I just got my 036 pro today. This thing is mint. Looks like it was only used once. It came with a brand new 24" STIHL sprocket tip bar and two full chisel chains. This bar is really overkill for what I will be using the saw for and is probably a little large for the saw as well. It is a 3/8" .050. I will probably sell the bar and replace it with an 18" bar. The thing is I also have a brand new 18" bar and chain already, but this is an .325" .063. I can't return it, because the package was opened by me. I can either swap out the rim sprocket on the 036 to to a .325 and run this 18" bar or buy another bar and chain combo for the 3/8" .050. Then I would sell both of the ones I already have. My question is this. Is there a real noticeable difference between the two sizes 3/8 or .325. This saw will become my main firewood saw. I cut about 5 to 6 full cords a year for partial home heating. You guys may find it funny, but I have been using a homelite vi super 2 with a 16" bar prior to this. The 036 pro will probably impress the he!! out of me. I am just tired of having to spend so much time cutting with the smaller saw. I decided to spend some cash and get a real saw to make that part of the work easier.
New Stihl 036 pro
- Thread starter bigair
- Start date
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SIRCHOPALOT
ArboristSite Operative
stay with the 3/8 chain if you can. I had the same problem you did with the new bar. I took it to the one dealer I trust (which is not a local dealer) and he just traded me for the bar I wanted and I just paid him the few dollars difference. he didn't even care that it had no package. also a good way to find the dealer you like.
Justin Garrison
ArboristSite Operative
310 or 390 would be good for occasional use, and are good saws, just not pro quality. Jeff did mean 390 instead of 360. The Ms 290,310,390, are all built on the same chassis. Its more or less the same saw with more power with the bigger models. I have a 290, I question the way it was built, and from now on only will buy pro saws, but it runs great.
ccicora
Addicted to ArboristSite
Justin, Have you ported the muffler on that 029? It makes it into a new saw with a muffler port job.
There's nothing wrong with the way the 290/310/390 are built.
"bigair", I was curious about the performance difference between .325 and 3/8 on my 036. I run 3/8 anyway because my other saws do, but I picked up an Oregon bar/chain combo and an 8-tooth rim for the .325, which is almost exactly the same diameter as the 3/8-7t, for the same chain speed.
Results of an informal test by myself and a helper on the stopwatch, primarily of brand new Stihl chain and drive rims cutting nominally 10" shagbark hickory, using an 036 with 20" bars:
<table border="1" cellpadding="4"><td align="center">new 26RS / 8-tooth rim</td><td align="center">6.50 seconds</td></tr><tr><td align="center">new 33RS / 7-tooth rim</td><td align="center">7.75 seconds</td></tr><tr><td align="center">filed 33RS / 7-tooth rim</td><td align="center">6.75 seconds</td></tr><tr><td align="center">new 35SL / 8-tooth rim</td><td align="center">8.25 seconds</td></tr></table>
If I wasn't concerned about being able to share stuff with my other (bigger) saws, I'd definitely run Stihl .325 on my 036.
Glen
"bigair", I was curious about the performance difference between .325 and 3/8 on my 036. I run 3/8 anyway because my other saws do, but I picked up an Oregon bar/chain combo and an 8-tooth rim for the .325, which is almost exactly the same diameter as the 3/8-7t, for the same chain speed.
Results of an informal test by myself and a helper on the stopwatch, primarily of brand new Stihl chain and drive rims cutting nominally 10" shagbark hickory, using an 036 with 20" bars:
<table border="1" cellpadding="4"><td align="center">new 26RS / 8-tooth rim</td><td align="center">6.50 seconds</td></tr><tr><td align="center">new 33RS / 7-tooth rim</td><td align="center">7.75 seconds</td></tr><tr><td align="center">filed 33RS / 7-tooth rim</td><td align="center">6.75 seconds</td></tr><tr><td align="center">new 35SL / 8-tooth rim</td><td align="center">8.25 seconds</td></tr></table>
If I wasn't concerned about being able to share stuff with my other (bigger) saws, I'd definitely run Stihl .325 on my 036.
