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I bought one of those overrated HP lawn mowers and they had to pay a fine, I'm sure I'll be getting a check any day now..:rolleyes2:
Latest 50cc saws seem a lot stronger
- Thread starter Zippy
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Have you modded the muffler? I didn't even bother running mine until I had.
Displacement in a mower has nothing to do with power output when comparing similar sized engines. Put it this way, Chevy had the good ol' 350. 255HP in a pickup truck. Now they have the 327. 305HP in a pickup truck. Smaller engine, more power. People need HP/TQ numbahs for comparison. Just like the B&S 175cc engine has supposedly 7.75ft/lb torque vs. their 190cc engine that has 7.25ft/lb torque. Alot of those engines are the same, they just have a different carb or..... sticker on the shroud.... to make different power to hit price points :msp_thumbup:
Where does the 350 produce 255 in comparison to the 327 at 305. My 350 walks away from my 5.3 with a 30' camper at 2600 rpm
The 350 has produced so many different variations in HP it ain't even funny. Don't get me wrong, the 350 is awesome. But the pre 99 GM trucks had 255HP standard to my knowledge in a 350 engine. The 327's have had from 285 to now 315HP out of different variations in stock form. Can't say as though one is really faster or more torquey or better than the other. 305 is a different story lol.
Marketing lies is not better. Marketing CC's is about as useful as marketing how many apples a monkey eats on any given Sunday during lent.
Engine manufacturers were held to certain ratings qualifications for labeling their engines. If they were tested at "x" power rating then they were allowed a y% variance from that power rating. Laws have changed and that % has been tightened. They just simply choose to rate the power by a different measurement now, torque.
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mt.stalker
ArboristSite Guru
No one has answered Zippy's origional question . My guess is that the manufacturers of the PRO saws (346, 261) have just tweaked the little engines with better breathing/and timeing and overall engine design . Thus , extracting more raw hp and torque , while maintaining reliability .
The EPA is probably to blame for quicker upgrades. We'd eventually get to the technology but why change something that works so well? Because you have to. Cat mufflers only helped pass emissions, nothing for performance. Strato on the other hand, along with computer controls - those are big steps.
I would be surprised if that made it to our shores in any significant numbers. I also would love to see one in use. Well, I may get the chance soon enough as I'll be in Europe again this next year.
272super
ArboristSite Operative
Older 50cc saws down on power? Try running a 254XP.
rbmopar
ArboristSite Operative
Or a 5000/490.
Nerdy numbers!
The comment about the 254xp made me look at the numbers - bit nerdy but I was interested to see what's going on with 50cc chainsaw evolution.
It seems the Stihl 026 has put on quite a bit of weight in evolving to an MS261. It's sort of a half way house between the old 026 and a 254xp - in terms of weight and power.
Some figures from stihl/husqvarna websites for a comparison (all quoted without b/c):
242xp - 10.3lbs - 3.1hp
Stihl 026 - 10.3lbs - 3.2hp
346OE - 10.6lbs - 3.4hp
346 NE - 11.2lbs - 3.7hp
MS261 - 11.4lbs - 3.8hp
254xp - 11.9lbs - 4.0hp
262xp - 12.8lbs - 4.8hp - included as I like them!
So it seems you can have a higher hp 50cc saw - but at a weight penalty - either old (254xp) or new (MS261/346xp ne).
Still interested to know how they get more hp out of the stock 50cc saws. Now I also want to know why it comes with a weight penalty.
The comment about the 254xp made me look at the numbers - bit nerdy but I was interested to see what's going on with 50cc chainsaw evolution.
It seems the Stihl 026 has put on quite a bit of weight in evolving to an MS261. It's sort of a half way house between the old 026 and a 254xp - in terms of weight and power.
Some figures from stihl/husqvarna websites for a comparison (all quoted without b/c):
242xp - 10.3lbs - 3.1hp
Stihl 026 - 10.3lbs - 3.2hp
346OE - 10.6lbs - 3.4hp
346 NE - 11.2lbs - 3.7hp
MS261 - 11.4lbs - 3.8hp
254xp - 11.9lbs - 4.0hp
262xp - 12.8lbs - 4.8hp - included as I like them!
So it seems you can have a higher hp 50cc saw - but at a weight penalty - either old (254xp) or new (MS261/346xp ne).
