Price differences on wood

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Maybe not zogger, most water heaters are on a 230 volt circuit... if you're having issues with them it could be a "service" problem of some sort.
An easy check would be to test each "leg" at the fuse/service panel, test from each "line" lug to the neutral lug... each one should be somewhere between 110 and 120 volts (220-240 across the line lugs). If one, or both are less, the problem is likely outside (or a "service" problem). Do you have a "main" panel out on a pole somewhere?? A service/fuse/breaker panel that feeds multiple buildings?? Could be the problem is out there... a bad breaker, loose/blown fuse, loose lug, etc. Just be careful man... if'n ya' ain't sure what to, and what not to touch, get somebody there that is.

Well, I went around with the meter and didn't find anything funny except no 220..so..I RE checked the fuses again and found one gone, one of the 60 amp cartridge fuses. New one in, everything is working. go figger. That is the first thing I did yesterday was check each fuse with the ohm meter, all good yesterday. so..working now. thanks for your help!

buy/sell wood.

All these various ways to sell wood sound cool......Maybe when my full size pickup is reliable again I might try.
 
Good to hear my friend... good to hear.
And I'm assuming your hair ain't standin' on end and throwin' sparks ?? L-O-L

Nope! grew up with my dad a sparky and mainframe guy, didn't learn a whole lot besides treat everything like it is live until proven thoroughly it ain't, and keep the magic smoke INSIDE whatever you are working on. Never let the magic smoke out, bad juju....
 
Different strokes I guess. I don't sell much firewood. I do a lot of clean ups for real estate brokers and banks. Supplement my heat with what I'm paid to haul off. Often, I have more wood than I will use in a season or two. I don't sell just Oak, or anything else. Mixed hardwoods, thoroughly seasoned. If I was insulted or got butt hurt when someone tried to haggle, I'd never sell a stick I doubt. As to charging different prices to different customers, absolutely. My perogative. Some are pickier than others, thus creating more work. Some deliveries are simple IE: drop it in the driveway. Others want it stacked around back. If that makes me a shyster, pound sand buddy.

May I suggest you reconsider your no haggling policy? Some folks just NEVER pay asking price. Doesn't make them a bad guy, or even cheap. I was shopping for a new TV and surround sound a couple years back. After selecting what I wanted, I asked the sales guy; any chance for a cash discount? Glad he didn't get all butt hurt and throw me out. Got 10% off for the ask.

Oh yeah, the premis of the thread. Some folks aren't harvesting the wood specifically for heating. If I had a yard full of pine, I'd rather get $75-100 for a cord than just let it rot. And if they already got paid to remove it, it offsets their cost. Thus cheaper to provide.

Not sure if you were directing this to any particular person here but it seems that the firewood sellers who respond here have no problem getting rid of their product. That includes myself. Seems they all set their price and sell out without much difficulty. So why would they or myself want to reconsider no,haggling? Looks like our market allows us to be exempt from haggling - primarily because we can offer what many sellers can't- wood that will actually burn now and in the correct quantity.
 
It's really none of my business. I just thought it funny that one poster was so offended by hagglers he refused to do further business. Not my place to tell you or anyone else how to do business.

And congrats on successfully selling out. I know how much work it represents.
 
...seems that the firewood sellers who respond here have no problem getting rid of their product.... So why would they or myself want to reconsider no,haggling? Looks like our market allows us to be exempt from haggling...

Why?? Because a successful business includes plans for growth and expansion... those that don't eventually close their doors as operating costs rise and competition drives prices down. As a retail, or sales orientated business every walking, talking or breathing body should be seen as a potential customer... if you exclude a certain segment of those breathing bodies it will eventually affect the bottom line. Customers do not live forever, they move away, lose their jobs, or even get rich and no longer need your product... expansion of your loyal customer base is your key to business survival. To see "hagglers" as unworthy of your time is only cuttin' your own throat in the future as competition grows (and it will, especially if you alienate a segment of potential customers, thereby leaving a door wide open). A much better, much smarter business tactic would be to use the haggler's own weakness against them, cultivate them into loyal customers... thereby expanding your customer base, and at the same time making it more difficult for competition to move in.

The haggler's "weakness" is simple... he wants (needs?) to believe he came out on top, that he won the haggling match. Someone who is good at it, the successful haggler, not only "wins", but also makes the other guy believe he got the "win". Many (actually most) hagglers don't even have a "goal" where they want the haggle to end, which is a huge rookie mistake... just getting a couple bucks knocked off so ya' can brag about it don't mean cold squat, you need something to "gage" whether-or-not you were actually successful. Those types are the "easy" ones, it's easy to make them feel like they "won", and they'll come back again and again to for that "winning" feeling. Let them walk away with their chests pumped up and their bragging rights... hagglin' ain't about braggin'... as a seller, it's about countin' the other guy's cash.
 