Glen
TonyM
ArboristSite Guru
Glens, have you considered that chain speed may not be as important of factor as number of teeth passing a given point per unit of time. Even though the .325 pitch has the same chain speed, more cuts are being made per second. I wonder what result you would have had using an 8 tooth with 3/8 RS? Obviously the 036 has enough guts to handle more cuts/second. I'm not disputing what you are saying, just stirring some though. I think that the 3/8 pitch with an 8 tooth would rob more horsepower than the .325 with an 8 tooth, as the friction is probably fairly constant, but the faster surface feet would result in a higher power loss. Also I wonder what 3/8 pitch with the rakers set at .030" using a 7 tooth would give?
The Stihl .325 cuts the same width swath through the wood in my non-caliper-measurement observations as the Stihl 3/8, while the Oregon .325 I'd used cuts an obviously narrower kerf. That <i>should</i> provide an advantage to that Oregon, but the hi-top sideplates in conjunction with the lower cutter profile drastically reduce the chip-clearing ability (as my best guess for the discrepancy).
I realize that the .325-8 setup pulls more cutters at the same surface speed than the 3/8-7 does. Part of my curiosity was whether there would be a big enough nut sack to pull it off. There might be enough to pull a 3/8-8 if one were extremely careful, but the loss of dog-in-ability would be too great in my haven't-tested-that-one opinion. I'm not currently interested enough in finding that out to get (if I can) a 3/8-8 for the 036. I will be one of these days trying a 3/8-8 on an MS361 I'm carrying around with me, because I have a few of those rims in the field bag (the MS361 uses the same splines as the larger, through 066, saws).
I'm confident that a .325-7 would cut slower than the .325-8, though it would probably be the ticket for one who habitually runs dulled chain and makes good use of the bumper spikes.
New Stihl RS (and RM) is really a bit too aggressive for hickory wood, and was noticeably grabby as compared to the 1/3-used-up field-filed chain I also timed. I'd run that chain in part to correlate the times with a previous session in the same wood. It was a bit slower that (this) day, so the .325 times could be reduced to match the same conditions as present the first time. This was several months ago and I don't recall what all the differences in temperature, etc. were between the two sessions.
The only real down-sides to running the .325 in my opinion would be that Stihl doesn't offer a solid sprocket-nose bar in that pitch, and I very much prefer them for the straighter profile and larger nose diameter (in fact, I get the larger of the two noses available), and that they don't offer one longer than 20". For a person who only has one saw, one the size/capability of the 036 is ideal, and it <i>can</i> pull a 24" bar acceptably well when one of that length is more convenient for the activity. There is no reason for me to run a non-Stihl bar when Stihl bars are available (I'm speaking of the German-made ones).
Glen
I realize that the .325-8 setup pulls more cutters at the same surface speed than the 3/8-7 does. Part of my curiosity was whether there would be a big enough nut sack to pull it off. There might be enough to pull a 3/8-8 if one were extremely careful, but the loss of dog-in-ability would be too great in my haven't-tested-that-one opinion. I'm not currently interested enough in finding that out to get (if I can) a 3/8-8 for the 036. I will be one of these days trying a 3/8-8 on an MS361 I'm carrying around with me, because I have a few of those rims in the field bag (the MS361 uses the same splines as the larger, through 066, saws).
I'm confident that a .325-7 would cut slower than the .325-8, though it would probably be the ticket for one who habitually runs dulled chain and makes good use of the bumper spikes.
New Stihl RS (and RM) is really a bit too aggressive for hickory wood, and was noticeably grabby as compared to the 1/3-used-up field-filed chain I also timed. I'd run that chain in part to correlate the times with a previous session in the same wood. It was a bit slower that (this) day, so the .325 times could be reduced to match the same conditions as present the first time. This was several months ago and I don't recall what all the differences in temperature, etc. were between the two sessions.
The only real down-sides to running the .325 in my opinion would be that Stihl doesn't offer a solid sprocket-nose bar in that pitch, and I very much prefer them for the straighter profile and larger nose diameter (in fact, I get the larger of the two noses available), and that they don't offer one longer than 20". For a person who only has one saw, one the size/capability of the 036 is ideal, and it <i>can</i> pull a 24" bar acceptably well when one of that length is more convenient for the activity. There is no reason for me to run a non-Stihl bar when Stihl bars are available (I'm speaking of the German-made ones).
