MS200T clutch side crank seal question

[lone wolf]

Well, I just had a nightmare on the rebuild. The crank and cases went together fine. But of course putting the seal on the clutch side was horrid! I ended up using a 15mm long reach socket, busted 2 new seals in the process! They just didn't seem to go in central to the lugs, and I ended up being too forceful and cracking the seals I had previously thought that the clutch one would be the worst, due to that shoulder. I'd kinda tried to make this better with some tape, but guess it didn't help enough. Perhaps the lips were always caught by the shoulder and maybe this stopped the damn thing centering...

So against all my most firmly held principles I've just ordered the STIHL installing sleeve and press sleeve tools:

1123 893 4600
1123 893 2400

Perhaps the installing sleeve will help get me past the shoulder?

I've also ordered some rubber seals 9640 003 1190. I read elsewhere on AS that some peeps were using these. Not sure why STIHL use the bakelite ones at all really? Is it do with heat resistance or something?

This is much harder than changing crank seals on a car!!!

If you think the Bakelite seals are tricky wait till you try the rubber ones. You just have to go easier and take a good amount of time at it. I use a heat gun sometimes to get them in.

 

[MattG]

If you think the Bakelite seals are tricky wait till you try the rubber ones. You just have to go easier and take a good amount of time at it. I use a heat gun sometimes to get them in.

Really? Why are the rubber ones worst? Is it cos they have spring or something?

 

[lone wolf]

Really? Why are the rubber ones worst? Is it cos they have spring or something?

You sound like you have a real good grasp on how things work but need a little practice. Yes the spring pops out, I have not tried the sleeve yet but I used heat with good results. The Bakelite ones sure are expensive did you install new crank bearings too?

 

[MattG]

You sound like you have a real good grasp on how things work but need a little practice. Yes the spring pops out, I have not tried the sleeve yet but I used heat with good results. The Bakelite ones sure are expensive did you install new crank bearings too?

Yeah, you're right I need more practice!!! Thing is I sit at a desk all day long as a computer guy It's only when I get home that I get to play with cars, domestic plumbing, and chainsaws etc....

So if you were me, would you use the bakelite or rubber ones? (I've ordered both) Or does it not really matter as long as you can get the 'damn things in!

 

[lone wolf]

Yeah, you're right I need more practice!!! Thing is I sit at a desk all day long as a computer guy It's only when I get home that I get to play with cars, domestic plumbing, and chainsaws etc....

So if you were me, would you use the bakelite or rubber ones? (I've ordered both) Or does it not really matter as long as you can get the 'damn things in!

My first choice would be Bakelite they are believe it or not easier to install but I would get some of the rubber ones in case you break more of them so you have backup. It gets to the point where it just dont pay at what is it 12.oo each for the Bakelite?

 

[angelo c]

My first choice would be Bakelite they are believe it or not easier to install but I would get some of the rubber ones in case you break more of them so you have backup. It gets to the point where it just dont pay at what is it 12.oo each for the Bakelite?

Hey buddy,
Next time you do a set, call me, I'll come down and hold the camera.....

 

[lone wolf]

Hey buddy,
Next time you do a set, call me, I'll come down and hold the camera.....

You have trouble with the bakelite or rubber seals ?

 

[angelo c]

You have trouble with the bakelite or rubber seals ?

Haven't done any Bakelite yet.
I've botched a few rubbers though....mostly the AM brands though...I find the OEM rubbers are generally OK if you are patient and look for ways to fold the seal over....then don't do that !!!!

 

[lone wolf]

Haven't done any Bakelite yet.
I've botched a few rubbers though....mostly the AM brands though...I find the OEM rubbers are generally OK if you are patient and look for ways to fold the seal over....then don't do that !!!!

The Bakelites are easy.

 

[MattG]

The Bakelites are easy.

Hi Lone Wolf,

When you do the seals do you use some sort of assembly to keep the saw still?

When I attempted to install those 2 earlier on today, none of the others in my family were around to help me hold the casings still... so I guess I ended up really tap-tap-tapping it and that's why they got bust.

What I'm saying is if the cases were still I probably would have concentrated better at just keeping the socket tight against the seal, then I could probably drifted it in more controlled. Anyway, I guess I need to wait till next weekend for another go

 

[lone wolf]

Hi Lone Wolf,

When you do the seals do you use some sort of assembly to keep the saw still?

When I attempted to install those 2 earlier on today, none of the others in my family were around to help me hold the casings still... so I guess I ended up really tap-tap-tapping it and that's why they got bust.

What I'm saying is if the cases were still I probably would have concentrated better at just keeping the socket tight against the seal, then I could probably drifted it in more controlled. Anyway, I guess I need to wait till next weekend for another go

I sit it on something that will hold it like shop press plates or the like. They broke because you hit them too hard and they were not straight.

 

[MattG]

The Bakelite ones sure are expensive did you install new crank bearings too?

They cost about 4.40 pounds each over in uk. What bugs me, is postage cost + having to wait for their arrival. I didn't install new bearings... they felt fine... glad I didn't... in enough trouble with the seals!!!

 

[lone wolf]

They cost about 4.40 pounds each over in uk. What bugs me, is postage cost + having to wait for their arrival. I didn't install new bearings... they felt fine... glad I didn't... in enough trouble with the seals!!!

Take your time with them line them up perfect put on reading glasses if you must and tap them very lightly with a small hammer and socket. Make sure they start out straight.

 

[MattG]

I sit it on something that will hold it like shop press plates or the like. They broke because you hit them too hard and they were not straight.

You're right how i broke em...

What do you mean by "shop press plates" perhaps we call it something else in uk? Do you sit with plank of wood under you, and pressing down on the workpiece, or something?

 

[lone wolf]

You're right how i broke em...

What do you mean by "shop press plates" perhaps we call it something else in uk? Do you sit with plank of wood under you, and pressing down on the workpiece, or something?

The jig or whatever it is called that came with my shop press. I guess you could use blocks of wood just as well.

 

[lone wolf]

I just use it to steady the engine I dont press with it. Just make blocks to keep it still.

 

[MattG]

The jig or whatever it is called that came with my shop press. I guess you could use blocks of wood just as well.

Thanks mate, will try to fashion something with the vice and some wood or the like.

 

[lone wolf]

You should order at least one extra seal in case.

 

[pantelis]

You need the seal , a piece of x-ray picture everyone have one , and the homemade press sleeve or a socket

1 ) put the x-ray piece inside the seal
2) put the x-ray piece with the seal over the shaft, little oil help, look the x-ray piece to touch the bearing
3) push the seal to its postion use oem press sleeve or socket or homemade tools
4) pull out the x-ray piece

so simple , as the pictures

 

[pantelis]

Hi Dan,

Thanks for your reply! Think I may have figured one of my problems. I think put too much grease + sealant on the seal, and that meant it hydro locked whilst I was tapping thus encouraging me to tap too hard. I just tried installing the RECENTLY CRACKED seal by hand, with neglible lube and I managed to get it pretty much in place just by hand! I guess that whenever I've done car seals, I've been very liberal with the lube - and there's always room for excess to escape...

By the way, do you use sealant on outside of seal? What sealant? How much?

thanks again
Matt

You can use one kilo sealant outside the seal if you want , when you push the seal to its position the extra sealant will stay out, so not need too much.
for what brand to use , use dirko, yamabond, hondabond, susukibond, porchepond , ferraribond all its the same in different pack and in diferend coulors,
good luck