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See... you guys objecting to haggling are sayin' you want to treat everyone the same... and you can still do that even while dealing with the hagglers.

Let's say you figure your firewood is worth $220 per cord, approximately $75 per (so-called) "face" cord. So in anticipation of the haggler you price it at $250, and set your haggling goal at $225 (meaning you let the haggler believe he "won" while actually suckin' an extra $5 out'a him)... then you deliver him an exact "cord" (that's how the "deal" was made). OK, so ya' get a call from the non-haggler loyal customer... you simply deliver a "heavy" cord and/or when you collect ya' say, "Mrs. Jones, you've been a darn good customer over the years, I brought ya' a little extra, and I can knock off the $10 I normally figure in for delivery" ($5 of which was paid by the haggler).

See... everyone gets treated the same... everyone gets the same amount of wood "per-dollar"... Mrs.Jones thinks you're a "super" nice guy and remains a loyal customer... the haggler thinks he beats you out'a something and keeps comin' back for the feeling, another loyal customer.

Every customer gets treated with the same "fairness"... but every customer gets treated differently to keep it "fair" for you... and your business expands.
Hey... that's the retail trade.

*
 
Going on 18 years in the firewood biz and each year I could sell more and more. With this being a side thing, I don't exactly have a business plan or model. I don't over think things. I cut wood to a consistent length, split it to a decent size, make sure its seasoned, deliver in a timely manner, and deliver the proper amount. Word has spread and about 75-80% of sales this year are repeat or referred customers so I must be doing something right.
Haggling? Ain't got time for that!
 
Hmmmmm...... so 18 years bustin' your hump makin' firewood??
18 years and you're still doin' the cuttin', splittin' and haulin'??
18 years and you haven't made enough to walk away from that, or hire employees so ya' can sit in an office taken orders and directing operations??
18 years??
Hmmmmm....... maybe ya' should'a done a bit more hagglin'‼ :D

Sorry man, but most people don't start a business so they can still be bustin' their azz 18 years later... that ain't the point.
In the business world, as a business standpoint, you've obviously done something horribly wrong.
Even my wife has hired "employees" (of sorts) in her home-based Catering business... about a dozen people she can call to do most of the "work" (not all of them every time). She pays them an hourly wage to do the preparations, serving and clean-up while she oversees and wears a pretty dress... and, of course, cashes the check. She knows how to haggle also... she's pretty good at it.
 
So because I LIKE to cut split and haul wood as a SIDE thing, and been doing it for 18 years, there is something wrong with me? I sit inside with my day job as it is. where did I ever say Ido it all myself? I do hire teenagers here and there to help with some of the grunt work. And if I haggled, it would all be different? This is one of the most laughable posts I've ever read in any forum.
 
Hmmmmm...... so 18 years bustin' your hump makin' firewood??
18 years and you're still doin' the cuttin', splittin' and haulin'??
18 years and you haven't made enough to walk away from that, or hire employees so ya' can sit in an office taken orders and directing operations??
18 years??
Hmmmmm....... maybe ya' should'a done a bit more hagglin'‼ :D

Sorry man, but most people don't start a business so they can still be bustin' their azz 18 years later... that ain't the point.
In the business world, as a business standpoint, you've obviously done something horribly wrong.
Even my wife has hired "employees" (of sorts) in her home-based Catering business... about a dozen people she can call to do most of the "work" (not all of them every time). She pays them an hourly wage to do the preparations, serving and clean-up while she oversees and wears a pretty dress... and, of course, cashes the check. She knows how to haggle also... she's pretty good at it.

Even if I sold wood and did it full time, I like it so much I would be out cutti8ng and whatnot, even with a full crew.

My boss is very successful in his life, multiple overlapping businesses and at one time I think he said around 50 employees (not that now, he is mostly semi retired) but he still goes out and works at various things, because he likes to do it. He might tear down and rewire some fans, run some equipment, come over and harangue me and we go build another gate someplace, tear an engine apart in his shop and rebuild it..whatever. He doesn't have to do a lick, could do it all just giving orders, but..he just likes the hands on part as well.
 
So because I LIKE to cut split and haul wood as a SIDE thing, and been doing it for 18 years, there is something wrong with me? I sit inside with my day job as it is. where did I ever say Ido it all myself? I do hire teenagers here and there to help with some of the grunt work. And if I haggled, it would all be different? This is one of the most laughable posts I've ever read in any forum.

