Makita 6401 questions

[Mark Roe]

I am new to the site and have had a Makita 6401 (20" bar - I bought this after my Stihl 042AV died) for about a year. We heat exclusively with wood (Red fir, Western Larch, Birch, and various pines). I am a homeowner/hobby saw operator. I cut approx. 5 cords of wood a year. Here is my problem.....

I have been lurking on the site for a while and have read several posts regarding BB kits, tuning, muffler porting, filters, and various mods. It has me asking the question if this is something that would be good for me and my saw? Bigger, faster, more efficient all sound good to me but where to start? Also, what chain type/configuration is best for what I cut?

So, can anyone offer some suggestions as what I should do to make the saw an even better cutter?

I appreciate the help.

Mark

 

[Griffbm3]

Welcome to the site...

You have a 6401 with a 20" stock set up. Nice start. The trees you mentioned, are you taking down trees, and dragging them, or are you cutting them on site where they fall?

On a 20" bar, I buy full chisel 72 link chains. When I had a 6401 before the re-arrangement, it went great. I did buy an OEM 7900 top end for it, but that was before there were BB kits for it. Now that I work on quite a few different saws, there are a lot more 6401's around here. People have me put the BB's on them sometimes.

Either way, the 7900 or the BB are both a step up. In my opinion, the break off point with saws occurs around 70cc's. And quite frankly, the 6401 is pretty big for a 64cc saw, but with the 7900 or BB top end, whilst still a little portly, is truly a different animal.

I am not going to argue reliability or anything else to you. I am not going to grandstand any brand either. I have small Stihls, and Large Stihls, and Husqy's and Dolmar's, and they are all great. Enjoy your time with your woods and your saw. I say run the pi#$ out of it, then switch out the top end. Start over, rinse, lather, rinse, repeat.

And again, Welcome to AS.

Jason

 

[nmurph]

there are two ways to increase the power of a 6401. the OEM P/C will bump it to 79cc for about $180. there is an aftermarket P/C that will bump displacement to 84cc. i have both versions and, while i don't have a lot of run-time on the BB kit, i can't tell any appreciable difference in the two. the quality of the 84cc (BB) is nowhere near the quality of the OEM. to me, it is worth the extra money for the OEM P/C. either way, it really changes the attitude of the 6401.

i don't think the HD filter is necessary for most users. if you are not getting a lot of fine particles past the stock filter, then i think it is a waste of money. if needed, it is a very nice set-up.

muffler mods are largely unnecessary for these saws. the significant gains are seen when the saw is ported.

for the money and weight, there is nothing close to a 7900.

 

[CentaurG2]

A sharp chain is all you really need. Stock air filter works fine. I have an ex-rental 6401 and it is a great saw. It will easily outcut my ms361. I use a 20” bar with Oregon 73LGX in clean wood or whatever low kickback chains I have instock for cutting up junk. This poor saw usually gets all the tough jobs like demolition or cutting roots. It has never once complained. It is one tough saw. I have also run a 24” bar on it and it does fine.

I have a dolmar 7900 and it is a totally different animal. If it was me, I would wait till you wear out your current 6401 piston and cylinder, then upgrade to the OEM 7900P&C or if you really need the power, by a 7900 cuz you might be waiting a long time.

 

[scotvl]

If you ever have to deal with big rounds get the BB kit and don't look back. When I scrounge for wood even if someone beats me to the pile there's usually a trailer full of big wood left over that the other guy couldn't carry. My 8401 noodles like a demon and I can have a trailer full of quartered rounds in 15-20 mins.

 

[teatersroad]

My opinion: Big bores and porting are all the rage. Unless you are in a rage to do it, don't do it. I do it, but I'm in a rage. I think the best thing most users can do for most saws is a quality muffler mod, sharp chain, and proper tuning. A next step might be just using a thinner cylinder gasket. If you want more power after that, buy a bigger OEM topend or a bigger saw. Built saws are fun, but they take a lot more attention and are likely a lot harder to resell (I don't think I would buy one).

 

[longbar]

Ive got the aftermarket bb kit on mine. It was decent quality but not nearly as good as a OEM. I havent used it alot since the upgrade so cant verify longevity but it has a ton more power. If you plan on using this for years I think I would get a OEM kit.

 

[nmurph]

some BB kits are excellent (066-as good or better than OEM), some have quality issues, but work well-enough (84cc BB), and some are not usable withouth significant work. i think the (possibly) minor increase in power for the 84cc top-end is not worth the money savings and quality issues vs the known quality of the OEM 79cc P/C.

 

[Mark Roe]

I appreciate all of the replies. Sounds like the general consensus is wait until it dies then go with the 79 or BB kit. I mostly cut downed stuff but the occasional dead tree does get cut down. I do find that I miss my old 24" bar as The 20" one with me being 6"3" makes for a sore back at the end of cutting.

I have never touched the H L settings on the saw. I've just run it as it is from the factory with a 50:1 mix. Are there any good resources out there to guide me toward how to tune a saw? This site has really shined a light on what I don't know about caring for and making my saw more efficient.

Thanks for the patience.

Mark

 

[Mark Roe]

My opinion: Big bores and porting are all the rage. Unless you are in a rage to do it, don't do it. I do it, but I'm in a rage. I think the best thing most users can do for most saws is a quality muffler mod, sharp chain, and proper tuning. A next step might be just using a thinner cylinder gasket. If you want more power after that, buy a bigger OEM topend or a bigger saw. Built saws are fun, but they take a lot more attention and are likely a lot harder to resell (I don't think I would buy one).

Thanks. Can you elaborate a little more on the muffler mod (I did several searches on mods and have (I think) a pretty good idea). Also, can you direct me to a good place to learn to tune a saw?

