Filing after sharpening with the chain grinder

[Philbert]

I’ve never seen a slasher use a grinder in almost 40 years of oil exploration work in the bush.

I'm not a 'slasher'. Different stuff for different folks in different settings? I'm home most nights after cutting.

I am not sure if they use a grinder when back home to fix badly rocked chains, but they don’t pack one to camp.

Old school lumber camps had full time saw smiths and shops to sharpen and tune the crosscut saws every few days. Cutters in the field just did touch ups.

The few times an experienced pro has sharpened my chain it has been with a file and has shown me that my technique is merely adequate.

I have often stated that hand filing chains is like sex; a lot of guys probably think that they are better than they are.

Most of us can learn a thing or two if we are open to it. .

No way does a factory chain cut like a chain filed by someone who really knows what they are doing.

No one is saying that factory chains are perfect; the angles are set for general use.

Once you understand what you are trying to achieve, and how to use the tools, there are lots of ways to get there.

A file does not 'sharpen' a chain; it is only one tool that someone might use to create certain angles, restore cutting edges, etc. Same thing with a grinder.

Either one can also be used to destroy a perfectly serviceable chain if the user does not know how to use it or what they are trying to achieve.

Philbert

 

[president]

We have had many of these discussions before. Some of it even depends on your definition of the word 'sharpen'.

For some, it means 'touching up', or 'maintaining' sharp edges. For others, it means reshaping angles, or repairing damaged/abused cutters.

Philbert

good analogy,

 

[CR888]

Philberts right, any chain enhancing tool is only as good as the guy 'behind the wheel' so to speak. Factory grinds can be very different from roll to roll or loop to loop. Once again how the factory grind is set up including profile of cutting wheel etc are not always consistent and vary a lot.

CR888 I have spent very little time in Australia so do not know all the trees you would need to deal with. I do not clean a saw until the chain comes off and bar gets turned over. Do the saws and bar needs to be cleaned more than every other week? When I am cutting a chain will last up to two days which is about 12 to 14 hours of use. Thanks

Yeah I only clean down my saws at the end of the day when home with the compressor. Here the wood species are very dense, pretty much all the wood will sink in water like concrete. Cutting for two days on the one chain is a far fetched dream for me. On average I'll get about 1.5-2.5 tanks of fuel with semi chisel chain. Full chisel is not really an option sadly, it can work on pole saws, and top handles even bucking but the wood must be green and softer than most. Some dry swamp gum and others will near destroy the chisel point in one cut. I love full chisel chain & square chisel but its not used for work on a daily basis. The chips & noodles can jam up sprockets and be difficult to remove from bar rails so when the bars are wet with oil at the end of the day its time too clean them out so your ready for the next day. If a bar is left without cleaning and put away for a while and the crud dries up, it becomes difficult to remove. Stihl Australia only delivers new saws with 063 gauge chain unless its a smaller saw that runs Picco. You won't find an 050 bar for sale here at a dealer unless it for lo pro/Picco. I learned the hard way after buying a bunch of Tsumura & Sugi bars out of the states in 050. It will work sort of OK but will give you problems used daily. All my big saw bars are 063 gauge from 50cc up. It also means with a nose sprocket swap a 3/8 bar can become a 404 bar. I find .404 very economical chain in chipper/semi chisel, it will stay sharp the longest and offer the most wood cut per loop as the cutters have so much meat on them for many sharpening. But only my 5 cube and up saws run .404, I run 3/8 RM & .325 RM on smaller saws mostly. But all of this would change if I were to cut in a high rainfall part of the globe where wood was a bit easier to deal with & less taxing on me and my gear. I'd love to have a Simington grinder and have chains last 4+ tanks of fuel.....now that would be like chainsaw heaven.

 

[user 122190]

I'm committing to hand filing as SOP. I ordered a dozen Pferd 7/32 round files. I'm curious about 13/64 round files (1/64th smaller in dia). Are they used instead of the 7/32nds or are they for some specialty sharpening after working with the 7/32nd?

 

[HarleyT]

Using a round file, using the correct diameter is essential if you want the correct angle.

 

[HarleyT]

Each brand/model chain has different cutters, and the cutter height changes as the chain is filed back, so saying one file correctly fits all of a certain pitch chain is wrong.

