Need engine troubleshooting help

Arborist Forum

Help Support Arborist Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

fearofpavement

Trying them all
Joined
Jul 26, 2010
Messages
7,346
Reaction score
5,643
Location
middle Georgia
Ok, a while back my log splitter got stolen and I recently picked up a replacement. It is an old Amerind Mackissic and has an 8 hp Briggs and Stratton engine on it. This splitter works great (sort of) as it is quite fast and has an unusual feature in that the control valve is detented in both positions. (forward and backward). Never saw that on a splitter before but actually works out pretty nice because while the ram is moving forward towards the wedge, I'm getting the next round.

Anyway, to the crux of the matter. This unit has not run for a while (a few years) and the gas cap was missing when I acquired it. It was stored under shelter. I cleaned out the fuel system three times and had the carb off and apart twice and removed and cleaned the fuel tank. I got the unit running and tuned and it runs great. For a while. That's the issue.

Here's the deal. I start it up in just a pull or two, ease the choke off and it hums away. (fixed rpm) I start splitting and it'll run great for about 10 minutes and then quit. Sometimes it sputs a couple times but when it quits it shuts off like you turned off the switch.

Here's what I tried: I try to restart and no deal even with starting fluid. I traded spark plugs, I did have fuel flow issues initially but am convinced I took adequate remedial measure even to the point of removing the gasculator screen and installing a transparent inline filter. I know I have fuel flow and as stated, the engine won't restart even with starting fluid.

How it acts is like a coil issue cutting out when hot but running when cold. So I took my inductive timing light and hooked it up when I knew it was about to quit and watched the flashes. When the engine shut down the flashes continued until the rpm went to zero. When I quits, I can pull the rope and the timing light indicates firing. I hooked up the plug out of the cylinder and watched for sparking and it seems to spark normally. I checked the compression of the engine which feels normal and got less than amazing numbers but these engines are typically pretty low compression anyway. (it starts fine cold) I thought maybe a valve was sticking open or something but have no reason to believe that other than I was running out of ideas.

So, any thoughts? My next course of action will be to open the engine enough to check out the ignition system looking for chafed wires, gaps, etc. I don't know if this old Briggs has points or not. It is quite an old machine and is white with a steel gas tank. My guess is that it is from the late 70's or early 80's.

If I have to, I'll buy a whole new engine but I'd rather fix this one. Since it runs great some of the time, I don't think it is a case of bad rings or valve train. I have some junk engines around and maybe I can find some similar parts to change around if they match up.

I need to get this splitter up and running as I have about one more cord of wood that I have in a trailer that needs to be emptied. I usually split most wood by hand but I'm getting older and it takes me longer. lol.
 
Strange that it has spark and fuel? That's all it takes to run, next time it quits, pop the plug out (which I would change even if it looks good) and put a few drops of fuel in the cylinder to see if it fires. The plug might be breaking down under the heat, good luck.
 
Strange that it has spark and fuel? That's all it takes to run, next time it quits, pop the plug out (which I would change even if it looks good) and put a few drops of fuel in the cylinder to see if it fires. The plug might be breaking down under the heat, good luck.

I had already tried a different plug and adding fuel doesn't do anything. It doesn't even "pop" on ether. I don't think it is the plug, but do think it may be something in the ignition because...

Before I pull the engine apart, I may try a different plug yet. (just in case the one I switched in has the same issue.)
 
Sounds like maybe an exhaust valve problem. Check clearance on both valves. Make sure valves aren't' sticking.

A valve stuck open has a very distinctive sound. This engine is shutting off like you hit the kill switch. Also, when I pull it over immediately after it dies, the compression on the pull rope feels normal, not the no compression situation a stuck open valve would cause.
 
Ive seen exhaust valves warp after getting hot do the same thing you are describing. As far as compression, with the release being on the camshaft, it is pretty hard to get accurate numbers.
 
There should be three sets of numbers on the starter housing,mdl, type and code. The first two #'s in the code will tell you the year the engine was manufactured.1982 back are points engines.
 
There should be three sets of numbers on the starter housing,mdl, type and code. The first two #'s in the code will tell you the year the engine was manufactured.1982 back are points engines.