Still interested to know how they get more hp out of the stock 50cc saws. Now I also want to know why it comes with a weight penalty.
45cc oe 50cc ne should be stronger. Steve
nmurph
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Both the OE and NE are actually 11lb 3oz.
The 261 is 3.75hp
While the 254 is stronger, it is built on a 60cc chassis and is nearly 2lbs heavier than a 346.
262 is 4.7hp
After talking to my rep I'm about 99% sure it's a non-USA model
Doesn't mean you can't get one, just makes it quite difficult. I'd also rather have the 543 to be honest with you.imagineero
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I can't offer much enlightenment on the reason for the weight gain (but I'd be curious!) but I have owned and run most of the husky/stihl saws mentioned.
I've owned quite a few 026/pros and they are awesome saws. It's hard to beat them even with modern saws, and we still run one as a ground saw. Very light, fast and responsive. The 261 is heavier, and slower (less responsive) to my hands. It does have more torque, but torque isn't what I want in a saw in that class. Saws in that size (for me) are primarily limbing saws, with a little light bucking as needed. I want revs, but mostly lightness and balance. Yeah the 261 is a better bucking saw, but it's getting close to 036 territory in weight, so why not pick up an 036? And while you're there, an 044 isn't much heavier for a whole lot power etc etc...
I'd give the nod to the 346 over the 261 any day, feels lighter, handles nicer and spools up quicker. That's hard to say as an all stihl guy, but all true. The 340 is also an excellent saw.
One of my groundies is going back to England in a couple months and I'm giving him some cash to grab a 241cm. I've been pretty anti new tech with its extra weight, but I got put on to a 441 cm last month and it turned my head in a big way. I've been a big fan of the 044 for a long time and always kept a few on hand. The weight/power and balance are a hard package to beat. Well, its been done. Hard to believe it would ever happen, but the power/balance and other features of the 441cm (easy starts, fuel economy, anti vibe) have finally pulled ahead of the weight. I'm expecting the 241cm to eclipse the 026pro
Shaun
I've owned quite a few 026/pros and they are awesome saws. It's hard to beat them even with modern saws, and we still run one as a ground saw. Very light, fast and responsive. The 261 is heavier, and slower (less responsive) to my hands. It does have more torque, but torque isn't what I want in a saw in that class. Saws in that size (for me) are primarily limbing saws, with a little light bucking as needed. I want revs, but mostly lightness and balance. Yeah the 261 is a better bucking saw, but it's getting close to 036 territory in weight, so why not pick up an 036? And while you're there, an 044 isn't much heavier for a whole lot power etc etc...
I'd give the nod to the 346 over the 261 any day, feels lighter, handles nicer and spools up quicker. That's hard to say as an all stihl guy, but all true. The 340 is also an excellent saw.
One of my groundies is going back to England in a couple months and I'm giving him some cash to grab a 241cm. I've been pretty anti new tech with its extra weight, but I got put on to a 441 cm last month and it turned my head in a big way. I've been a big fan of the 044 for a long time and always kept a few on hand. The weight/power and balance are a hard package to beat. Well, its been done. Hard to believe it would ever happen, but the power/balance and other features of the 441cm (easy starts, fuel economy, anti vibe) have finally pulled ahead of the weight. I'm expecting the 241cm to eclipse the 026pro
Shaun
I would suspect that the cat mufflers weigh a few ounces more, and perhaps even a quarter-pound more. That adds up the weight of the newer models.
With higher power, there may also be some stiffer components required, or beefier chain brake parrts, or beefier clutch, etc.
The spec sheet on my early Dolmar 5105 shows 11.7 pounds in stock form with the cat muffler.
Horsepower spec is 3.9 hp.
This early model had the 14500 rpm coil.
I suspect that with a regular non-cat muffler it would be under 11.5 pounds.
Regarding the 254, I see that is a 54cc engine with 4.0 hp, which is a little bit over the 50cc category.
With higher power, there may also be some stiffer components required, or beefier chain brake parrts, or beefier clutch, etc.
The spec sheet on my early Dolmar 5105 shows 11.7 pounds in stock form with the cat muffler.
Horsepower spec is 3.9 hp.
This early model had the 14500 rpm coil.
I suspect that with a regular non-cat muffler it would be under 11.5 pounds.
Regarding the 254, I see that is a 54cc engine with 4.0 hp, which is a little bit over the 50cc category.