Well said. It's not the goal of every small business to grow and expand. For many firewood sellers it is part time and not intended to be a sole source of income. I do it because my other business is seasonal and firewood keeps the cash flow going. Also gives me significant tax write offs.
 
Hmmmmm...... so 18 years bustin' your hump makin' firewood??
18 years and you're still doin' the cuttin', splittin' and haulin'??
18 years and you haven't made enough to walk away from that, or hire employees so ya' can sit in an office taken orders and directing operations??
18 years??
Hmmmmm....... maybe ya' should'a done a bit more hagglin'‼ :D

Sorry man, but most people don't start a business so they can still be bustin' their azz 18 years later... that ain't the point.
In the business world, as a business standpoint, you've obviously done something horribly wrong.
Even my wife has hired "employees" (of sorts) in her home-based Catering business... about a dozen people she can call to do most of the "work" (not all of them every time). She pays them an hourly wage to do the preparations, serving and clean-up while she oversees and wears a pretty dress... and, of course, cashes the check. She knows how to haggle also... she's pretty good at it.
Wow, certainly one of the most condescending posts I've ever seen even for this place. Apparently you have some insight as to what this guy's personal business aspirations are?

So do tell us, Whitespider, exactly what great milestones have you reached in your career? Have you elevated to the level of being able to "sit in a office taken(sic) orders and directing operations" (or some such equivalent)? If not, then what are you doing in order to achieve this? From what I recall you saying, you're still busting your hump climbing towers and installing radios. Sorry man, but that kind of work is what they have 20 year olds for.
 
See... you guys objecting to haggling are sayin' you want to treat everyone the same... and you can still do that even while dealing with the hagglers.

Let's say you figure your firewood is worth $220 per cord, approximately $75 per (so-called) "face" cord. So in anticipation of the haggler you price it at $250, and set your haggling goal at $225 (meaning you let the haggler believe he "won" while actually suckin' an extra $5 out'a him)... then you deliver him an exact "cord" (that's how the "deal" was made). OK, so ya' get a call from the non-haggler loyal customer... you simply deliver a "heavy" cord and/or when you collect ya' say, "Mrs. Jones, you've been a darn good customer over the years, I brought ya' a little extra, and I can knock off the $10 I normally figure in for delivery" ($5 of which was paid by the haggler).

See... everyone gets treated the same... everyone gets the same amount of wood "per-dollar"... Mrs.Jones thinks you're a "super" nice guy and remains a loyal customer... the haggler thinks he beats you out'a something and keeps comin' back for the feeling, another loyal customer.

Every customer gets treated with the same "fairness"... but every customer gets treated differently to keep it "fair" for you... and your business expands.
Hey... that's the retail trade.

*
Some customers avoid calling when only a phone # is provided ,and prices are not advertised.
If you do advertise prices, what about the non-haggling customer that would have called at a fair advertised price of $220, but calls another firewood supplier when you advertise at the inflated price of $250?

The firewood supplier is not the only one who is aware of the fair worth of a cord. In your example, Mr Jones might reluctantly agree to your inflated price, but think he is being overcharged, until you bring him extra wood. Mr Jones only ordered a certain # of cords (like he does every year), and you tricked him into paying for more wood than usual. A loyal customer should not feel overcharged, or tricked during any part of the process.

The tactics used to attract haggling customers could cause the loss of non-haggling customers.

Extra time has to be spent on the phone with haggling customers, vs. the simple transaction with non-haggling customers.
 
I’m trying to understand something and would like some logical explanations.

I see a lot of post about wood pricing and I see a big difference in prices depending on species.

What I don’t understand is why.

A cord of wood (any wood) all cost the same to work up and produce.

So why is the price different?

I understand not all wood is the same as far as heat and burn time but why would someone work up a cord of (lets say pine) and sell it for 75 dollars a cord but will charge 150 for oak?

I don’t mess with anything but oak just because oak sells faster and makes the most money.

I understand oak is not available in all areas but the practice doesn’t seem to make since.


I suspect some of the cost issue is do to split sizes. Most of the wood I see is split in fairly large splits, witch would cut down on processing cost and time.


Can someone give me a logical explanation why the big difference?

Simply put. You are buying BTU for heat. all wood has about the same btu PER POUND. It takes more pine to make a pound than it does oak.

Bottom line. You have to buy more pine than you would oak for the same heat thus pine is not worth as much as oak.

