Free climbing?

[rborist1]

:Eye:

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Originally posted by Guy Meilleur
Minutes add up, time is $.

If time is money, then is laying in a hospital free? Even if you die, there is still a huge cost to family, friends, and society.

A thousand climbers save a minute or two by free climbing and only one falls to a career ending fate, are those few saved minutes worth it? I think not, and that's assuming you buy into the fact that freeclimbers are faster than those that follow the industry standards, and I don't for one muninte believe that.

The best and fastest climbers I know, all follow basic safety rules. I have, on the other hand, seen lots of climbers who thought they were the best, mostly because they are isolated from true experts, and they just didn't understand that basic safety is as important as any other aspect of climbing. For example, you can't say, "I am one of the best climbers around." and then spike on trims. Get it?

Originally posted by Guy Meilleur
Rich, mb is not alone and has no clone. Conformism is un-
American; it's for lemmings and losers.

Are you suggesting that we not follow industry safety standards because it would be conforming????

 

[Landman]

"The Tree Climbers' Companion"
Just wondering if this book does exist, It was mentioned earlier in the post. If it does exist how do I get a copy?

 

[Lumberjack]

Tree Climber's Companion
Sherrill part #16217 $15
1-800-525-8873

Carl

 

[Tom Dunlap]

A trivia question:

Does anyone know why The Tree Climber's Companion was written in the first place? Can you trace it to it's origins?

It's curious that Landman asks about the book in this thread at this time.

Tom

 

[Guy Meilleur]

Originally posted by John Paul Sanborn
If I remember right, unsecured climbing ranks higher in cause of death then electrical contact.
How many of these climbing fatalities are homeowners or kids? Where do these stats come from?
Yes there are exceptions to rules, ANSI will allow free climbing if it is safer then not.
Given the choice to follow ANSI or to go along with what the majority conforms to as politically correct at the moment, I'll follow ANSI. The industry standards count more than arbitrary pronouncements.
:angel:
John Ball also defined the " fail safe " concept. It does not mean that it is safe from failure, but that in the case of failure you have a high probability of being safe.
Reminders like tying in twice when chainsawing in tree are good developments that improve my confidence and hence my skill.

Why would you not want to do everything you can to beat the odds?

Everything, starting...where? First brain buckets, next chaps, next maybe full-body armor. Taking an extra 20 minutes to set a rope above a ladder instead of just climbing the darn thing like painters and roofers and other unskilled technicians? If you can't climb a ladder with confidence, then ya gotta flip every time.. NOnsense, imho.
We each take steps to increase safety according to our abilities and experience. Just because something works for you does not mean it will work for all.
MM: If time is money, then is laying in a hospital free?
Definitely not; last time I laid there it cost $130,000 for 3 weeks. Spleen healed slower than ribs. I'll be REAL careful next time I cut a tree under tension, but I'm not going to dress like Robo-Cop just to be safer.

 

[MasterBlaster]

 

[rahtreelimbs]

MB, this is not a dig on you in any way, I am curious if you wear any kind of head protection?

 

[MasterBlaster]

Originally posted by Guy Meilleur
Everything, starting...where? First brain buckets, next chaps, next maybe full-body armor. Taking an extra 20 minutes to set a rope above a ladder instead of just climbing the darn thing like painters and roofers and other unskilled technicians? If you can't climb a ladder with confidence, then ya gotta flip every time.. NOnsense, imho.
We each take steps to increase safety according to our abilities and experience. Just because something works for you does not mean it will work for all.

I wuz agreeing with Guy, Tom.

 

[NeTree]

Why do these threads always have to turn into tit-for-fat, swinging-**** pi$$ing contests?

 

[MasterBlaster]

Originally posted by netree
Why do these threads always have to turn into tit-for-fat, swinging-**** pi$$ing contests?

My thoughts exactly...

 

[Guy Meilleur]

Originally posted by Rich Hoffman
MB, this is not a dig on you in any way, I am curious if you wear any kind of head protection?

What, Rich indulge in a dig?? Naaahh, never happen.:angel:
As you can see, MB uses not only head but eye protection. So he sees well enough to set his own path, while thinking well enough to ask for and listen to the experience of others.
He doesn't just follow like lambs and lemmings, without thinking for himself. Is saying that he freeclimbs 1% of the time grounds for ridicule?

 

[Kneejerk Bombas]

He's tieing in 99% of the time, he's so close, only one more percent of the time and he's covered.
To me it doesn't make sense. It's like saying I have safe sex 99% of the time, or I don't spike on trims 99% of the time, or when I clamp down on a vice really tight, I take my balls out first 99% of the time(there goes the testoserone).

It's onlly because we care about MB and others reading here.

What if your son or daughter was starting to climb, would you teach him or her to tie in most of the time, or all of the time?

I can think of very few people who come here and post, who don't start to change their work habits for the better. Safety is important. Beating your chest and bragging about how unsafe you work is wrong. Nothing to do with lemmings.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

After reviewing this thread I can see that MB is attracting the wrath when Lumberjack is the one who is freeclimbing. The barbs should be shared with the right people

Tom

 

[MasterBlaster]

Thank you.

 

[TREETX]

It amazes me that people argue FOR using unsafe techniques and even when presented with the data, claim they are not unsafe.

Big reflection on maturity and intelligence.

Just curious but why it LJ bragging about freeclimbing. IF I recally past threads, he was mentioning that he is a chunky boy.

Not that free climbing ever makes sense, but it really doesn't make sense if yer a big boy.

I also stay tied in because I think I owe it to my crew to keep them from being stuck by a 170lb falling me.

 

[Lumberjack]

Originally posted by Lumberjack
On some trees that I am trimming I free climb to the top and set my rope, then rapel down and start working...
Carl

I meant that as no boast, therefore it can't be bragging.

I will post a pic of a tree that I climbed later today.

It isn't that I am saying that it is safe, it is just easy. That said I think that I also stated that I use a lanyard when setting the rope and I also meant if I were at a limb, that I couldn't get around, then I would use a lanyard. I also ensinuated that if I didn't feel safe then I would climb it like normal.

Carl

 

[TREETX]

By bragging, I meant freely advertising your stupidity.

 

[Lumberjack]

Oh, then I guess I bragged again by misunderstanding you.

 

[Guy Meilleur]

Originally posted by TREETX
By bragging, I meant freely advertising your stupidity.

ANSI 133.9.1.2 2) states that only when branches are too thick to advance a lanyard or rope is freeclimbing acceptable. There is a little room for interpretation on what's possible, but overall it's a no-no.
TreeeTx and the rest of the jury are so smart they can judge others' intelligence and intentions from a few words? Why not give the kid a chance to talk details before ?

Maybe he is not far off from ANSI, and could be brought a lot closer with honey than vinegar.