New Miller

[David Hornor]

I've been around saws all my life, grew up in the mountains where stoves were our only source of heat. I was using a chainsaw before I lost my virginity. Probably because of it. Gals would say "you have such broad shoulders!" I attributed it to axe handling.

I decided to get into milling, and I'm green as a new felled oak. I have a few questions. I'll do long slabs for others, but my specialty is butts and burls.

I bought a longsaw without a lot of research and now I'm having challenges. I started with a Stihl MS 661 R-CM. I didn't like having to set up the mill then disassemble it for crosscutting several times an outing. I bought a Stihl MS 880 Magnum to dedicate to the mill, a 56" Granberg Alaskan, along with a Stihl 47" guide bar. I bought big cuz for the 66 I'd bought a 36" rig, which was too short. Now I'm too long. Fuelly loaded the rig is over 50 pounds, which is exhausting, resulting in uneven slabbing, and more work finishing the piece.

I'm a one man show and decided to ask how y'all do it. How do y'all do it?

I was thinking maybe a boom device, or rigging a mechanical advantage, or buying yet another rig that's in between, (say a 42") and powering it with the 66, or a 461, and using the 88 for crosscutting. Or maybe abandoning the portable mill for a hydraulic or something.

What do y'all think?

 

[Boogedy_Man]

No way I'd be taking a saw in and out of a mill during a workday. I pretty well consider my mills saws dedicated to that duty. Good call there.

I've got a 661 set up with a 50" bar in a 48" mill...of course the cut is smaller than that. Don't have any problems pushing it for a few hours. It's actually much tougher for me on a smaller log...to crack that code I just set up a smaller mill.

880 on a 56"er is out of my league, but seems definitely doable.

 

[David Hornor]

I've got a monster tree in Oregon I'm preparing for. My cousin wants to remove a 14' diameter tulip tree. 56" is half way there.

 

[BobL]

I doubt there are many folks on the forum lazier and more unfit than me.

My 3 poster all Al rig is over 70 lbs with the 60" bar and and 880 fully loaded with fuel and aux oiler.
To move mills around I use removable wheels that connect to the mill rails.
This is an old photo with the 076 - note all the handles making it easier to manoeuvre and handle

This one is a 4 poster Steel/Ally mill weighs ~80 lbs


I use log rails on every cut so I just lean the mill up against the rails and lever it up onto the log then remove the wheel

Start the saw on the rails, let it cool down on the rails at the other.

The weight of the mill is not a problem compared to the weight of the timber slabs - fortunately there's usually this around

 

[Garrit]

@David Hornor You should add a winch to your mill. Is it the weight of lugging 50 lbs around, during the cut that is the issue or starting out the cut?

@BobL I like the idea of using rails for each cut, especially for starting and ending the cut along with the warm up and cool down! You are a problem solver!

 

[IyaMan]

@David Hornor You should add a winch to your mill.

A winch would be very helpful to take off the physical strain. As well as always using guide rails (not just easier to mount/dismount, but the mill slides way smoother on the rails instead of the face of the wood).

Also note @BobL uses an aux throttle on his big mills, allowing him to stand and support the mill from elsewhere.
And notice that he has added rollers for where the mill hits the side of the log. After putting some wheels on my mill like this (just some old casters) it glides along way smoother down the log.

And of course, getting the log on a downward angle helps tremendously.

 

[Cabin by the Creek]

Start the saw on the rails, let it cool down on the rails at the other.

Bob L what is that on the middle of your bar? Something for sag?

 

[David Hornor]

@David Hornor You should add a winch to your mill. Is it the weight of lugging 50 lbs around, during the cut that is the issue or starting out the cut?

@BobL I like the idea of using rails for each cut, especially for starting and ending the cut along with the warm up and cool down! You are a problem solver!

It's been both. Starting it has been harder, keeping it going smoothly from one side the other. I did slope the log. I think rails will help. I do feel the drag from the wood. I like the idea it's easier to start. I will add a manual winch next time.

How long do you warm up and cool down? I have not been doing that, other than letting it idle between starting it on the ground, then lifting it to the cut.

 

[David Hornor]

I doubt there are many folks on the forum lazier and more unfit than me.

My 3 poster all Al rig is over 70 lbs with the 60" bar and and 880 fully loaded with fuel and aux oiler.
To move mills around I use removable wheels that connect to the mill rails.
This is an old photo with the 076 - note all the handles making it easier to manoeuvre and handle

This one is a 4 poster Steel/Ally mill weighs ~80 lbs
View attachment 570640

I use log rails on every cut so I just lean the mill up against the rails and lever it up onto the log then remove the wheel
View attachment 570642
Start the saw on the rails, let it cool down on the rails at the other.

The weight of the mill is not a problem compared to the weight of the timber slabs - fortunately there's usually this around
View attachment 570643

Gotta have the wheels! Great idea

 

[BobL]

Bob L what is that on the middle of your bar? Something for sag?

