Need to get these running

[neutral4x4]

It could have soft seized and scored things up a little, but would still turn over. That's what happened to mine. If you pull the muffler and check the piston (as was mentioned earlier in the thread) you should be able to tell.

It might be that the valve went bad and thats why they put it away, or the valve could have gone bad and the cylinder soft seized, or it could be neither of those. If the cylinder soft seized, the piston could be junk, or it could be fine. I would start with swapping the decomp. valve and see where it goes from there.

The 51 looks like it might as well just be a parts saw with that hole under the bar mounts anyway.

When you're learning, it always helps to think like my grandpa. He used to tell me: "It's already broken. Don't worry about breaking something else learning. You can't make it any worse off than it is." Everything goes back together just like you took it apart.

 

[newlotstolearn]

took it off, got some pics.

is it supposed to look like that in there?

Gotta find a hex wrench :agree2:

 

[newlotstolearn]

how will I know if its scored? what does "scored" mean?

 

[murf]

how will I know if its scored? what does "scored" mean?

Vertical lines, scratches or scores in the cylinder and/or piston. If you got scoring, then you got some money to spend if you wanna get it running again!

Bottom line Scoring = BAAADDDD!!!!!

Good Luck!
Murf

 

[newlotstolearn]

Really appreciate all the advice!

got out the hex set...

 

[Kennygee]

Gulp!

Well, judging by pics 27a&b it doesn't look to good. It looks like there is a extreme amount of carbon buildup.

You do NOT want to force/clean any of that into the cylinder.
You may want to go back to the one with the broken mounts and learn how to remove a cylinder before going any further with this one.

It is really not that difficult, If I can do it sureley You can too.

Make sure You have a good set of long handle metric allen wrenches.

Go to the Search feature and do a search for engine rebuild,cylinder removal,piston removal etc and start reading.

Take Your time and take pics,and use tape and or tags to label items as You take them apart.

Try to keep screws etc. in containers for each saw and label them.

There are a LOT of guys on here willing to help who have probably forgotten more than I know!!

 

[newlotstolearn]

thanks for the reassurance, I didn't mess with any of it for just that reason. And the labelling advice is excellent, Thank you.

ok... I have about 20 different sets of allen wrenches spread around, I got out the main one I use, it has both metric and standard, my dads old saw set I think. I will look around for "engine rebuild"....

 

[adkranger]

OK, looking at your pics of the Decomp valve and the port where it mounts, it quite obvious that it was leaking for awhile (evidenced by all that black carbon buildup). It probably was not reseating properly or the entire valve body was loose in the mounting hole allowing blow by. You can try to clean up the decomp valve, soak in a penetrating fluid or carb cleaner is even better. It should snap positively in either direction (open & closed), if it's loose or doesn't snap into position and stay there dump it. Like said they are interchangeable, clean up the one from the 51 see if that one will work. Worse case you can find a meteric bolt to put in the valve's place and just seal up the port. You won't have a decomp valve but if the piston/cylinder is good you'll have good compression. In other words a decompression valve is not necessary at all on a saw that size (cc wise), it's merely a convenience.

I'd pull the muffler off next to take a look inside the cylinder and at the piston as well. From looking at the decomp port it appears to have run pretty rich. I suspect you're going to find carbon build up in the exhaust port, muffler and probably piston top. Not necessarily the end of the world, but more opportunity to learn as you tear the top end off (cylinder). Get the muffler off and post up some more pics. You're doing good.

Oh, one more thing. Is this the saw you mentioned was leaking fuel passed the spark plug? How does that plug fit the threaded hole in the cylinder head? The hole looks a little funky in the pics, but it could be just the pic. It should thread in smoothly and tighten.

 

[newlotstolearn]

thank you,

I got the muffler off, pics are in last post on previous page

ran with too much oil? too low a ratio like 32:1?

And does anyone know the specs on this saw (Husky 257)

Im hoping to end up with a saw I can run a 20" bar on a regular basis.

and really... Im broker then broke, and hoping to pull a saw together to go do some work, so the least (if any) amount of money spent/invested at this point, the better.

 

[Kennygee]

piston pics

Well the rest of piston looks O.K. there sure looks like there will be a lot of build -up on top of it.

Carbon comes mainly from using a Dino= based oil and usually too much of it. It doesn't all get burned in combution.

