Large Bid Job

[medic2397]

Hey guys,
I'm still ain little wet behind the ears when it comes to bidding big jobs but this one is a cake topper. Basically it is a mobile home park sitting on about 70 acres with roughly 400 trees that need pruning. Most of the pruning will be raising crowns off of the lots. My question is more along the lines of how do you guys write something like this up? Do you do lump sum or a "per-day" rate? If you do per day do you estimate the numberm of daysthe that you thinksaid it will take? Any ideas would be great. Thanks.

 

[StevenBiars]

I don't do pruning, but before my dad passed, we used to do a lot of flood debris clean up and tree cutting. We would survey the site to get a better idea as to how long the job would take. Afterwards, we would bid the job accordingly and provide an estimated date of completion. A lot of people tend to shy away from per-day rates but aren't shy about paying a per-job price and knowing (with a reasonable amount of certainty) roughly when the job would be done. The last job we had bid (and won) was for a river-side campground. It ended up taking us 3 full days (12 hours each) with heavy equipment, but we had estimated it would take 5. It's always good to give yourself a buffer when it comes to time (and expendables such as gasoline).

 

[sgreanbeans]

Careful, you may get it! You can do it anyway ya want, just make sure your not cutting your throat. I would bid one lump, but would price each tree to myself, then take those numbers and adjust for the fact that your not going to 400 different jobs. Make sure that you can get progress draws and a down payment from the park owner. Do not deal with management, gives owner an out "I did not authorize this" and BEWARE. Mobile home parks are notorious for burning contractors. Figure out how long you think it is going to take you , then add 25% of that time on top. Never go by the hour, places like that will try and only pay while a saw is running. Do not sign a lien waiver until your paid in full, another little trick they try and pull, is to get you to sign that before hand. Good luck!

 

[jefflovstrom]

We are doing just over 1100 trees on a job. We broke it into sections (1-12) and get paid per section done rather than waiting for the entire job to be done.
Jeff

 

[lxt]

Agree with all above, The other thing to consider is, each lot is a rental unit & ive seen where the mobile park will actually try to pawn costs off to the tenants after the fact & then you`re left trying to collect your money.....but from who? a buddy of mine went through such & lost big time!!!!

he was awarded hazard tree removal contract through out the park.........so he literally did it through out the park, problem was many of the trees were on rentalproperty of which falls into a different set of circumstances.........in this case the park is considered "surroundings" of the rental areas.............he basically did around 50 trees for nothing! be very careful in trailer parks........there is a reason people live there.......cheap, just like the owners of them!!!




LXT..............

 

[defensiblespace]

If you get the job, get a lawyer to write you up a bomb proof contract and then have the lawyer review it before you put your signature on it. It will be worth the money you spend on a lawyer to make sure you dont get burned.

 

[StevenBiars]

Figure out how long you think it is going to take you , then add 25% of that time on top. Never go by the hour, places like that will try and only pay while a saw is running.

This is ALWAYS a good thing to practice. My dad busted a tire on a rented piece of equipment on a creek cleanup job we were doing and it ended up taking 2 days to get it fixed and ended up costing almost $500 to rectify the situation. With that said, it's probably a good idea to overestimate your expenses by at least 10 or 15% as well.

 

[sgreanbeans]

If you get the job, get a lawyer to write you up a bomb proof contract and then have the lawyer review it before you put your signature on it. It will be worth the money you spend on a lawyer to make sure you dont get burned.

I have a 3-lawyer bomb proof contract. Only time I have problems, is when I do work for other lawyers! They read it, look at me and ask "who drew this up for you!" I tell them, and they always respond as they hand it back to me, signed. "Nice one"
Don't lean on the contract tho, if ya feel funny about it, walk. Even if you have a contract that is 10ft tall and bullet proof, people still can get out of it, simply by not paying. The contract is not going to force them to get out a check book, but will help if you have to take legal action, the goal is to avoid that altogether. Use your senses, if it smells like dog crap....................................

A contract is designed to keep honest people, honest and is only as solid as the people signing it.

 

[Bigus Termitius]

excellent posts here.

I recently dealt with a trailer park owner. I gave him a good price on a limb he needed taken out this summer and he promised to bring me in to go through the place in the fall. He called me in for a removal and wanted a per hour rate on raising the canopy on everything and taking out hangers and anything I saw that could be a problem. So I dropped off a bid for each. I thought he was going to have a heart attack.

"Do you really need a three man crew for this?"

"No, but that's the safest most efficient package for the equipment that we will be using, I can drop a guy, but it will take longer and cost more by the time we are finished."

I didn't get it, but I didn't want it for a dime less. This guy was not poor, just cheap, and ignorant. With a three man crew I would have been done in a day, maybe a day and a half tops. If he would have wanted a firm bid, it would have been much more.

My cemetery wanted prices per tree for eight removals, So I wrote it up for a 25% down payment and 75% payments made per tree(s) as accomplished. I'll likely get it, but it's looking like spring now.

 

[defensiblespace]

I have a 3-lawyer bomb proof contract. Only time I have problems, is when I do work for other lawyers! They read it, look at me and ask "who drew this up for you!" I tell them, and they always respond as they hand it back to me, signed. "Nice one"
Don't lean on the contract tho, if ya feel funny about it, walk. Even if you have a contract that is 10ft tall and bullet proof, people still can get out of it, simply by not paying. The contract is not going to force them to get out a check book, but will help if you have to take legal action, the goal is to avoid that altogether. Use your senses, if it smells like dog crap....................................

A contract is designed to keep honest people, honest and is only as solid as the people signing it.

As sugarbeans stated, the contract will "help if you have to take legal action". You always hope you don't have to do this, but without a contract you have nothing to stand on. I'm not sure how it works in other states, but in CA you can place liens on properties if they don't pay you. Trick is, you have to have a compliant contract first. What it all boils down to is, I would much rather have a solid contract than not have one.

 

[medic2397]

Thanks a bunch guys, all of your input and experiences are appreciated. I sent the bid over with a per day price and estimated how many days I believed it would take to do the work. I left it open ended on that part because I don't want to get locked into a completion date with nasty NY winters around the corner (or at least I think, its almost 70 here today!!!!) Either way, if they are gonna be a pain about any of the legal stuff, then I will walk. I was a little more interested in how you guys are actually bidding these, it sounds like most of you would have done a lump sum and just make sure you did your homework and didn't cut throat? Thanks again everyone.

 

[BC WetCoast]

Thanks a bunch guys, all of your input and experiences are appreciated. I sent the bid over with a per day price and estimated how many days I believed it would take to do the work. I left it open ended on that part because I don't want to get locked into a completion date with nasty NY winters around the corner (or at least I think, its almost 70 here today!!!!) Either way, if they are gonna be a pain about any of the legal stuff, then I will walk. I was a little more interested in how you guys are actually bidding these, it sounds like most of you would have done a lump sum and just make sure you did your homework and didn't cut throat? Thanks again everyone.

If the trees were similar, then I would have figured out a price per tree and just multiplied it by the number of trees. But only have given the customer the total price. It may be more palatable to the customer to break it into 4 sections of 100 trees each. If the total package is too high, then he might give you half this year and half next year.

 

[jefflovstrom]

One month later--

"How come these stump's are here?! There's a hole in my roof!, My car is all scratched-up!, etc,,,,
Jeff