DR Rapid Fire Rack & Pinion

[dancan]

Since I have no experience with a rack & pinion splitter I won't tell you how to build it but if I look at it from a commercial production point of view , MNGuns view an a proper tailor setup as an option may generate some sales and help differentiate your product from others . Log lifts and conveyors might be nice options to buy if available .
It looks to me that you could configure the mechanical parts of your splitter into a few different splitters models to cover a broader field of users .
If any of these ideas were mentioned before I got to post them I just want to go on record that I thought of them first .
If you need a tester to see how they'll last in our harsh Canadian Atlantic Eastern seaboard climate , I'm your guy LOL !

 

[wampum]

I have a limited amount of time with this type of splitter,but I have used one.My biggest complaint with it is its balance when trying to move it. I suggest a solid beam under the
splitter that the support legs would stand on. These legs would have a solid bolt or pin at the bottom and about 6 inches up another hole and pin that can be removed. When you are
done splitting and ready to tow the top pins would be removed and the splitter would simply fold down for transport. This splitter is fairly top heavy,so a spring or jack would have to be
installed to help raise or lower the splitter as it folds forward. This jack could be hydraulic,or screw powered. Once the splitter folded forward in the down position it would be pinned in
place while traveling. The beam would go from the axel to the tongue and be easy to hook up to your quad,tractor or truck.This would give you the best of both worlds a good towing
splitter and a good height to split with.

 

[KiwiBro]

This is why I like this forum so much. Constructive people offering ideas and kicking about options. Long may it continue.

 

[Pcoz88]

The rack and pinion splitter made here in Ohio ,the two fly wheels have a key way. .Does the DR machine???How are the fly wheels held on???



Pete

 

[Cmccul8146]

To keep both hands working the wood, was the thought I raised that seemed to escape your attention.
I'll take it the warranty voiding aftermarket mod musing above also escaped your attention, not to mention, by your own reasoning (which I'll address separately below) later on in your post, - if you haven't seen [sic] it then you might just have "NO idea what a [perpetual cycling option]" is let alone really be sure just how dangerous it is, as if the myriad tools and machinery used to get the wood in a state it can be split are in themselves perfectly safe in the hands of imbeciles.
Unless you are saying it takes three people to make a SS or DR really hum, I don't see the point of that comment b/c unless the labour is dirt cheap or the output per labour unit is better when there are three manic workers keeping the SS or DR going, or the target market is domestic users only who either don't give a rat's about production or have many willing volunteers to help them, then throwing more people at a splitter begs the question of whether that's ultimately worth it. I thought the point of this splitter was the amount of wood one user could hum through, given the splitters claim to fame as the fastest of it's kind?
With respect, bollix. If by "never seen" you mean never been around one or worked with one, then I agree there is nothing like using a machine and getting to know how to use it well to get the most from it, but it's abject lunacy to suggest one cannot get an appreciation for the cycle times by watching the videos which are themselves real people using a real machine on real wood, after all. I know you've built one and have accumulated plenty of knowledge about them and will know far more about them than I, but to suggest not using one disqualifies others from appreciating their speed is just ridiculous, frankly.
You know something - it just occurred to me that is probably a similar argument hydraulic splitter salespeople use to scare people off those evil, finger-eating, viciously fast 2-second rack and pinion splitters the competition sell.

Nothing, nothing at all. But I'd rather, when the wood isn't knotty, have both hands being productive, which, forgive me if I'm wrong, is the point of the auto cycle in the first place, isn't it?

As someone who has built his own, why do you think the DR has the supports and lower table and do you consider that better than the flush table with no supports?

Did you build yours to be tow-able?

KiwiBro, Product Liability insurance does not have to cover any user mods, only what the manufacturer produces. You must not live in the USA or you would know how lawsuit crazy people are here, & the Judges & Juries are even crazier with some of their "awards" One lawsuit could easily put a company out of business. I do have mine made so that the ram stops about 2 inches short of the wedge for added safety, but I don't build them commercially, and no one else runs mine.

