how do you guys chunk big wood?

[kf_tree]

i was removing a big atlantis in a small yard so the stick had to be pieced down. i was using a 12 ft belt with about a foot to spare. i was using a 3120 with a 36 in bar that was just passing trough. as i was half way through the cut i would slap in a plastic wedge to help the bar from binding. i was cutting them in 20 in chunks but i only had a small landing zone and those slabs were a mother to push off. the wedge's help it get sliding a bit but it was still rough. a rope would not have worked be cause the pullers would would have been too close to the landing zone and i was afraid it would bounce into them. each piece had to moved before i could drop the next one. any suggestions or should i just suck it and push like a man.

 

[treeclimber165]

3120 with 36' bar, on spikes??!! Dang, glad I don't mess with trees like that without a crane! Not counting working from a bucket truck, the biggest saw I've had to climb with was my old 038Magnum.
But normally, I make two opposing cuts overlapping about an inch apart. After I put the saw away, I have two hands to rock the chunk back and forth to break it free, then slide it off with both hands. Always make your lower cut on the side you are aiming to, so you don't have a lip to climb with the chunk. I also make the cut about chest heighth, but step up a little to where the chunk is about belly button heighth to push it off. More leverage that way.

Sounds like you had a rough day in the office!

 

[treeman82]

When I am chunking wood out, I do it 1 of 3 ways. If the piece is too big for my 020T I take up my 044 with the 25" bar.

Way 1) Place pie cut in piece of wood, make back cut, log falls on its own.

Way 2) Place tag line at top of log, place pie cut, have groundies apply gentle pressure on tag line and make back cut.

Way 3) Place tag line at top of spar. Place block below where I am going to cut. Make pie cut. Run lowering line through block and to the butt of the spar. Have 1 groundie take up slack on the lowering line with the PWIII and have 1 groundie applying gentle pressure to tag line. Make back cut. Lower spar.

Normal spar will be anywhere from 5' - 20' in length.

 

[Kevin]

You might get by using a felling bar for leverage but the hinge must be almost cut through.

 

[kf_tree]

the thing is i was not able to cut notch's. i was just cutting it straight across. the tree was against a 6 foot stone wall and the yard was only15- 20 feet across about 30 feet long. the tree was about center in the yard. it seems like more work to wiggle around the wood, slap a notch then wiggle back to make the back cut. thats why i prefer a big saw with a long bar, i could stay in one "comfy" spot and pass the saw through whith out moving around the stick. if i was using a shorter bar i would have had to move to bothe side of the tree to cut a notch. thats alot of work moving around big wood like that. i could not dump them too big , and because of a little lean it was more comfortable to be on the back of the stick pushing them into the narrow part of the yard. i was thinking of some kind of plastic rods that i could slip in as i cut through. then the might work like rollers. they have to be plastic because of possible chain contact, and cheap. big wood just sucks, it was at a brown stone in hoboken nj. the tree had to go through a house.

 

[rbtree]

treeman, that is the easy part when larger pieces can be dropped.

spike it's question was how to deal with heavy slabs.

several ways, spike.

I: Cut them shgrter, thus lighter.
2: Cut at slight angle, allowing piece to slide off. this makes for ugly firewood,and hard to handle on the ground.
3: bring a felling bar or suitable lever or just some long wedges. Grab a dowel (old broom, rake handle, etc), pick the log just enuf to slide the dowel in. Appx center it, then balance the chunk on it and push it right off. I have used this method to get the piece out quite a ways. Especially helpful if you are working on a tree inside a deck or other structure.
4: Rip the wood into quarters, thirds or halves, if too heavy or lz too small. I have had to do this several times, with four to five foot butts.
5: If high enuf off the ground, use a Hobbs or other lowering device, and cut longer pieces, then the Hobbs can be tensioned to almost pull the pieces off all by itself. No need unless the drop zone requires lowering tho. (After 28 yrs in trees, I finally have a LD, and have already used it several times. alos have a Portawrap I and III.
6: Crane!!

 

[kf_tree]

the dowel idea is what i was looking for. thanks. cut shorter means more cuts and more time in the tree. my feet like the ground, not bent over spikes. but every so often i'll have to cut small slabs so i could throw them. i had to 1/4 wood once on an elm stick between 2 garage's and don't know if i would ever do it again. one company i only work for 1 day a week sticks me with the big wood jobs alot. a few weeks ago they sent me to do a big silver that would have required 1/4ing the wood on the stick and throwing it, because of the lean it was on and nieghbors garden underneeth. plus the big cavity which i needed to get about 30 feet past to tie in and set my ropes. i walked and caught a day with another company. hobbs blocks are nice for the right situation, i picked one up about 3 years ago. but when we set them up taking big piece's using a 5/8 stable braid line we get about a 6 foot drop. it gets close some times. porta wraps rule, but i like the older T style ones better. did you get a woopie sling yet? did i hear you right ? do you have a crane? i remember the first time i teied in on a crane and was put up to about 110 ft. man was i scared. but after a few times it became a fun. once you see the logs the thing can pick, you say what is my 200 lbs gonna do?