Mark

 

[nmurph]

a 24" is about perfect on this saw. i'm 6'4" and that i what i run mostly.
these saws have a rev limiter. you need a tach to tune them unless you are experienced and you can tune them in the cut.
the 79cc top-end is $180 from baileys. you also need a ring clamp to compress the ring while you lower the cylinder on the piston. these are about $6. the job will take about 1hr with limited experience. we can walk you through it.

 

[Mark Roe]

a 24" is about perfect on this saw. i'm 6'4" and that i what i run mostly.
these saws have a rev limiter. you need a tach to tune them unless you are experienced and you can tune them in the cut.
the 79cc top-end is $180 from baileys. you also need a ring clamp to compress the ring while you lower the cylinder on the piston. these are about $6. the job will take about 1hr with limited experience. we can walk you through it.

Hmmm, I may need to warn the the Minister of Finance (wife) that there may be an unexpected need in the future to upgrade the saw. An hour or so sounds pretty good. Been a while since I overhauled an engine let alone one cylinder but that seems pretty doable.

In the meantime, is there a thread outlining how to tune one with a tach?

Thanks again,

Mark

 

[nmurph]

it needs to be tuned to 13.5K WOT. check with she-who-must-be-obeyed for permission to buy a tach. you need a tach with a quick refresh rate bc the limiter will bounce the rpm's quickly. you need to be able to see this happening. if the tach expenditure is vetoed, take it to a local saw shop and TELL them to set it with a tach. the rev limiter can sound like the saw is 4 stroking when it hits the limiter and the saw is actually running lean. this can fry the P/C. the WOT setting is adjusted with the H screw. you may also need to adjust the L and consequently the idle screw to get it so that it doesn't stumble off idle, the revs fall like they should when the throttle is released and the idle is correct (2500rpm).

 

[Mark Roe]

it needs to be tuned to 13.5K WOT. check with she-who-must-be-obeyed for permission to buy a tach. you need a tach with a quick refresh rate bc the limiter will bounce the rpm's quickly. you need to be able to see this happening. if the tach expenditure is vetoed, take it to a local saw shop and TELL them to set it with a tach. the rev limiter can sound like the saw is 4 stroking when it hits the limiter and the saw is actually running lean. this can fry the P/C. the WOT setting is adjusted with the H screw. you may also need to adjust the L and consequently the idle screw to get it so that it doesn't stumble off idle, the revs fall like they should when the throttle is released and the idle is correct (2500rpm).

Got it. I think our local saw shop is ok and can do it, but I sure would like the ability to do it myself. I will check around at tach prices and see what I can find. I think the OEM upgrade may happen as the MOF is pretty pleased with me overall. She just approved a new Sugihara 24" bar. Guess the 2 cords that I cut and split look pretty good in the woodshed.

M

 

[nmurph]

the tech tac 20 is pretty nice and runs about $80. you can get one from baileys or edge and engine. both are site sponsors. i am sure that other site sponsors carry them as well. you can also get the OEM from either.

 

[Mark Roe]

the tech tac 20 is pretty nice and runs about $80. you can get one from baileys or edge and engine. both are site sponsors. i am sure that other site sponsors carry them as well. you can also get the OEM from either.

Perfect. Didn't want to have to ask another question as to recommendations.

Mark

 

[Mark Roe]

A sharp chain is all you really need. Stock air filter works fine. I have an ex-rental 6401 and it is a great saw. It will easily outcut my ms361. I use a 20” bar with Oregon 73LGX in clean wood or whatever low kickback chains I have instock for cutting up junk. This poor saw usually gets all the tough jobs like demolition or cutting roots. It has never once complained. It is one tough saw. I have also run a 24” bar on it and it does fine.

I have a dolmar 7900 and it is a totally different animal. If it was me, I would wait till you wear out your current 6401 piston and cylinder, then upgrade to the OEM 7900P&C or if you really need the power, by a 7900 cuz you might be waiting a long time.

You just changed my woodcutting life with one quick fix. I just picked up a Oregon 72LGX chain and it is a night and day difference from my apparent homeowner/noob "super safe" chain. It breezed through two 12" Birch trees where before I would have still been cutting rather than typing. Apparently it helps to know what to ask for rather than say "I need a 20" chain for this saw". Well done. Thanks.

Mark

 

[CentaurG2]

You just changed my woodcutting life with one quick fix. I just picked up a Oregon 72LGX chain and it is a night and day difference from my apparent homeowner/noob "super safe" chain. It breezed through two 12" Birch trees where before I would have still been cutting rather than typing. Apparently it helps to know what to ask for rather than say "I need a 20" chain for this saw". Well done. Thanks.

Mark

The scariest thing is that most of us will sharpen a “new out of the box” chain before we use it. Yes you can even make it cut a little better, if you know what you are doing. If you are in the market for additional chains, I highly recommend the site sponsor Baileys. They make em and ship em right to your door at the best prices around. Good luck and be careful.

 

[Mark Roe]

The scariest thing is that most of us will sharpen a “new out of the box” chain before we use it. Yes you can even make it cut a little better, if you know what you are doing. If you are in the market for additional chains, I highly recommend the site sponsor Baileys. They make em and ship em right to your door at the best prices around. Good luck and be careful.

Sounds like something I will tackle. I have always sharpened my own chains...spent 3 years as a full-time custom knifemaker, so sharpening doesn't put me off. Never thought to sharpen a new chain though. I will go give it a whirl and work on the rest of my wood. I am familiar with Baileys. Just requested the new catalog. Thanks again.

Mark

 

[nmurph]

I am familiar with Baileys. Just requested the new catalog. Thanks again. Mark

i get the feeling the CFO will be getting more expense requisitions!!!!!