Flowtron Screw driven electric wood splitter. Anybody used one ?

[machinistbcb]

I just bought a used Flowtron electric wood splitter. The ram is driven back on forth on a threaded screw. The screw is driven by a small electric gear-motor. It is rated at 10 ton, I think, but it seems to lack power and it often kicks out the built in breaker. Any body used one of these before ? Is the lack of power to be expected ?

Thanks for any help,

Brian

 

[drmiller100]

an electric splitter is either going to be really slow, or really weak, or both.

no replacement for displacmeent, and you are running a 1 horse motor, where the typical entry level, small gas splitters are 5 horsepower plus.

 

[rx7145]

an electric splitter is either going to be really slow, or really weak, or both.

My cycle time is 12sec (no load) on my electric splitter. And that's with a 30inch stroke. Power is just a little less than my 8hp briggs. opcorn:

 

[machinistbcb]

This isn't your normal electric wood splitter. Like I said it is driven by a electric gear-motor, basic a 1/4 h.p. electric motor with a reduction gear box attached to it. The gear box is directly coupled to an 1.5 inch dia. all thread screw about 36 inchs long. The ram threads back and forth on the screw. There is a wedge on each end of the splitter which allows it to split in both directions. I think it should really have quite a bit of power but I am not sure, thats why I was wondering if anyone else has used one.

 

[mga]

This isn't your normal electric wood splitter. Like I said it is driven by a electric gear-motor, basic a 1/4 h.p. electric motor with a reduction gear box attached to it. The gear box is directly coupled to an 1.5 inch dia. all thread screw about 36 inchs long. The ram threads back and forth on the screw. There is a wedge on each end of the splitter which allows it to split in both directions. I think it should really have quite a bit of power but I am not sure, thats why I was wondering if anyone else has used one.

i use a 12.5hp engine and i rate my splitter around 27 to 30 tons, and i've had some logs give it a hard time.

with a 1/4hp electric motor, i wouldn't expect too much from it.

 

[machinistbcb]

Thanks for the input. You must understand how gear-motors work. there is about 100:1 reduction ratio. That results in a signifacant torque increase. Also the motor is not being used to drive a hydrualic pump. You really can't accuratlly compare this type of splitter with hydrualic piston type splitters. Think of an old south-bend lathe and how the carriage feeds back and fourth on the lead screw. Anyways I geuss this must be a rare type of splitter nobody seems to know much about them.

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

Get serious.

Leverage (which is what a gear is) only gets you so far. A quarter horse is either going to be horribly slow or unable to split any serious wood. Yes, in theory you can gear it down to split 60 inch elm crotches.

And it will take 47 years to do it.

Speed it up to any reasonable cycle time and it won't split any serious wood.

No amount of gearing down is going to make that any more than a quarter horse. It's just not going to do the job.

 

[machinistbcb]

Yes, I understand quite a bit about gearst. "LEVEAGE" which is a rather general term is the same as torque which is foot/pounds. You dont get it. THE MOTOR IS NOT DRIVING A HYDRUALIC PUMP. It doesn't make any since to campare it to an 8 h.p. gas engine that is driving a hydrualic pump. So I dont understand how you would Know how easily or fast it would split if you havn't used one before. Do a search on electric gear-motors they are used in a variety of applications in industry and a new 1/4 h.p. gear motor sells for around $600.00.

 

[triptester]

Although I have not seen a screw operated splitter but I have seem presses that use a large threaded rod to apply force . Screw jacks are commonly for cars. Screw jacks are also used to lift houses.

 

[mga]

Thanks for the input. You must understand how gear-motors work. there is about 100:1 reduction ratio. That results in a signifacant torque increase. Also the motor is not being used to drive a hydrualic pump. You really can't accuratlly compare this type of splitter with hydrualic piston type splitters. Think of an old south-bend lathe and how the carriage feeds back and fourth on the lead screw. Anyways I geuss this must be a rare type of splitter nobody seems to know much about them.

as a former tool-maker and machine repairman, i'm well aware how that works. but, everything has its limits...including your gear drive mechanism. i was replying to your statement that you thought it should split anything without difficulty.

 

[nickblaze466]

i have used one a while ago, my dads friend had one up at our hunting camp. they are not bad considering, but the one we used had some trouble with some rather average logs. that should be fairly competent when compared to other machines in the same class, but i would not say that it would punch big nasty logs easy/at all.

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

Yes, I understand quite a bit about gearst. "LEVEAGE" which is a rather general term is the same as torque which is foot/pounds. You dont get it. THE MOTOR IS NOT DRIVING A HYDRUALIC PUMP.

I get it. It's not driving a hydraulic pump. It's driving gears, which, like a hydraulic pump, is just another way to get leverage.

Gears don't make power, they just trade speed for torque. You can gear up to produce more speed with less torque, or gear down to produce more torque and less speed.

It's one or the other. Not both. The only way to get both is more POWER. 5th grade science, the unit on general tools. Remember that?