 

[treeclimber165]

Originally posted by spike_it
i remember the first time i teied in on a crane and was put up to about 110 ft. man was i scared. but after a few times it became a fun. once you see the logs the thing can pick, you say what is my 200 lbs gonna do?

I can relate. Funny how we can comfortably tie into a 3" fork in 50 or 100 yr old trees daily, with no idea what stresses it has been subjected to in it's lifetime, but we get nervous tying into a 1-3 yr old crane that is rated for 35 tons or more and is tested every 6 months!

 

[Treephotographa]

Q: how do you guys chunk big wood?
A: with a nice big scarf
:angel:

 

[rbtree]

I don't get it....


..an aussie code, eh??

Where's your photos, treephotog?? Bring em on, now, ya hear..!!

Current gear bag:

Canon EOS 1N, 6 fps motor, 28-70, 70-200, 300, all f/2.8L, 1.4x, 2x, Canon EOS A2E, T70, 550EZ Flash New Canon G2 digicam, very nice..smll, quick, versatile, surprisingly good pics....

Want: EOS 1V and/or D60 digital SLR 6.24 mp.
Dream: the new version of the 1D, which will be over $6000, I'd reckon, and a gazillion mp's...


scarf..... would that be as in 10 guys holding a giant "headpiece", ala the Eskimos, or a firefighting burning building rescue....

 

[Rob Murphy]

Aussie translation
Scarf Cut or Face Cut or Pie Cut or Fronting Cut can you think of others?

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

Oh, o, o Murph pick me..............

Primary cuts, pre-cuts, or .......knotch?

Person-ally i kind of have refered to it as relief cut (relieve compression), and taking out a 'chock', like taking a chock from in front of a tire, allowing it to move forward freely. For here it is same thing, it does set up the back cut to leave the proper hinge between the front and back cuts. But it also provides that relief of removing a chunk of material that is blocking the flow of force, so that the tree can move forward without being inhibited by that 'chock' in the way.

The hinge tends to command the tree to fold on the hinge's axis only, forward or back. The backcut kerf tends to block the fold backwards on that axis(being like a too narrow facecut that closes too early and seizes, building up compressed force), while the facing cuts give the only easy way out for force to flow on that axis of the hinge's stipulation of movement(hopefully).

 

[Treephotographa]

struth i gotta re read the manual before i take a photo and all i got is a begginers digital camera!
[it seemed like a good name when i signed up...]
Rob and TTS, you've extended my vocabulary

TP

 

[Greg]

I use a salami cut (cut angeled downward where you want the wood to fall) Big heavy chunks slide right off with one cut, no problem. Like RBTREE mentions this does make for lousy firewood and odd shaped peices of wood, but it works great. The dowel is a great idea, I've never heard of that one. I also take my felling bar when I don't want to put a pull line on large sections. The sliced cut works great but can be odd when trying to catch it with a porta wrap and pulley, especially close to ground when you have no room to let it run.

Difficult situation I was in, The last 10ft of a 36in DBH oak with nothing but cement pool decking below it. Nothing else around it to rig from but itself. I ended up taking smaller chunks and leaving them on the deck below so I could place the peices on top of each other. That last 10ft took over an hour to get safely out.
Greg

 

[Reed]

here's a chunking trick -

forget notching, no need for wedges. Begin cut-through at chest level, right in front of you. Straight thru-cut, left hand up towards top of spar, 3/4ths the way thru, push with left hand, this takes the weight towards the hinge, as your saw exits the back side, let go and let chunk rock-back to release saw. You've then completely cut thru block so kill the saw, hook her back on your belt, use both hands to direct the chunk where you want it to fall. Works for diameters up to however thick the spar is you're working on. After that chunk's down, spike down to next cut and do it again. Unless you're salvaging timber, small chunks are the way to go - ground men can handle 2-footers out of the way faster. Don't let chunks fall on grounded chunks - get a routine going so groundies can roll-out of the way the felled pieces. Bouncing chunks can ultimately destroy that which you're trying to avoid.