Glen
SawTroll
Information Collector
Very interesting tread!glens said:
Another downside of the .325 would be that there are more cutters to be sharpened, isn't it?
Anyway, I hope you keep us updated when you have tried the 3/8x8 on the 361!
I am going to try that as soon as my saw is broken in, with 15" and 18" bars.
My owners manual suggests either 3/8x7, 3/8x8 or .325x9(!) on the 361.
That's a trade-off because all things being equal, you'd have to sharpen less frequently (or aggressively) in proportion. It's sort of the same argument regarding skip-tooth chain where some prefer it because it's quicker to sharpen, but each cutter will have cut twice the amount of wood for any given saw-cut than on a full-complement chain. If time in the wood is the only thing (ideally!) dulling the cutter, the skip-tooth chains will require their "easier" touch-ups more frequently. It <i>must</i> be so. A quicker sharpening required more quickly.SawTroll said:
I intend to do a comprehensive (if you can believe it) write-up of my overall experience with the saw, but I don't think I'm supposed to be in a hurry.
I do not have the manual for the 361; at least I don't recall having it anyway. It's good to learn that info.
Glen
SawTroll
Information Collector
Glen, me - and I think a lot of others - certainly look forward to that write-up. I don't think anyone would expect that you throw everything else aside, and do it in a hurry. 
I buy your statement on the sharpening, seems logic.
About the sprocket suggestions; for me the surprise is that there is no mention of the .325x8, as it is about the same diameter as the 3/8x7.
The .325x9 is slightly smaller than 3/8x8, isn't it?
I buy your statement on the sharpening, seems logic.
About the sprocket suggestions; for me the surprise is that there is no mention of the .325x8, as it is about the same diameter as the 3/8x7.
The .325x9 is slightly smaller than 3/8x8, isn't it?
Normally I'd go out and look to be sure before making a statement like this, but I think I'm safe this time. I believe the rims have 7 drive splines, and on the larger configuration the 3/8×7 is so small a diameter that the chain's drivers would interfere with the splines if they weren't "timed" to coincide with the spaces between them (same with the .325×7 on the spline size the 036 uses). On a (large-spline) .325×8, interference would be unavoidable, either directly or such that there would be a weak spot in the rim.SawTroll said:
Using the proper figure of .367 for the "3/8" chain, the pitch diameters (or amount of chain pulled per revolution) are:
<table cellpadding="4" border="1"><tr><td align="center">.325×7 = 4.55"</td><td></td></tr><tr><td align="center">.325×8 = 5.20"</td><td align="center">3/8×7 = 5.14"</td></tr><tr><td align="center">.325×9 = 5.85"</td><td align="center">3/8×8 = 5.87"</td></tr></table>
As is evident, the .325×8 actually has a slight speed advantage over the 3/8×7 while the largest of each are in fact the closest to being the same as one other.
Glen
SawTroll
Information Collector
Glen, you are of course right. The .325X8 is availiable (Oregon) for "small" 7-spline only, not the larger one that is on the 361.Lobo, the top three in that table are available for the 036, the right side and bottom left, making three, are evidently what's available for the MS361. The middle two and bottom right are the ones I have (both forms of 3/8×7). I don't anticipate buying anything else at this time, but it might be fun to compare 3/8×8 with .325×9 on the 066...
spacemule
The Peanut Gallery
Are these not measures of the same thing?TonyM said:
tony marks
Addicted to ArboristSite
personally id go 7 simply because its just less complicated and will cut as well as you could possibly need.. ive three modified saws.. the can all take 8 pin easily.. but 7 requires less thinking by me as to listening to rpm an such.. still cut like the devil itself.. the only reason id change anything ,would be if at sometime an second one way or the other made a difference.. in short,if i started racing for times etc.. mabe someday..
i compliment you on your choice of saw..
i compliment you on your choice of saw..
Not if you differentiate between linear chain speed itself, which is a function of the driver pitch diameter and RPM, v. the number of cutters passing by at that speed, which will obviously vary with pitch and/or complement.
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