Need help: chimney leaks creosote, and some smoke into house

[jabog6]

Hi folks,

I have used a new hearthstone heritage for 2 months or so, and am loving it. I had the chimney installed by a professional - it's insulated stovepipe, through the attic of my one-story ranch. So far so good, and saving lots of heating oil.

Here's where I need help.
First issue: I've noticed a small drip of dark brown gunk, I'm guessing creosote. I traced it to dripping out at the joints between some of the insulated sections in the attic. It falls onto the ring around the stack, through the ceiling, and onto the back of the stove. It's no big deal in itself - I've wiped it a few times. I'm worried about this dripping onto a hot stove and igniting, and I'm worried it might be telling of a defective chimney.

Second issue (maybe related?). Today is really windy, and I've noticed that when the fire was starting, and smoking a bit, there was smoke entering the house at two locations: the connection between the stove and the stovepipe, and the connection between the stovepipe and the insulated section near the ceiling. Both locations would smoke at the same time, but only if the stove door was open (as the fire was starting). Once I closed the door, the smoking would stop immediately.

Relevant piece of info: I know that the firewood I got is not as dry as should be. It does smoke a bit and is sometimes hard to start.

Sorry for the long message. I'd appreciate some advice on the safety of my setup.

Thanks in advance!

 

[capetrees]

First and foremost, you shouldn't have a "leak" at any joint inside the house. That is allowing for smoke, creosote and CO to enter the home. I would call the installer immediately to have the joints sealed.

The smoke coming in on windy days could mean a couple of things as I have the same problem but with a brick chimney. First, do you have a vented cap on the chimney? This blocks the wind from coming down the chimney while at the same time allowing for the smoke to exit the chimney. The other thing to check is downdrafts. It's hard to "see" them but the chimney needs to be free of any downdrafts. If the top of the chimmney is below the roof line, downdrafts could be swirling down toward the chimney. Topography also can play a part in this. Make sure the top is elevated to allow the smoke to disipate freely. If there are downdrafts and the cap can't be raised, there are caps that will still allow for the smoke to disipate freely while guarding against downdrafts. Askl your installer about caps.

 

[jabog6]

capetrees, thanks for your reply.

A friend of mine (who knows this stuff way more than I do) gave me similar advice. He said those connections (stove-to-pipe, etc) are not perfect and normally rely on there being lower pressure inside the pipe, such that if anything leaks, it's air into the pipe, and not smoke into the house. Like you, he also guessed that the very windy weather was somehow raising the pressure inside the chimney, while the fire was starting. Might be a downdraft? I'll look into vented caps. In the meantime, the stove is cranking nicely, and no smoke whatsoever in the house. (I do have a smoke and CO detector) In any event, thanks again for helping out.

If anyone can offer advice on the creosote drip, I'd appreciate that too. :biggrin:

 

[Encore]

If it's actually creosote leaking into your attic and onto your ceiling, I'd really take a look at that and seal that up as quick as possible. That sounds like a pretty serious problem to have

 

[loadthestove]

someone please correct me if Im wrong but aren't chimney pipes supposed to be installed (male end down) so any cresote will run down inside of pipe instead of the outside.

 

[husky455rancher]

i do believe you are right. i agree thats not normal at all. you shouldnt have anything leaking into your house. i would call the guy who build the chimney asap.
i hope you have a carbon minoxide detector. mine saved me a few years ago. actually i have 2 one upstairs and one in the cellar. i felt like crap for days and my then wife at the time started feeling like crap too. then she asked about the detector i said yeah its right there. so i got to thinking about it and went and got the one from the cellar and brought it up in the living room and it started screaming. i had her take the kids to my moms then i opened up the house in the dead of winter. emptied the stove and cleaned everythig out real well. what i believe happened is i think a bunch of fine ash built a bridge over the top plate as there isnt alot of room for the air to circulate. after i cleaned it out it was fine it actually burned better. i do this twice a year now.

please dont take this stuff lightly i love my wood heat but precautions must be taken to ensure everythig is safe.

 

[mrdinks]

someone please correct me if Im wrong but aren't chimney pipes supposed to be installed (male end down) so any cresote will run down inside of pipe instead of the outside.

Absolutely correct, to me it seems backwards when I install it but the male should point down in the female so what ever runs down does not run out. Take a look and if its the other way your installer messed up.