So whether it's a $6 or a $600 or a $10,000 quarter horse motor, you get a choice. You can split large stuff very, very slowly, or you can split teeny tiny stuff very quickly. OR you can find a compromise in between.

But you can't split reasonable wood with reasonable speed on a quarter horse.

No amount of gearing will change that.

 

[machinistbcb]

mga, I am also a machinist as well as a certified level II vibration analyst that specializes in large machinery diagnostics so I appreciate your skills as a former tool maker. I certainly never stated that I thought the splitter would split anything with ease. I just don't understand how people think they know how the splitter works by comparing it to there hydraulic splitters. I was just looking for some advice from anyone else that had used one I am not really interested in continuing an argument with people about why it will or will not work. I disassembled the motor last night and found that the brushes were significantly worn which would explain the breaker tripping out. I plan to replace the brushes and use the splitter year round in mt hay barn. I have a hydraulic 3pt hitch splitter that I can hook up to my 8n for the really nasty stuff.

 

[ray benson]

If you are changing the brushes check the commutator. May need cleaning. Use fine sandpaper. Blow out the motor real good.
Couldn't find much info on Flowtron logsplitter. Maybe a phone call to them would be fruitful.
Flowtron Elec. Log Splitter
2 Main St
Melrose, MA 02176
Tel: 617 324-8400

 

[drmiller100]

Yes, I understand quite a bit about gearst. "LEVEAGE" which is a rather general term is the same as torque which is foot/pounds. You dont get it. THE MOTOR IS NOT DRIVING A HYDRUALIC PUMP. It doesn't make any since to campare it to an 8 h.p. gas engine that is driving a hydrualic pump. So I dont understand how you would Know how easily or fast it would split if you havn't used one before. Do a search on electric gear-motors they are used in a variety of applications in industry and a new 1/4 h.p. gear motor sells for around $600.00.

on the top of my shop vac it says "peak horsepower 5.5".

I'll sell you the motor for 200 bucks. Think of your profit margin!!!!!

if you know so much, why are you asking us???? like has been said repeatedly in very different, and very nice ways, the 110 volt splitters are either slow, not powerful, or both.

 

[machinistbcb]

Dmiller You are exactly right. After reading some of these replys, why am I asking you ?????? It seems some of you people enjoy just aruguing about stuff and not actually having some constructive dialog.

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

Well, you asked:

Is the lack of power to be expected ?

We told you. You didn't like the answers. *shrug*

 

[Butch(OH)]

I am confused

The guys said that they are a POS and you say it has some magic in gears that defy engineering princilple yet you posted that it lacks power and trips the breaker, sounds like it needs to have the ole magic wand waved over it again, LOL

Like some of the guys said, to get work done takes torque, to get it done fast takes speed. Torque x speed = Horsepower, there is just no way around it. No use in arguing with us it isnt our law, we just have to live with it.

Miller said it best, a 1/4HP splitter HAS to be either slow,or gutless.
For those used to having some ponies at their disposal it will be both for sure.

 

[turnkey4099]

To insert a bit of sanity in here. People are arguing just to be arguing and getting hot under the collar for nothing.

The clue to its operation...or lack thereof...is in it's rating that was posted in #1 ten tons!. Of course it isn't going to split like an entry level 5hp rated at around 20 tons.

Harry K

 

[tatra805]

OK, you all have a point here... calm down and look if we can get to something useful for all of us

I do know the spindle drive splitters and was always wondering if they are actually working.

The advantages are clear, you dont need a hydraulic set up, that dumps the price and gives the home-home owner a chance to split something.

It is right that the obvious relation motor HP vs ton rating can not be used here as it is a different method. Maybe there is a line between the 2 systems but what is see is that nobody knows at this moment.

What I dont see, and to me that is the point why this splitter is not performing, is the balance between power and speed.

Cutting something is based on 3 things: time, force and impact speed. (try this out with a knive and a citron, take your kids and they might learn something)

A die cutting machine cutting foils etc does not touch the bottom plate and still cuts a xx micron layer. This is defined by the impact speed and the time the knives are in the down position, force is a fix value defined by the construction and the avg 1ton/meter of knive.

With a splitter it is similar. IF the spindle drive would move faster it would split better but that requires a bigger engine torque so it does not stall at impact. The RESULT would be a faster cycle time.

The reason why they have 2 wedges is only a matter of concentrating all force to 1 line. It might help those with any splitter that sometimes is a litlle short of power.
Here it is presented as an advantageous design while it is only used to kind of mask its short-of power.


With a little material knowledge and calculation some engineer could figure out how strong the engine can be on the current construction, I am afraid that this would only show that these small splitters are build:
- strong in the safety-liability area
- cheap and weak in the mechanical side

Nevertheless i am sure that in the right dimensions these splitters can have real ton ratings comparable to hydraulics. Price would be an issue as a lot of other things (speed 1 of them) and thats probably why hydraulics are so popular and replaced a lot of spindle technology over the years.

It is a technological step back but i also still use a ladder and do not have an elevator everywhere. ... for some reasons