As far as knowing what a perpetual cycling machine is, yes I do. I own & operate a machine shop & build all sorts of specialty machines , some continuous cycling, some operator activated. And I don't think you or anyone else can move fast enough to split a round, reposition it for the next split which would be in about 1 second,and not get seriously hurt.

No ,I am not saying that it takes 3 people to run one of these splitters efficently. What I said was one Flywheel splitter can keep 3 people busy. That would be 1 guy splitting & 2 guys stacking or loading. You did mention the best method of moving the wood by using a conveyor, though.

You can get an idea how fast these splitters are by watching videos, but when you actually run one or see one run, then you'll appreciate how fast 2 seconds goes by. So I still stand by my conviction that a coutinuous cycle would be far too dangerous on these machines.

Personally I don't like the log supports on the DR table. Without them, I just slide my wood back onto the beam & make another split. With heavier pieces it would be more trouble lifting it back onto the beam. Another thing is that I don't always split right down the middle, but start on edges on hickory, elm, sweetgum, etc. But that's just my opinion, since I haven't ever used any supports.

I bolted a piece of steel flatbar onto the very bottom of the leg on wedge end using U bolts. Just have a hole in the end to drop a pin thru to tow behind my garden tractor. I have towed it on the highway ,a couple of miles each way, behind my MF 135 tractor to split a few cords for my cousin. I mostly just tow it around my yard though.

One other thing you mentioned in another post is positioning the round away from the wedge & ramming the wood at it to split. I always position my wood against the wedge & it splits just fine.

 

[Cmccul8146]

Towable Splitter

4 or 5 years ago, Paul at SS was building a towable splitter, but I think he discontinued them for some reason. The whole machine was lowered for towing, & raised back up for splitting. I think the axle length was the same on all models, but the towable version had highway rated tires, similar to pontoon boat trailer tires. I didn't actually see him raising & lowering it ,but did see it in both positions & hitched up to his truck after the demo in 2007.Towable model was a few hundred more. Was a very nice machine.

 

[William Balaska]

My suggestion is to get it to your consumers for $2000 out the door. I have been using a 22 ton MTD for the last 16 years which I bought new. I am ready to upgrade and have looked at these and other splitters like them but I feel manufacturers have developed greed to some sense. If a guy with fabrication ability can build one for $500 the manufactuter can to and is getting a fair profit selling one for $2000. I owned a DR string trimmer for some time it was great by all means I'm not nocking the company because I feel they honor what they build but I'm tired of being squeezed to death so a company can show huge quarterly profits. Start thinking about us peons please. I am considering a wood wolf right now but I am still going to negotiate even at their price before I buy.

 

[Locust Cutter]

Let me jump in again...We are absolutely paying attention here at DR. We have always been driven by innovation, with a passion for high-quality design. And like many of you, we have no use for ordinary products...so we're listening and willing to do what it takes to absolutely be the best.

The insight offered here by Dancan, MMGUNS, sunfish and others is greatly appreciated -- even if not entirely flattering:smile2: We've introduced a rack & pinion splitter that we're damn proud of but we won't rest there. To prove it, I want to further encourage you to give us your insight on how to make this the BEST splitter on the market. So, here's what I'm proposing:

For the next 7 days I will follow this thread and every person that suggests a sincere idea for improving our design I'll put their name into a hat and send the winner these chaps chainsaw chaps -- a $75 value!

Please send us your design ideas -- we really appreciate the passion and knowledge of splitters that can only be found is this community.

Let me preface this by stating that I have NO experience with flywheel splitters, but have been using various hyd designs (and mauls, wedges and axes since about 6) for about 24 years. I DO however have a B.S. in Farmer/Rancher Ad Hoc engineering,...

1. The telescopic idea for the power plant could be a real winner. Alternatively, how hard would it be to have 3 flywheels; 2 Small ones (roughly 1/2-1/3 of the total weight needed for reliable operation) up high, where the current ones are mounted and the 3rd larger one (1/2-2/3 total weight) mounted beneath the machine to lower the center of gravity and balance the machine for manual handling?