+1 on the carbon monoxide detector, I hope you have one and if not go get one today. Get one with the digital display on it so you can see what is going on.
Neither problem is normal and should be looked into.
Good luck

 

[jabog6]

As I said, I do have a CO detector, bought new 2 months ago when I got the stove. We also left two windows partially open last night (better safe than sorry!).

I left 2 messages with the guy that installed the chimney. I'm hoping he can come out tomorrow to check it out.

I'll go (carefully) onto the roof this afternoon to see if the cap is obstructed or something... Yes, I'll be careful not to fall off!

Nobody's using this stove until this all gets figured out. I really appreciate the advice from all you experienced wood heaters! :msp_thumbsup:

 

[dmlefevre]

I have a Hearthstone Heritage that is vented into a masonry chimney. Wonderful stove. It does not like poorly seasoned wood at all. When I first got mine, it was a challenge to keep the glass clean because of the under seasoned wood I was using. Smoked like a bugger. I also had to run it with the air controls wide open in order to get any decent burns at all. That defeats the efficiency of the secondary burn tubes this stove has, and still smokes out the neighborhood. You will be much happier when your wood is better seasoned. The seasoned wood will burn cleaner and hotter so you can adjust the air controls and engage the secondary burns. Therefore it will heat much longer with less wood usage and you (and your neighbors) will see very little smoke from your chimney. Smart move shutting down the stove until it is checked. There should be no leakage of any type.

 

[turnkey4099]

Absolutely correct, to me it seems backwards when I install it but the male should point down in the female so what ever runs down does not run out. Take a look and if its the other way your installer messed up.

+1 on the carbon monoxide detector, I hope you have one and if not go get one today. Get one with the digital display on it so you can see what is going on.
Neither problem is normal and should be looked into.
Good luck

I tried to explain that to my neighbor when he first rented a ahouse with a stove. Crap dripping from every joint in the pipe from stove to ceiling. He wouldn't believe me. But then he is a country boy who knows all there is to know about everything. Such as: He planted a row of saplings in the middle of his pasture to screen the view of his house. Wouldn't believe me that his cows would eat them. Somehow the subject never came up after that .

CO2/fire detector combined is a good shot. I bought a new one this morning $35.00. Mine started chirping for 'low battery' indication Friday, New, fresh batteries didn't cure it. Since it was over 15 years old I figured time to replace anyhow.

Harry K

 

[jabog6]

Update

So, I took the cap off and sure enough it was pretty gummed up. I also shone a light into the chimney, and saw what looked like a partial obstruction halfway down (where the chimney has 2 45 degree elbows in the attic). In the meantime, the guy that installed the pipe was nice enough to return my call (on a Sunday!) and showed up half an hour later. He cleaned the chimney and I'll be lighting the stove up tonight. Seems that the main problem is that (1) the firewood I got is not well seasoned, and (2) I have not been diligent enough about proper burning technique. It's not easy being a rookie... :bang:

Interestingly, he didn't know how to clean the creosote out of the stove. He is used to other brands, where you can clean it all out from the firebox, but the Hearthstone seems to want to be cleaned from the top, by removing the stovepipe. We had to remove 3 cotter pins, and the ceramic baffle from inside the firebox. Is this the best way?? It was kind of a pain to do.

Thanks again to all for your responses.

 

[blackdogon57]

Good of the installer to come and help you out. If you got that much build up in two months your wood must be really wet. If i were you I would get someone else to inspect your system to ensure that is was installed properly. Some of the problems you described don't sound too good

 

[dmlefevre]

As far as cleaning the stove itself, check with the company you bought the stove from. The Hearthstone folks I've dealt with in CT have been excellent.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk

 

[Groundcover]

Sounds like you may need to let your wood season a bit more and you need to run your stove much hotter. You should only see smoke from the chimney on start up and reload. When you start or refill the stove run it wide open till it gets up to temp. This will get the wood burning well and help drive out some of the extra moisture. If you don't need a lot of heat build a small fire and burn that hot,if you fill the stove up and cut back the air you will get a dirty burn and plug your chimney up. If you don't have a stack thermometer it would be a good idea to get one,you can also get magnetic ones. Much easier to tell how your burn is going,kind of like having a speedometer in the car.