Harry K
 
Guys, don't over think what Whitespider has posted. After 18 years, jrider, if you were doing it as a business, I'd also say you were doing it wrong. What you are doing is more of the hobby seller. Before you jump down my throat, I know it doesn't feel like a hobby given all the work you put into it. In a purely business sense, if you aren't trying to grow, you are certainly dying. Heaven forbid, you keel over tomorrow. The "business" is dead. There's nothing wrong, per se, in how you are doing it. As far as treating customers with "fairness", it's all about knowing what type of person you are dealing with. If you can't read people and adjust your tactic of "haggling", how many times will you end up the actual winner as opposed to the perceived winner?
 
So do tell us, Whitespider, exactly what great milestones have you reached in your career?

Hmmmm…. Yeah, it does come across condescending don’t it… wasn’t really lookin’ to make it that way, just tryin’ to make a point.

As for me “still busting” my “hump climbing towers and installing radios”…
I don't believe I’d use the adverb “still”, or call it a “career”… this February makes 4 years of that work and I'll tell ya’ how that came to be…

In 1981, after bouncing around a bit, I was in Oklahoma subcontracting light construction work, my brother was in Iowa City dabbling in insurance and finance, dad was working for a New Car dealer as Sales Manager. After 15 years sellin’ someone else’s cars dad saw an opportunity to buy a Ford dealership in a town about 50 miles away… but it would be a pretty big nut to crack, and he knew he would need some help. He contacted my brother and I with business deal, and after some negotiations all three of us pulled-up stakes and moved.

It was rough at first, seemed like more money going out than coming in… but eventually we turned it around, and cultivated a respectable sized customer base. In the late 80’s we'd done well enough to purchase some lakefront property in Minnesota as a family vacationing/get-a-way spot. Profit margins started dropping during the 90’s… mostly due to new expenses forced on the auto industry and dealerships by CAFE, EPA, and other “lesser” known new regulations, along with an uncertain economy. In 2001 dad had his first heart attack and quadruple bypass surgery… and a couple years later he was ready to retire… he wanted out.

This left my brother and I with a difficult business decision…
  1. We could buy dad out… but the business was worth several times what it was when we went in, profit margins were less, and regulation expenses were rising. It would be a lot like starting over, but at 50 years old instead of 25. Even the motor companies were making it “difficult” for small(er) dealerships… it was “get big, or get out”. We were looking at not only buying dad out, but the expense of major expansion in an uncertain economy.
  2. We could bring someone else in… but it had always been a “family affair” and the idea of an outsider didn't sit well with us.
  3. We could just sell out and put the cash elsewhere.
My brother’s wife was working for her father, and my wife had made pretty well on her business… we elected to sell out. As it turned out it was the best decision, the dealer that bought us out closed the doors 2 years later, and a year after that had to sell his other store.

My brother went to work for his father-in-law, and I took some time off… did some fishin’ and huntin’, utilized the lakefront “up north” quite a bit, did some part-time bartending, and helped my wife with her business. About five years ago my brother’s FIL decided to retire and offered to sell the business to him. My brother came to me with an offer to come in, but my end would only be a third, he and his wife would hold two-thirds… meaning I could be out-voted on any business decision (i.e., I wouldn’t be much more than an employee, but with all the risks of an owner… and at 50 years old). I declined… but offered to help him out getting it rolling. And that’s how I became his employee… working at a job for 20-year-olds (as you say). But “climbing towers and installing radios” is only a part of the job… I also design, engineer and build electronics. I designed and developed a remote control system for “dragline manure spreading” (if ya’ know what that is) using two-way radios… I sit in a nice heated/air-conditioned room takin’ orders and custom building them much of the time. When the business needs me out in the field… well, I did say I’d help him out, but he pays me quite generously for that sort of thing.

So… now ya’ know.
 
Hmmmm…. Yeah, it does come across condescending don’t it… wasn’t really lookin’ to make it that way, just tryin’ to make a point.
.

So what was the point that you were trying to make, that if his involvement in the business still included manual labor that he is doing something wrong?
 
Not really any "real" firewood retailers around these parts. Mostly beer can pick up guys.
I don't sell firewood, I'm a firewood hack scrounging around to heat my home.
I have sold firewood, some, like when building my woodshed I was needing some doe, or a few years back, I was pining for a new gun,,I sold a little firewood for cash money.
Haggling and bartering is "somewhat" common in these parts. ie,,knew an old hippy needing firewood who had an 8x8 sliding door with all the hardware, I traded him a load of firewood for the whole she-bang.
Hell, I had a 150 bones in the 5x6 foot sliding door I had built for another shed. After a cold beer and kicking at the dirt, "haggling" with that old hippy, we were both happy.
If'n I was selling, and a guy wanted all oak or hickory vs. a mix of hardwoods, they would pay me premium for premium wood..that's way it is around here..
 

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