2. Log Loading: Seeing as there is no HYD service on a machine like this, how about an add-on (removable) manually operated (muscle powered) side table with a removable pole handle for the lifting leverage (or a small manual jack somewhat akin to a trailer tongue jack for liability purposes)? I could draw and email a picture if necessary, but what I'm envisioning here is a pin-on table with eyelet receptacles welded on both sides of the machine for convenient bi-directional mounting, which would accept a standard symmetrically designed log cradle. If done right, it should be able to pivot over the unit and be stowed in that position for towing/handling and would provide an added benefit of cover/protection of the rack from inclement weather. The lifting mechanism could be as simple as a removable, contoured, shovel-style handle (3-5' tall) similar to the entry assist handle on newer Ford Super Duties, (NOT a FORD fan, but I DO love my Super Duty). Otherwise either a trailer tongue jack could be used, OR, a come-along mounted to the bottom (ground end) of the cradle, with either a central attachment point, or 2 if necessary (1 for each side, based of of possible rack clearance/interference issues). The Log Lift, like the work table, could be removed for more compact storage should the owner desire/need such, and be marketed as such.

3. Wedge: Your wedge may be wonderfully efficient. BUT, based off of conversations w/S.S. owners (and hopefully soon to be supported by hands-on experience w/a friends S.S @ a coming GTG) Their wedge seems to be about an inch too' short and about 0.25-0.5" too' narrow. It would be nice to see a removable wedge feature/option (slip-on design) for a variety of options, based of the consumer's needs/desires/constraints (Production time/Efficiency/Wood Type). Ideally I'd think a Short 2-way for kindling, a Tall 2-way for normal use and and optional 4-way for those splitting 15" thick (Wide) and narrower wood, that could be quickly and more efficiently be split w/one pass instead of 2 or more, thus reducing handling time.

I have NO doubts that Your unit, The S.S., or the Wood Wolf would be immensely faster in most wood than my 35 ton Speeco. It has been a great unit so far and I do not regret purchasing it. However, I will be buying a flywheel unit in the next 6-18 months to maximize my productivity and grant me more time with my babies while they're still young. I won't mind splitting all-day when I'm older and they're out of the house, but for now, the Air Force dominates enough of my time and while I dearly enjoy the entire firewood process, I won't regret not spending more time working up wood when I'm dying. Spending time with my children however,...

I apologize for the run-on sentences and the soapbox ending (worked all-night and am getting ready for bed), but if this helps make the product any better than it already is, then it will be worth it. I would like to see that if ANYONE's design ideas get incorporated into a new model, they be allowed a trial run at the "beta-copy" test-mule, even if liability/indemnity waivers have to be signed.

My $0.02
-Bryan

 

[pdhowell]

Idea on splitter safety improvement

Let me jump in again...We are absolutely paying attention here at DR. We have always been driven by innovation, with a passion for high-quality design. And like many of you, we have no use for ordinary products...so we're listening and willing to do what it takes to absolutely be the best.

The insight offered here by Dancan, MMGUNS, sunfish and others is greatly appreciated -- even if not entirely flattering:smile2: We've introduced a rack & pinion splitter that we're damn proud of but we won't rest there. To prove it, I want to further encourage you to give us your insight on how to make this the BEST splitter on the market. So, here's what I'm proposing:

For the next 7 days I will follow this thread and every person that suggests a sincere idea for improving our design I'll put their name into a hat and send the winner these chaps chainsaw chaps -- a $75 value!

Please send us your design ideas -- we really appreciate the passion and knowledge of splitters that can only be found is this community.

Thanks for asking about possible improvements to your splitter. Forums like this work because you get so many good inputs.

As one who has a hydraulic splitter, the one time I got in trouble is when I caught my sleeve on a sharp corner of the moving wedge that was auto retracting. Since that sleeve was on the same hand that was controlling the valve, I had to reach across my body and the splitter with my free hand to prevent a real problem.

I would propose that you round the edges of your impact head, or perhaps covering the non wood contact parts with a plastic shroud to reduce the likelihood of catching gloves or sleeves.

 

[Hddnis]

Couple of things:

I'll add another vote to the real usable trailer option, good for highway speeds.

Could it be made to just mount in a reciever hitch?



Mr. HE

 

[KiwiBro]

I don't see where my beer goes on these machines. Is there a can holder like on my lawn tractor? :hmm3grin2orange:hic.