 

[TREETX]

I must say that chunks do not make a good "pad". I used to do that until I almost killed a groundie with a pain-stakingly carefully placed chunk that shot off of my "pad". No matter what technique, go with what you are comfortable with.

That is all the advise I have. I have never taken chunks THAT BIG with out a crane.

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

Another strategy cut i have tried, is something i started playing with for cutting stumps, sometimes to avoid rocks on one side. We now use it on some of our largest stumps SOP, and call it a reverse stump cut.

For pic. 1) i make a cut from side B) completely through all around; almost all the way across the stump, seeking to leave just a lip of wood holding it on side A). At some point the stump will want to sit down on the bar, so i place a wedge in from side B) for support, in the tree i use a stick or steel 'biner spine to support the load from sitting on the bar. Never thought of dowels!

Then in pic. 2) i take out the saw; i also take out the wedge/support, so that side B) can sit down without binding as it is released by the final cut, and it doesn't cause the final cut to bind the saw by the back pressure of the wedge.

Then i go to side A), and cut down at a slant into the first cut. This leaves an upward piece standing and a free stump. On the ground this can also be a stop piece, a place to slip a crowbar in to push with leverage the cut load across the flat stump or the outside of the stop may be the dirtiest/lowest/most dulling wood around the circumfrence of the stump that you didn't want to run your saw in that day. For safety with the stumps we then cut/smash the lip off as much as pratical, sometimes with a smaller bar/ junkier chain. We do this even if it is to be ground, for fear of that piece becoming large shrapnell! So then, you have made the same amount of cuts as u might usually, only in the reverse order!

In the tree, the standing backpiece can be a safety stop, also i might 'Humboldt' the bottom lip of side B) so that it forms a pivot and slide under the dump side of the now free load that is already weighting with some pulling mass on the pulling side of the pivot to aid you in dumping it out of the slide of the humboldt. The farther under you go(with humboldt), the more weight will be preloaded to help you on the outside of the pivot point to leverage the back end up. You can push at the high point tipping the weight into the 'facecut', or have groundies help with line, best torqued over the top at the most leveraged point of tourque and pull to assist in tipping it forward to slide.


Logs may spread out force, but they cause bounce. If we need something to absorb the shock, we use a 3' deep matto f brush or we use tires (off rim). i once cut a piece about the size of firewood, that piece came down about 40', hit a log, bounced with a spin, and literally walked up 3 stairs as it spun end over end and cost me a piece of siding on someone's trailer while we all watched in immense disbelief!

 

[kf_tree]

i think alot of you guys are missing the point. i'm not talking about notch's or medium crap. i'm talking big wood. i've made 1000's of cuts with a 394 pushing the piece up with on hand and cutting with the other, but i would leave the saw in the cut and slide them off the bar. but i'm talking about slabs i could barely get moving with 2 hands. i'm 6'1 225 so i'm not a weak little guy. i'm talking mondo slabs. i want to cut in one spot with out moving around, and get it done quickly. the dowel and angle cuts were the best suggestions. i could stay in one spot and make my cuts. it was atlantis so the wood just gets chipped or dumped. it had to get carried out through a house , so it had to get cut small on the ground any way. before i started useing a wedge i used to break off small limbs and carry little piece's in my pocket t to slip into the cuts on my way down. all the other suggestions were good quality idea's but don't help with big slabs in a tight area. i will pick up some 3/8 dowels to give them a try . thanks

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

I like the felling bar option the best, I've done that, but not on anything that big. Wont find me with a stumping saw in a tree

 

[rbtree]

oakwilt,

Not to critique, but that is rather basic.

More advanced is if doing the cut without a wedge handy, as the kerf is closing, run the chain back into already cut kerf a few times. This will open up a space for the bar, and allow you to keep cutting while the back is totally sitting down.

But you should use a 12 inch wedge, and use it as a felling bar to lift as you finish the cut. Keep the rpm up and the piece will move out a couple inches just as the cut is being finished. the bar will end up halfway clear. Then, it is easy to use the wedge to lever the chunk out some more as the bar us being extracted. Now you can let the wedge hang, if you have a string on it, or set it on the exposed top.

This technique requires one handed saw use, which many don't recommend. Personally, I am into production, and do not have the time to mess around with that much safety stuff. I one hand all the time, but try to be aware of body and saw positioning at all times. Been doing this for 28 years with no problems, not about to change now...

I'm 160 lb, and start to give out when the chunks get over about 28 inches. 36 is doable, especially if you cut short pieces.

tc 165 mentioned using a mismatch cut. I seldom do this, as it is a bit of a pain. Unless you are dropping longer stuff without a conventional hinge/pie/backcut, or off vertical wood, of course.