So I had to go out to the shop and check these numbers...
Model is 190402
Type is 1849 01
Code is 80051412

So per you info, that would be an 1980 point ignition engine?
 
I may have a set of points and condenser. I can't recall if they have #'s on them or not if not throw up a pic.
 
it can't be the points and condenser since you have fire after it shuts off,,, it takes 3 things to make an engine run,, compression,,spark and fuel,,, so if you are getting fire and fuel in the cylinder then it has to be compression,, this is something to check,,,, pull the head off and check the head gasket and check the head for warpage ,,, it almost sounds like you have an engine problem,, when it gets warmed up good its causing it to loose comp like maybe a head gasket or cracked head or cylinder wall,,,, this is just something to check,, yes I am a retired auto mechanic,, automotive engines are not much different then the small engines
 
Take a look at your muffler.
Does it have that heated look to it (like you put a propane torch in it) that that you get with a leaking exhaust valve?
or does the engine have a new/recent exhaust, that would also lead me to look at the valve.
 
it can't be the points and condenser since you have fire after it shuts off,,, it takes 3 things to make an engine run,, compression,,spark and fuel,,, so if you are getting fire and fuel in the cylinder then it has to be compression,, this is something to check,,,, pull the head off and check the head gasket and check the head for warpage ,,, it almost sounds like you have an engine problem,, when it gets warmed up good its causing it to loose comp like maybe a head gasket or cracked head or cylinder wall,,,, this is just something to check,, yes I am a retired auto mechanic,, automotive engines are not much different then the small engines

If it was a mechanical issue, wouldn't the engine start running poorly before it quit? This thing runs normal full rpm and then just stops. That's why I think its electrical even though my testing shows I have spark. I am going to keep going deeper until I find something. Thanks everyone for all the ideas thus far. I've been working on engines for over 40 years but this one has me puzzled so far.
 
Take a look at your muffler.
Does it have that heated look to it (like you put a propane torch in it) that that you get with a leaking exhaust valve?
or does the engine have a new/recent exhaust, that would also lead me to look at the valve.

The muffler has been cobbled in the past but doesn't show any evidence of abnormal heat.
 
I have old splitter with a 8 hp Briggs that is giving me similar issues,but mine will refire after a few pulls. Then it just keeps dying as soon as it has any load on it. It heats up,losses compression and has no power. Fuel and spark were good. Compression was in the 50psi range, so I did a leakdown test. I found the valves were leaking bad and both were at/near 0 clearance. Also,the exhaust seat was loose. I'm waiting on a few parts but I expect it to run fine once I get it back together. I would do a leakdown and then have a look at the valves. A good runner should have a compression number much higher than 50psi even with the compression release.
 
If memory servs me , you'll need to turn the engine backwards
to check compression.
have you done the gas cap loosening routine?
If venting the tank doesn't get the engine to crank in less than a min,
then things sound thermal.
But without seeing your fuel system, i can't rule some manor of restriction.
 
Valves is what id bet too...


Other than that all i can say is I had an old 5 horse briggs that the PO had run with no oil.. heated the lower bearings soo hot that they warped. When it was cool, itd run GREAT! but when it warmed up, the bearings swelled so much that it had no ability to produce torque and could not handle any load. Now that was a bear to figure out...

Do a leakdown test, and check what the valves are clearanced at. If they are in spec, your got some other issue...
 
You need spark,fuel and AIR for an internal combustion engine to run.Yeah, valves but something shutting off air in or out?
 
If memory servs me , you'll need to turn the engine backwards
to check compression.
have you done the gas cap loosening routine?
If venting the tank doesn't get the engine to crank in less than a min,
then things sound thermal.
But without seeing your fuel system, i can't rule some manor of restriction.

I tried loosening the gas cap. See earlier posts where it won't pop on starting fluid either.
I am convinced this is in no way fuel related. The fuel system on this engine is very simple with a gravity fed float carburetor. I have a transparent fuel filter inline and can observe fuel flow.

I don't follow the part about turning the engine backwards to check compression. Anyone enlighten me as to how one would spin it in reverse? And why?
 

Latest posts

Back
Top