have hard heads!
You don't seem to be listening: Re read my previous post.
wiley_p
ArboristSite Guru
i used to use this trick when cutting firewood in hiugh school, It only works well on smaller diameter logs (18") cut a notch in one end, stick the plate of your handyman jack in there crank it up some, stick a peice if wood under the end and presto another 10-12 cuts are off the ground, after that you can usually roll the log easy with a peavy, or repeat the process again.
Crofter
Addicted to ArboristSite
Pecker, Yes i said "NO" to the question "Did any of you guys actually have DIRT stop your chain" Below is a post about cutting dirt. It is a bit crusty, but rather sums it up.
RockyJSquirrel
Arboristsite MVP
Registered: Dec 2002
Location: FL
Posts: 3423
Grateful is absolutely right. That is exactly why I didn't recommend any brand, because no saw will perform well for someone who cannot run or maintain it. The improper mix thing is a biggie, most neighbors of mine have a different can of mix for every different two-cycle they own and I doubt 20% are mixed properly.
It takes a reasonably adept person about a year of steady saw use to get half decent. Until then, they grind the saw into the dirt on almost every cut and couldn't tell you if it was dull or not. Took me 2 or 3 lil crappy Poulans before I learned how to file a chain, then I started paying more attention to what I was doing.
So anyway, when someone asks "What brand of saw should I buy, I never owned one before", there really isn't an acceptable answer. I think the closest I can come up with now is a simple "It doesn't matter, they all cut flesh".
Good luck Mr. new saw owner.
__________________
Chaos, panic, and disorder -- my work here is done.
Sarcasm is just one more service we offer.
RockyJSquirrel
Arboristsite MVP
Registered: Dec 2002
Location: FL
Posts: 3423
Grateful is absolutely right. That is exactly why I didn't recommend any brand, because no saw will perform well for someone who cannot run or maintain it. The improper mix thing is a biggie, most neighbors of mine have a different can of mix for every different two-cycle they own and I doubt 20% are mixed properly.
It takes a reasonably adept person about a year of steady saw use to get half decent. Until then, they grind the saw into the dirt on almost every cut and couldn't tell you if it was dull or not. Took me 2 or 3 lil crappy Poulans before I learned how to file a chain, then I started paying more attention to what I was doing.
So anyway, when someone asks "What brand of saw should I buy, I never owned one before", there really isn't an acceptable answer. I think the closest I can come up with now is a simple "It doesn't matter, they all cut flesh".
Good luck Mr. new saw owner.
__________________
Chaos, panic, and disorder -- my work here is done.
Sarcasm is just one more service we offer.
Wiley, that's kind of what I ended up doing but I was using about a 5" diameter log next to a 20" log and then prying up the 20" log with the smaller one as a pivot point. Pain in the butt way to do it though. What's a handyman jack?
Newfie
Addicted to ArboristSite
"However, trying my best to cut a log that is 80 feet long and lying on the ground in an indention that is left several inches deep shouldn't count as being stupid"
Let me rephrase. I didn't mean to call you stupid, that wasn't the intention. However if you are going to stick your chain in the dirt on every cut for 80 feet of tree, that is stupid. Try to slow down, let the saw cut. Don't rush and observe as you go. Cut the 80 foot stem into 4 or 5 managable pieces that you can roll by yourself. make all your cuts on those logs almost all the way through and then roll each log to finish the cuts. voila!!, your chances of sticking the chain in the dirt are greatly reduced.
Get a plastic wedge or two, because if you are having trouble sticking the chain in the dirt, you are inevitably have trouble discerning when the saw kerf is gonna pinch closed on the bar and keep your saw.
Let me rephrase. I didn't mean to call you stupid, that wasn't the intention. However if you are going to stick your chain in the dirt on every cut for 80 feet of tree, that is stupid. Try to slow down, let the saw cut. Don't rush and observe as you go. Cut the 80 foot stem into 4 or 5 managable pieces that you can roll by yourself. make all your cuts on those logs almost all the way through and then roll each log to finish the cuts. voila!!, your chances of sticking the chain in the dirt are greatly reduced.
Get a plastic wedge or two, because if you are having trouble sticking the chain in the dirt, you are inevitably have trouble discerning when the saw kerf is gonna pinch closed on the bar and keep your saw.
Newfie, no offense taken.
On that 80 footer, my approach actually was to cut it into sections that I could handle. The dirt problem arose mostly near the base of the tree(s) where it had left an indention in the soil as it fell. In other words, the log was kind of like this. . .bear with me
000
000000
00000000
000000
------------------
000
Except, imagine that the log were round shaped as they are (my graphic turned out a little disproportionate. . .you'll have to use your imagination).
As you can see (hopefully), there is a point at which it would be difficult to keep the saw out of the dirt on such a cut (for an inexperienced sawyer like myself at least).
I like the wedge idea. Thanks for the info. Its destined to help. I'd like to get some practice using a wedge. Where would I buy one? Any recommended brand? Place to buy online?
Thanks again.
On that 80 footer, my approach actually was to cut it into sections that I could handle. The dirt problem arose mostly near the base of the tree(s) where it had left an indention in the soil as it fell. In other words, the log was kind of like this. . .bear with me
000
000000
00000000
000000
------------------
000
Except, imagine that the log were round shaped as they are (my graphic turned out a little disproportionate. . .you'll have to use your imagination).
As you can see (hopefully), there is a point at which it would be difficult to keep the saw out of the dirt on such a cut (for an inexperienced sawyer like myself at least).
I like the wedge idea. Thanks for the info. Its destined to help. I'd like to get some practice using a wedge. Where would I buy one? Any recommended brand? Place to buy online?
Thanks again.
MasterBlaster
TreeHouse Elder
Pecker, where you iz in La?
I'm in Aleck...
I'm in Aleck...
NeTree
Addicted to ArboristSite
You can get plastic wedges- which is the only acceptable material for anything exceot splitting, by the way- from any store that sells logging supplies. Get at least two.
Since you're not experienced at felling yet, have a peek at this thread...
http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16149
Since you're not experienced at felling yet, have a peek at this thread...
http://www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16149
Crofter
Addicted to ArboristSite
If the log has been on the ground for a while, the dirt will be embedded in the bark. Even if you lift it or roll it over you will have to chop the bark off with the axe, in a band across the path the chain will take. I just finished cutting up the sleeper pieces from under a semi load of firewood. Takes extra time for sure, but you can spend it cleaning the wood or else repairing the bar and chain!
husky runner
ArboristSite Lurker
cutting dirt
If you keep hitting the dirt under the tree on the ground while cutting fire wood everyone knows to avoid this take the entire length of the bar and plunge cut a trench under the log and take the dirt out with a shovel and then you wont hit dirt on the ground
If you keep hitting the dirt under the tree on the ground while cutting fire wood everyone knows to avoid this take the entire length of the bar and plunge cut a trench under the log and take the dirt out with a shovel and then you wont hit dirt on the ground