 

[chowdozer]

So, I took the cap off and sure enough it was pretty gummed up. I also shone a light into the chimney, and saw what looked like a partial obstruction halfway down (where the chimney has 2 45 degree elbows in the attic). In the meantime, the guy that installed the pipe was nice enough to return my call (on a Sunday!) and showed up half an hour later. He cleaned the chimney and I'll be lighting the stove up tonight. Seems that the main problem is that (1) the firewood I got is not well seasoned, and (2) I have not been diligent enough about proper burning technique. It's not easy being a rookie... :bang:

Interestingly, he didn't know how to clean the creosote out of the stove. He is used to other brands, where you can clean it all out from the firebox, but the Hearthstone seems to want to be cleaned from the top, by removing the stovepipe. We had to remove 3 cotter pins, and the ceramic baffle from inside the firebox. Is this the best way?? It was kind of a pain to do.

Thanks again to all for your responses.

Cleaning the stovepipe is not a fix for a leaking pipe. The leaking has nothing to do with how your wood is seasoned or how you are burning. There is no way for a properly installed stovepipe to leak under any circumstance unless you had a complete thermal meltdown.


As others have mentioned, your pipe joints are facing the wrong direction. There is no sealant or cleaning procedure that is going to fix this. Do not burn your stove in this condition. Yah, CO2 detectors and smoke detectors are great and they can save your family, but... they are not meant to be your primary safety plan in lieu of properly installed equipment. If you do have a fire in your home, your insurance company is going to baulk at re-imbursing you based on your stovepipe installation.


Please, fix your stovepipe. I do not want you to be a statistic.

 

[turnkey4099]

So, I took the cap off and sure enough it was pretty gummed up. I also shone a light into the chimney, and saw what looked like a partial obstruction halfway down (where the chimney has 2 45 degree elbows in the attic). In the meantime, the guy that installed the pipe was nice enough to return my call (on a Sunday!) and showed up half an hour later. He cleaned the chimney and I'll be lighting the stove up tonight. Seems that the main problem is that (1) the firewood I got is not well seasoned, and (2) I have not been diligent enough about proper burning technique. It's not easy being a rookie... :bang:

Interestingly, he didn't know how to clean the creosote out of the stove. He is used to other brands, where you can clean it all out from the firebox, but the Hearthstone seems to want to be cleaned from the top, by removing the stovepipe. We had to remove 3 cotter pins, and the ceramic baffle from inside the firebox. Is this the best way?? It was kind of a pain to do.

Thanks again to all for your responses.

He came but doesn't seem to have addressed the problem. Namely a leaking stove pipe. No matter what you asre burning, a properly installed chimney does not leak.

If the chimney sections fit one into another, it is upside down. If it is 'screw together' like mine it still should not leak. I have triple wall insulated (forget the brand name - 30 years ago) with sections meeting face to face srewed togther with a 1/8 turn.

Harry K

 

[greendohn]

Wet wood and cold stove pipe = condensation. Like a glass of iced tea in the summertime, it sweats. Smaller, hotter fires might help avoid this. Get your wood drier ASAP by placing some near the wood stove(not too close) to pull some h2o out of it. Find some seasoned wood. I think the other guys are correct in reference to the the "male" end of the stove pipe pointing up. you might also use the "search" function to look into "negative pressure" in your house. Be safe and good luck.

 

[CrappieKeith]

So, I took the cap off and sure enough it was pretty gummed up. I also shone a light into the chimney, and saw what looked like a partial obstruction halfway down (where the chimney has 2 45 degree elbows in the attic). In the meantime, the guy that installed the pipe was nice enough to return my call (on a Sunday!) and showed up half an hour later. He cleaned the chimney and I'll be lighting the stove up tonight. Seems that the main problem is that (1) the firewood I got is not well seasoned, and (2) I have not been diligent enough about proper burning technique. It's not easy being a rookie... :bang:



Thanks again to all for your responses.

Well you got to what I was going to point out.
Burning dry wood is a big deal...for a few different reasons that all benefit you.
Learning not to smolder fires is something you'll figure out as well as learning to brush your own flue.
Lastly...since you are or had drafting issue a cause aside from the wet wood could have been..not enough combustion air.I see it is overlooked often and it is not always the cause,but it is certainly something to look at.

 

[Fred Wright]

I'm gonna presume this is manufactured chimney. I'm no expert.... just did a lot of research and reading on pre-fab chimney before we had one installed.

The bends in your attic should be 30°, not 45°. From what I understand, 45° bends aren't permitted in pre-fab chimney installs.

That said, I agree ~ the connections should not be leaking creosote or anything else. Leaks mean the thing wasn't installed properly. Pre-fab chimney sections can't be fitted together backward ~ they're made goof proof for just that reason.

What's got me wondering is... if the contractor took a shortcut and used stovepipe instead of pre-fab chimney sections. I hope this isn't the case.