 

[Circle B MN]

I don't see where my beer goes on these machines. Is there a can holder like on my lawn tractor? :hmm3grin2orange:hic.

As a big fan of beer and booze, I will say this one machine that can do without a cupholder..:msp_thumbup:

 

[KiwiBro]

As a big fan of beer and booze, I will say this one machine that can do without a cupholder..:msp_thumbup:

Yeah, although just think what a great cooler a few panes on those flywheels could be.

Regarding the telescoping vert' supports for lowering/raising the motor/flywheels for towing and different operator heights, why not just throw a heavy duty spring down the pipe so it supports the weight to the point it takes naff all force to lower or raise the unit as need be. It could double as suspension for towing (not independent, but some suspension none the less).

 

[Pcoz88]

Speedco has come out with there own rack and pinion splitter.There on TSC web page.!!!WHOA!$ and its towable!!!!!$1699.

 

[Circle B MN]

While the SpeedPro's design is a bit more unique, I think it has a long ways to go to compare to the SS or even the DR.

For one the thing looks thin, real thin, like fold in half kind of thin. It appears as if the table height is right about level with my knees. I don't care to spend the day working on a machine bent over. I see others where the beam is nearly on the ground, what is the concept..?

The work table is boxed in so your finished pieces don't flow off the end. It has those darn guides on the beam so you have to lift ever piece repeatedly rather than slide, and the table does not come down each side of the beam.

The tongue is still on the output end of the machine, so even if you could slide product right off the table, you still have to unhook the tongue by some means to be able to back up to a conveyor. By putting the tongue on the opposite end of the table, you can windrow your piles as far as your heart desires by just moving the tow vehicle ahead a bit.

While it does appear towable, it's really not what I had in mind for highway travel. I would not be comfortable dragging that down I-94.

While it is could certainly be a great splitter for the homeowner, It does not appear to me to be the commercial type machine that the SS, or even the DR are. It is priced accordingly. You get what you pay for.

The more this thread goes on, the more I am inclined to head out to the shop and fix this thing myself. While I don't care to be in the manufacturing business, I am confident that whom ever gets this thing right is going to do well with it in the commercial market.

 

[sunfish]

Speedco has come out with there own rack and pinion splitter.There on TSC web page.!!!WHOA!$ and its towable!!!!!$1699.

Speedco :msp_rolleyes: I'd rather have the DR, if I could modify the auto cycle. DR has
basically copied the best and stayed fairly true to the original design.

But I already have the better splitter!

Like said in the other thread, the exposure to these flywheel splitters is goin to take off.

People will soon learn which one is best...

 

[mooseracing]

People will soon learn which one is best...

None yet.

Someone needs to make one that is actually movable with large tires. Same goes for hydraulic splitters, none except commercial ones come with a 14" or 15" tire.

 

[sunfish]

None yet.

Someone needs to make one that is actually movable with large tires. Same goes for hydraulic splitters, none except commercial ones come with a 14" or 15" tire.

I don't need to tow my SS on the road, but it would be a nice 'add on option' for those that need it.

I will fix up a way to hook mine to the tractor or 4 wheeler soon though.

 

[Circle B MN]

A towable model should wear 205/75R15 tires to allow good clearance. It is a commonly avaliable trailer tire size. The smaller snowmbile and utility trailer sized tires just don't cut it for a commercial machine. I think also that it should have a 3500 lb axle, not that it weighs anything near that, but it is the smallest axle IMO that has a bearing large enough for highway use.

I'm going to have to take the time to sketch this thing out for you guys. I believe that amongst us commercial users / owners, we could designa darn good machine. We're somebody to want to manufacture it, we would perhaps be interested in exchanging our interest in the machine, for a couple few finished products...

 

[mooseracing]

I don't need to tow my SS on the road,

I'm mainly looking at less handling to where I stack the wood.

So IF I could drag that splitter to where I cut the wood that would be at least 1 times less I have to handle it. I couldn't drag any incarnation of the flywheel splitters, there is almost 0 of my land that is flat besides part of the driveway.

Hopefully this competition brings more innovation and features for the end user.