Mtronic idle adjustment

[KodiakForge]

So perhaps it’s not completely uncommon. I luckily don’t have any pieces in my crank shaft. You might try a caustic soda (lye) solution to dissolve the aluminum but not the crank. Here’s a link for an example:

Just be careful, wear gloves, and don’t do it indoors as it off-gasses toxic fumes. Maybe dab it with a swap or perhaps fill a shot glass (perhaps a double shot glass) and then lower the saw crank into the glass of solution for a little bit and keep a close eye on it. Best of luck getting it out.

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

All the key does is align the flywheel magnets with the coil for timing purposes and has nothing to do with keeping the flywheel on. The torque on the taper between the crank and flywheel surfaces is what provides the attachment strength and retains the actual alignment of the flywheel whether it has a key or not.

Flywheels come loose for two main reasons. The nut isn't tight enough, or the surfaces weren't properly cleaned before putting the flywheel on the crank (allowing movement) -- or both. There are obviously other possibilities, but those are the two most likely. So regardless of your method of choice for tightening a flywheel nut, the surfaces MUST be clean for a reliable and lasting service life. I've never had one loosen up on me using both light impact and wrench approaches.

And I gather we're discussing a 201T-C here? Best thing for that saw is use the flywheel with the sheared key and advance it half a keyway (from what would be the normal position) for a slight timing advance -- right after drilling out the muffler for some realistic air flow. The ECM will adjust accordingly with a re-cal, (albeit a bit stubbornly at first). Given no other major issues, it'll actually become a fairly respectable saw.

 

[smokey7]

To get a broken piece of key out of a shaft or crank. Find the key slot for half round style keys take a punch and go to where you know the end of the key is and the slot is and hit it with a reasonable hammer. Don't go at it on kill right of the bat but sneak up on it if needed. A decent placed hit should rock the key up out of the slot for better access with a pair of real vice grips or a pick if you can get under it. I keep all solvents and caustic stuff away from seals especially crank seals. Good luck.

 

[Ketchup]

All the key does is align the flywheel magnets with the coil for timing purposes and has nothing to do with keeping the flywheel on. The torque on the taper between the crank and flywheel surfaces is what provides the attachment strength and retains the actual alignment of the flywheel whether it has a key or not.

Flywheels come loose for two main reasons. The nut isn't tight enough, or the surfaces weren't properly cleaned before putting the flywheel on the crank (allowing movement) -- or both. There are obviously other possibilities, but those are the two most likely. So regardless of your method of choice for tightening a flywheel nut, the surfaces MUST be clean for a reliable and lasting service life. I've never had one loosen up on me using both light impact and wrench approaches.

And I gather we're discussing a 201T-C here? Best thing for that saw is use the flywheel with the sheared key and advance it half a keyway (from what would be the normal position) for a slight timing advance -- right after drilling out the muffler for some realistic air flow. The ECM will adjust accordingly with a re-cal, (albeit a bit stubbornly at first). Given no other major issues, it'll actually become a fairly respectable saw.

Dead on.

I agree a light impact can be used if a piston block is incorporated. But just rattling the nut on as the engine turns over isn’t good enough. Even with clean surfaces. I’ve already made that mistake for us all.

A flywheel with a sheered key can be used and advanced. It is a little trickier to guarantee the flywheel doesn’t move while tightening the nut, but can be done.

Personally, I feel like every 201t benefits from a muffler mod and timing advance. Emissions be damned. They run far better.

 

[smokey7]

I don't know bout you guys but I've argued with myself on selling saws with keys sheared out of the flywheel. I mark/punch the wheel so its easy to tell if you are advanced or if it moved. But how do you all feel about a flywheel missing a key and selling. I would obviously state it but am I wrong for thinking it?

 

[Wood Doctor]

One can probably sell any saw there is as a non-runner. The number of reasons a saw engine does not run is huge. Sometimes even the most trained mechanic cannot resurrect it. The buyer can always use it for parts. Awhile back a guy gave me a Stihl top handle saw for that purpose. His price was zero. After a year, it remains in cardboard box.

 

[KodiakForge]

Well thanks for the suggestions on advancing the timing and using the keyless flywheel. It absolutely worked flawlessly and all is back to normal once again actually better than before I would say. For what it’s worth, I did play around with the idle screw under the white digital linkage (for lack of actual term) that turns the choke butterfly, but I ended turning it back to where it was at and all is well. Thanks for all the suggestions and help.

 

[cscltd]

Go over the dealers head. Call Stihl headquarters. I never list a saw in registration as professional use.

Unfortunately Stihl doesn’t really care a hole lot. They are reluctant to give warranties on solenoid replacement -even the first versions. They know they have short life span but you have to call them to “good will” and add extra notes to claim form just to get your net cost back, plus in here in Canada you have to send certain items back to them(not sure if solenoid is one of those items) so packing and shipping on top (they pay freight) put the problem comes back in it costs me a dealer x#$ to do that and I’m only get net cost on part maybe %15 fee ($4) plus flat rate time allowance and pre set labour allowance (usually lower than shop rate-especially in the higher cost of living areas) I don’t mind that for my customers-part of the deal. But I have told them and all other manufacturers that sometimes I am further ahead (profit wise)to give a guy $10 and say sorry not my saw, I dont do others warranty and send him/her away than fix it under warranty. The main problem is Stihl and others have not stood behind their m tronic teething problems- they are better now, but insisted they had a perfect system when they didn’t and let dealers become bad guy-they should have open easy claim form for version 1 solenoids and would have less pushback from dealers and users
However- i think adjusting the so called idle screw will only prolong the needed replacement of solenoid, especially if version 1, I did same thing to ts500 and it bought the guy a month or so of daily usage before injector needed replacing.
don’t get me started on sds m tronic test equipment-lol