I personally wouldn't try to clean the carbon from piston/cylinder without removing cylinder.

the carbon could cause more damage to pston /cylinder

 

[newlotstolearn]

ok, where do I go from here, and how do I get there?

And what kind of mix is best to use?

 

[adkranger]

thank you,

I got the muffler off, pics are in last post on previous page

ran with too much oil? too low a ratio like 32:1?

And does anyone know the specs on this saw (Husky 257)

Im hoping to end up with a saw I can run a 20" bar on a regular basis.

and really... Im broker then broke, and hoping to pull a saw together to go do some work, so the least (if any) amount of money spent/invested at this point, the better.

OK, you were posting those as I was typing.......

You'll definitely need to pull that cylinder for a proper cleaning. That thing was running snotty (industry term ). If possible turn the flywheel (thing with fins where the recoil starter goes) till the top of the piston is visible inside the exhaust port (where muffler goes). Give us a view of the piston where the rings are, top of piston and if you spin it a bit more maybe a shot of the cylinder wall (piston below the "window").

I concur with the other poster, practice cylinder removal on the 51. Just don't mix parts. Good luck, keep going.......

 

[newlotstolearn]

this makes me want to move my computer into the garage until this is all done.

yeah, I will go take those pictures...

How do I remove the piston/cylinder?

 

[adkranger]

ok, where do I go from here, and how do I get there?

And what kind of mix is best to use?

Use a quality chainsaw rated 2 cycle oil. I won't get into brands as that usually starts a #### storm here on AS. It ultimately doesn't really matter as long as it's rated for air cooled chainsaws. As far as mix ratio (gas to oil) anywhere from 40:1 to 50:1 is fine (again, this can start a whole bunch of crap here, search "oil threads" if you want some entertainment sometime). Most of my saws are designed for either 40:1 or 50:1 from the manufacturer depending on vintage. This has more to do with oil technology than anything (oils have improved over time). I personally split the difference and run my mix at 45:1. Hopefully I didn't just start a whole lot of crap in your thread with this post, but you did ask........:help:

 

[adkranger]

this makes me want to move my computer into the garage until this is all done.

yeah, I will go take those pictures...

How do I remove the piston/cylinder?

There are four allen screws in the base of the cylinder that will need to be removed. You'll need an allen wrench (six sided bit) with a long shank, say 5-6" anyways. Better if it's T-handled for the extra grip/leverage. 5mm I think. After the screws are out, you'll have to "break" the cylider loose from the base gasket by pulling firmly, but gently from the top. Don't just rip it off, after it breaks loose from the gasket, raise it slowly until the piston & rod start showing out the bottom. Grasp the piston with one hand and continue to pull up on the cylinder. If you just rip it off, damage can occur. After that post up some pics of the related bits.............

 

[little possum]

These guys are giving great advice.

One thing I can add is bolt separation.
I use small tin cans and label them with a marker. I set the bolts in and label so I can put it away, then pull it out later and remember where the bolts went.

Goodluck, and welcome aboard!

 

[newlotstolearn]

more pics of the 257

ok before I get to piston/cylinder removal on the 51, I snapped those shots of the 257 cylinder wall. I couldn't get any good shots of the bottom of the piston, sorry, Best I could do

 

[newlotstolearn]

the 51

the muffler was a lot cleaner on the 51 than the 257 (on the inside). And both the piston and cylinder wall looked cleaner than the 257.

I had to remove the carburetor on the 51 before I could get to the base screws on the cylinder. I can only see 2 though, not 4. I am using 9/16 and its fitting perfectly.

The 51 doesn't spark.

And on a side note:
I just don't see how people could let their saws get like these. I used the same saw 5 days a week for the last 6 months, and with regular maintenance and care, it never looked anywhere near like these...... These pictures are after I cleaned a bunch of build up out (accept in/around cylinder and carb)!

 

[madhatte]

The best thing is that you have some of the easiest saws ever made for working on to learn from. They all will run again, I think.

I am amused by the "chain" muff mod on the 51.

Replace that decomp valve. It's not expensive. Don't even worry about it. Heck, plug it -- it's only a 60cc saw.

 

[andrethegiant70]

Those saws are a GREAT score... and free! Take your time and have fun with it. I'll have to mention that the pics of the piston are too fuzzy for me to see its condition.

FYI, the 261 and the 257 are more sought after than the 51. It's a good saw, but the others are great saws.