Correct - thats the first version - details here http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/pimped-anti-big-bar-sag-device.99773/

I'm very lazy and although I have tried using a winch but I don't like losing the feel of the saw/cut.
Plus, with a slippery (read on) 70lb mill on a slope that's already significant forward pressure without me doing a thing.
Winches are useful to use on logs that cannot be sloped but if everything is on song you usually wont need a winch.

The reason you are "knackered" (technical Aussie term for sheer exhaustion bordering on emasculation by removal of testicles") is because your arms are spread too far apart while operating the mill. This puts high load on your shoulders and arms so to reduce this you need to bring your arms closer together. This requires a remote throttle which is the simplest case can be a loose zip tie that slips over the trigger and more better located handles on the mill.

Then, instead of using your arms to push, get the log up on blocks so you can lean on the saw's wrap handle with your thigh/hip.
This also leaves your arms free to do things like drive in wedges while you continue cutting.
It's not easy to see in this picture but 90+% of the forward pressure is on the wrap handle from my left leg.


The underside of my mill's rails are lined with HDPE which makes it slide on the log rails very easily.


Far less slope is needed if this done. Even in this dry aussie hardwood I can still get the mill to cut by itself.


Last but not least is the chain. Most folks don't use enough hook or low enough rakers.
Read this http://www.arboristsite.com/communi...nts-tips-and-tricks.93458/page-6#post-4107285
If you like post a close up, dead side on, photo on any of your cutters and I will give you a diagnosis of your cutters.

If all these stars are aligned then the saw will self feed to some extent and you will need very little pressure or a winch.

 

[David Hornor]

Correct - thats the first version - details here http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/pimped-anti-big-bar-sag-device.99773/

I'm very lazy and although I have tried using a winch but I don't like losing the feel of the saw/cut.
Plus, with a slippery (read on) 70lb mill on a slope that's already significant forward pressure without me doing a thing.
Winches are useful to use on logs that cannot be sloped but if everything is on song you usually wont need a winch.

The reason you are "knackered" (technical Aussie term for sheer exhaustion bordering on emasculation by removal of testicles") is because your arms are spread too far apart while operating the mill. This puts high load on your shoulders and arms so to reduce this you need to bring your arms closer together. This requires a remote throttle which is the simplest case can be a loose zip tie that slips over the trigger and more better located handles on the mill.

Then, instead of using your arms to push, get the log up on blocks so you can lean on the saw's wrap handle with your thigh/hip.
This also leaves your arms free to do things like drive in wedges while you continue cutting.
It's not easy to see in this picture but 90+% of the forward pressure is on the wrap handle from my left leg.
View attachment 570779

The underside of my mill's rails are lined with HDPE which makes it slide on the log rails very easily.
View attachment 570776

Far less slope is needed if this done. Even in this dry aussie hardwood I can still get the mill to cut by itself.
View attachment 570777

Last but not least is the chain. Most folks don't use enough hook or low enough rakers.
Read this http://www.arboristsite.com/communi...nts-tips-and-tricks.93458/page-6#post-4107285
If you like post a close up, dead side on, photo on any of your cutters and I will give you a diagnosis of your cutters.

If all these stars are aligned then the saw will self feed to some extent and you will need very little pressure or a winch.

The reason you are "knackered"... ...your arms are spread too far apart while operating the mill
Yup. I have to use my thumb to trigger the trigger. I feel like I'm trying to fly.

Love the HDPE. Great idea!

Rails are a must. I've been using pine 2x4's. Someone suggested a ladder. I was lifting to the cut, not to the rail. I'm a ropes expert and was going to rig a lifting boom and a come-a-long mechanical advantage.

I've had cuts where the saw sucks itself along, and I'm always trying to recapture that effect. I did change the chain to a full comp ripper, and was wondering if that slowed the suck. I was using a skip rip on a shorter bar when I was sucked into it's reality. Also was doing oak, not walnut, as I am now. Back to oak in a few weeks.

 

[BobL]

[QUOTE="David Hornor, post: 6214793, member: 149503" Yup. I have to use my thumb to trigger the trigger. I feel like I'm trying to fly.[/QUOTE]

My fave mod is this remote trigger.
It has a throttle lock (that brass knob) and the kill switch works too.
The position and "rotate handle top forwards" (opposite to a MC) is entirely natural because it's done with the left hand.

Rails are a must. I've been using pine 2x4's. Someone suggested a ladder. I was lifting to the cut,

Ladders work fine but I reckon they are too marrow for some wider logs and long bars where you need all the stability you can get.

I've had cuts where the saw sucks itself along, and I'm always trying to recapture that effect.

That's cutter/raker profile in action, post a picture of your cutters and I will see if I can spot anything.

 

[IyaMan]

Love the HDPE. Great idea!

Rails are a must. I've been using pine 2x4's. Someone suggested a ladder.

If you sand and wax up those pine rails, it will glide much smoother. (use harder wax, even an old candle will do. Don't use the liquid stuff)

 

[David Hornor]

If you sand and wax up those pine rails, it will glide much smoother. (use harder wax, even an old candle will do. Don't use the liquid stuff)

Part of the reason I use wood rails is I free hand the first cut. Remember, I'm working on stump butts and roots, and my first cut is often atypical.