 

[user 122190]

I get it. I have been filing in to the link as the cutter is reduced. Sounds like I need to order some 13/64ths files also.

Each brand/model chain has different cutters, and the cutter height changes as the chain is filed back, so saying one file correctly fits all of a certain pitch chain is wrong.

 

[Ted Jenkins]

It is all rubbish but the great debate goes on. The pics and video are awesome. I am considering making some videos Thanks

 

[HarleyT]

Rubbish?

 

[Philbert]

I'm curious about 13/64 round files (1/64th smaller in dia). Are they used instead of the 7/32nds or are they for some specialty sharpening after working with the 7/32nd?

Oregon specs 7/32" for their full sized 3/8 pitch chain. STIHL specs 13/64" for theirs. Different chains have different profiles. Different manufacturers have different ideas of what is 'ideal'. Starting with the manufacturers' specifications is always a good idea.

Some people change file diameters as the cutters get filed / ground back and smaller. Some people experiment with different size files. I was surprised to find a noticable difference between a 5/32 and 11/64 (4.5mm) file with Oregon Type 90 chain. Let us know what you try and what results you get.

Each brand/model chain has different cutters,

Yeah. What the Rottweiler said.

Philbert

 

[HarleyT]

I used to put up the Oregon chain models 33sl and 21lp, both .325 pitch.
Hopefully no one would use the same file on both chains....

 

[user 122190]

My cutting is mostly done for the year. I've got some mix left and I am helping a neighbor out till it is all gone. My sharpening is going to be quick and dirty without a lot of testing this year. I did order the spectrum of files for my 3/8 chains. Pferd 7/32 (or 14/64) (pack of 12), 13/64 (pack of 6), and 3/16 (or 12/64)(pack of 6). Damn fractions!!! Must think to make the purchases.

Oregon specs 7/32" for their full sized 3/8 pitch chain. STIHL specs 13/64" for theirs. Different chains have different profiles. Different manufacturers have different ideas of what is 'ideal'. Starting with the manufacturers' specifications is always a good idea.

Some people change file diameters as the cutters get filed / ground back and smaller. Some people experiment with different size files. I was surprised to find a noticable difference between a 5/32 and 11/64 (4.5mm) file with Oregon Type 90 chain. Let us know what you try and what results you get.


Yeah. What the Rottweiler said.

Philbert

 

[Philbert]

The '64ths' help me keep them straight too!

Philbert

 

[user 122190]

Got out yesterday with the newly sharpened chains. The saw chain I did for the neighbor had the guy grinning from ear to ear. Earned me a 6 pack of Moose Drool beer. His Echo 590 was cutting faster then I had ever seen, and was keeping up with my 461. We were cutting up a huge logging operation fallen >24" white pine. We cut up a cord and were loaded in about an hours time.

I knew it was an improvement, but Wow! Hand filing after the grinder is now SOP.

 

[user 122190]

Damn! All my chains are sharp. All my ordered files are in, handles too, labeled and hung in a wall rack that I created for them. But everything is sharp.

 

[Philbert]

Time to start taking in the neighbors' laundry?

Philbert

 

[HarleyT]

Time to start taking in the neighbors' laundry?

Philbert

It depends on what she looks like!!!

 

[Henry3120xp]

The implication that you can take a chain off put on another chain adjust it to proper tension and be up and running in under 10 minutes I reject. On top of that you can sharpen said chain in under 5 minutes from set up to finish while going on to the next. If you can do that well even close to what you say then you are extra special. The point is that you have a MO that works well for you and you are happy with the results then no body asked you to change anything just keep doing the tasks the way you always have. Using anything that requires electricity is not an option for me. My MO is likely the fastest and cheapest. On average addressing my 30'' .404 rollomatic takes about 15 minutes with out going father than my vice screwed into the nearest stump. This process works for me. Thanks

Just because you can’t do something doesn’t mean others can’t. I can’t understand how it could take more than 3 minutes to swap a chain.

 

[Henry3120xp]

As I said I reject the implication. Thanks

So you think the video is a liar too?

 

[Henry3120xp]

Using anything that requires electricity is not an option for me

CR888 This would also be after a full days work followed by a clean down of my saws/bars with compressed air

So is your compressor a foot pump model or were you not being honest about electricity?