 

[stihl86]

Unfortunately Stihl doesn’t really care a hole lot. They are reluctant to give warranties on solenoid replacement -even the first versions. They know they have short life span but you have to call them to “good will” and add extra notes to claim form just to get your net cost back, plus in here in Canada you have to send certain items back to them(not sure if solenoid is one of those items) so packing and shipping on top (they pay freight) put the problem comes back in it costs me a dealer x#$ to do that and I’m only get net cost on part maybe %15 fee ($4) plus flat rate time allowance and pre set labour allowance (usually lower than shop rate-especially in the higher cost of living areas) I don’t mind that for my customers-part of the deal. But I have told them and all other manufacturers that sometimes I am further ahead (profit wise)to give a guy $10 and say sorry not my saw, I dont do others warranty and send him/her away than fix it under warranty. The main problem is Stihl and others have not stood behind their m tronic teething problems- they are better now, but insisted they had a perfect system when they didn’t and let dealers become bad guy-they should have open easy claim form for version 1 solenoids and would have less pushback from dealers and users
However- i think adjusting the so called idle screw will only prolong the needed replacement of solenoid, especially if version 1, I did same thing to ts500 and it bought the guy a month or so of daily usage before injector needed replacing.
don’t get me started on sds m tronic test equipment-lol

Funny, I never had 1 claim rejected for the solenoid. It has a two year warranty.
Its close to impossible for a dealer to determine what cause the failure.
The end user gets the solenoid and labor N/C and pays for the tank cleaning and fuel filter.
Also, never had to replace the newer generations ones.
????????. But I agree 100% about that screw. It should not be touched.
As for the SDS, Maybe it'll help with the injected models. It totally useless for anything else.

 

[Ketchup]

The “idle screw” is very helpful for saws at higher elevations. The solenoid can give more fuel, but it can’t give less. At 9000’ the oxygen content of the air is 1/2 of sea level by volume. Up here the carbs flood the saw at idle. Open the butterfly (or drill a hole in it) and they run. I’m not saying it will solve a bad solenoid, but I’m glad that screw is there. I doubt it’s an engineering leftover.

I agree that the solenoid is normally the issue. The upgraded fuel filter seems critical for longevity, but the black solenoid seems to only last a few years in the best cases. I like the design of the white solenoid the best, but haven’t had a green or white come back yet.

other issue is the delicate M-tronic coil. Dropped M-tronic saws often have faulty coils (and solenoids) after impact. I worry that even a big swing in the tree could generate enough force to damage them, as could dragging the saw over branches while harnessed or dangling it from a lanyard. None of that would bother me if the parts were cheaper.

Final complaint is hot start issues. I suspect the solenoid design creates an extra pocket for vapor lock. This is a more common issue on larger saws (362cm), but it really sucks in a tree.

These saws need:
Good filtration (seemingly solved)
A lower fuel setting for the Solenoid
Tougher coil/control modules
Better temperature shielding/carb cooling

 

[stihl86]

The “idle screw” is very helpful for saws at higher elevations. The solenoid can give more fuel, but it can’t give less. At 9000’ the oxygen content of the air is 1/2 of sea level by volume. Up here the carbs flood the saw at idle. Open the butterfly (or drill a hole in it) and they run. I’m not saying it will solve a bad solenoid, but I’m glad that screw is there. I doubt it’s an engineering leftover.

I agree that the solenoid is normally the issue. The upgraded fuel filter seems critical for longevity, but the black solenoid seems to only last a few years in the best cases. I like the design of the white solenoid the best, but haven’t had a green or white come back yet.

other issue is the delicate M-tronic coil. Dropped M-tronic saws often have faulty coils (and solenoids) after impact. I worry that even a big swing in the tree could generate enough force to damage them, as could dragging the saw over branches while harnessed or dangling it from a lanyard. None of that would bother me if the parts were cheaper.

Final complaint is hot start issues. I suspect the solenoid design creates an extra pocket for vapor lock. This is a more common issue on larger saws (362cm), but it really sucks in a tree.

These saws need:
Good filtration (seemingly solved)
A lower fuel setting for the Solenoid
Tougher coil/control modules
Better temperature shielding/carb cooling

OK. At those elevations, I see you're point about the screw. Makes sense. For 9000 feet.
I've never, ever seen a reason to touch it. After replacing the solenoid, reset, then wait, then restart, they idle perfectly. Besides 1123 family, the 201TCM is the saw I see most of.
-0- problems for the newer generations.

 

[lone wolf]

Hahahaha dude your a joke. You must have some major superiority complex and insecurity issues. You ought to see a therapist. I found my problem no it wasn’t anything you’ve suggested in fact your info has been the least informative of all here. Looks like the ********** at the dealer loosened the flywheel nut and it sheared the key, well Unless that too is a common problem. Probably a guy just like you. So my flywheel is ****ed and that’s my problem. But thanks mr know it all glad you solved my problem let me now at your feet! ****! Yeah I do bounce things of people because that’s what learning is asking others and people and sharing knowledge. If your against that you ought to stay in the house and offline. This is the same **** you’ve done with numerous people here. It’s all predictable like clock work. Look in the mirror bud.

You can sill use the flywheel the key is just to index the timing if you put it back in where it belongs and tighten down the nut it will work fine .

 

[lone wolf]

Had a flywheel come loose on a Stihl 032 last week.The flywheel key is toast and I am having a heck of a time getting all the old key out of the crank.
Kash

Small punch and hit with a hammer on one end or the other and it will tip up and out a bit then grab it.