Rules to storm scavenging wood

[Circle B MN]

Verbal is worth no more than the air it rode on. Piss and moan all you want, but from now till the end of time there will be a wood burner ready to buck up a flopper for free. I'd suggest spending your time hunting down climber or bucket work. It pays better anyways.

 

[buildmyown]

Ok ill clear a little up since my first post was so long.

First tree was down no hazzard at all it was in a side yard 5 feet from the curb had "FREE" spray painted along the trunk several times over. If a homeowner does that in my opinion its free game same as a washer and dryer sitting on the curb with a free sign on it the home owner just wants it gone. My saw is not quite by any means and he had about an hour of me cutting to come out and say something but he waited till i was about to pull away.

2nd case the property owner came home when i was in the middle of loading the brother in law who lives next door was the one on vacation who took the first half of the tree. I did talk to the brother in law today on the phone and he said not my tree cut what you want and can handle and ill take care of the big stuff cool headed over today for another load. As I was loading the homeowner came home with his son and they both walked over to me. We got to talking and he said his brother in law wanted the tree and then I told him the conversation I had with him and all was good. Turns out in conversation the lady they bought the house from still owns the bulk of the land there was 15 acres total and they only bought the house and a 1/2 acre they are from the city originally. The original owner now lives in Texas so I dont really think she will mind or even know for that matter she hasnt been around in 10+ years. The son is pretty cool offered to help me load and unload which he did help with, offered to come over tomorrow to help split and stack and anything else I need help with even offered to mow my lawn every week. Turns out this kid is always helping his uncle next door who as a horse farm and just loves to be outside and work hard. Work hard he did loading and unloading oh and did I mention he is only 11. Im not young and im not old im 30 but I think this kid could work me into an early grave. He even asked what time he should be over in the morning.

 

[Ironworker]

think what you want. i don't give a rats ass. This is my livelyhood. we had verbal agreements with everyone for all our jobs. In CT that's as good as on paper. 3 of our jobs called me back within 6-18 hours to say they didn't need us to do it any more. These were ALL people who sought us out to clean up their properties after the storm. We didn't strong arm anyone into anything. They came to us, we bid them, we closed the deal and then the weekend warrriors fired up their saws and decided to be heros all for the wood. I understand helping a neighbor out maybe, but in all three cases "some guy in a pickup stopped by and said he'd cleanup and take the wood for free"

My point is, there is no need to go on private property. there is destruction everywhere, just pick them up out of the shoulder of the road. hell, you can even go to the town dump and haul it out after the town guys haul it in.

This is a free country, if I had a choice of paying someone or having the work done free of cost I will go with free, just like price gougers have the right to increase their prices and take advantage of situations.

 

[Iron man]

think what you want. i don't give a rats ass. This is my livelyhood. we had verbal agreements with everyone for all our jobs. In CT that's as good as on paper. 3 of our jobs called me back within 6-18 hours to say they didn't need us to do it any more. These were ALL people who sought us out to clean up their properties after the storm. We didn't strong arm anyone into anything. They came to us, we bid them, we closed the deal and then the weekend warrriors fired up their saws and decided to be heros all for the wood. I understand helping a neighbor out maybe, but in all three cases "some guy in a pickup stopped by and said he'd cleanup and take the wood for free"

My point is, there is no need to go on private property. there is destruction everywhere, just pick them up out of the shoulder of the road. hell, you can even go to the town dump and haul it out after the town guys haul it in.

Where in CT is a verbal agreement as good as paper?..That right there tells me you have no clue what your talking about because simply talking to somebody doesn't give you exclusive rights or legal leverage in any way.That's why contracts exist!I don't like doing cleanup but would jump all over one of your verbal agreements if there was a good amount of hardwood to keep me busy for a while.

 

[sb47]

Here is something I have learned over the years, ASK for permission and you’ll be surprised that most people will go along, as long as you ask first.
Doesn’t mater what you want, just ask first.

I have scored lots of stuff by just asking and have gotten leads on other stuff as well.
Plus I sometimes find a friend in the process.

Some people will have an aptitude but at least I only had to deal with the disappointment and snotty attitude from rejection. Witch is way better then dealing with a law suite.

Dennis

 

[olyman]

as a contractor working on storm cleanup for homeowners, I must say its the woodchucks like yourself that are screwing me and my guys. we lost over $3,000 of work in a matter of 18 hours to people who will do the cleanup for "free" for the wood (after I wasted my time driving around looking at the jobs). go scavage the wood thats in the woods by the road, don't touch the ones on residential properties unless you're invited in!

oh really??? because your a tree service,,all the down trees are yours?????? including the ones on peoples property????? get off of the dope....

 

[olyman]

really? It's your wood? You are entitled to to that work? How about all the other contractors 'screwing you' out of your entitlement by competing for the jobs. Do they also tell you to stay away from residential properties unless you're invited in!

Philbert

bingo!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[olyman]

It is always appropriate to inquire first. In most storm situations, once it is at the curb, the property owner just wants it gone, and will be happy to oblige as long as you do not leave a bigger mess.

I was thinking that I would really pi** BSD off if he knew that I sometimes travel to other states at my own expense just to screw him out of wood he deserves by driving around so much.

In reality, when the volunteer groups go through, they usually clean up the smaller, easier to get stuff, and leave the larger, more technical stuff for the pros and commercial outfits. They usually prioritize on low-income households, seniors, etc., that are referred to them by the county Emergency Manager, rather than the well-heeled. I have received my share of glares from landscapers, but actually, we often make their jobs easier by clearing brush and limbs, an improving access so that they can get at and do more of the paid, technical stuff.

But if the 'storm cleanup contractor' is piling his limbs at the curb for the city/county/FEMA/whomever contractor to haul, it shouldn't really matter to him if the woodchucks help themselves to it, as long as they do not interfere with his crew.

JMHO

Philbert

DANG CORRECT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:hmm3grin2orange:

 

[GeeVee]

Scumbag opportunist BDS....

Negotiate the price, and get to work, instead of "selling it"... and I'll be back. You can go pound salt.

 

[Dalmatian90]

In CT that's as good as on paper.

Glad my mouth was empty when I read that...breakfast would've made a mess on the keyboard and monitor.

The maxim of law is a verbal contract is as good as the paper it's written on. You might have a contract, I'm sure the homeowner will say it was only a quote. Go ahead and bill them and let the Superior Court judge figure out what the terms and conditions of the contract was when it's only a he said/she said situation before him.

 

[Philbert]

The biggest complaints we have regarding contractors (any kind) following a storm are:

1) the outright rip-off artists who show up with an out-of-state truck and a cell phone, use high-pressure tactics, etc., take the money and run or do a half a** job at exorbitant rates, etc.

2) the ones that run around getting lots of people signed up or committed, then take days or weeks (or months!) to come back and do the actual work.

Following a big storm you can break the needed tree work down into 3, broad categories:

1) critical stuff that needs to get done right away: on power lines, on roofs, in roadways, blocking driveways, high-hazard trees, etc.

2) clean-up stuff that should get done as soon as possible after '1': downed or damaged trees in yards, parks, fields, etc.

3) 'recovery' stuff: pruning back damaged trees, removing stumps, etc.

If a tree contractor is upfront about and honest about what the property owner can expect, including time frames, there are fewer problems.

Philbert

 

[Locust Cutter]

You ever consider the fact that not everyone can afford to hire a tree service for cleanup after a storm? Guys that volunteer their time to help clean up and exchange their time for the firewood provide a service just like you do, they just happen to place more value on the firewood than on an hourly wage.In short, they are merely working for less money than you are.And where is the problem in that?

Damaged trees that are still a hazard to buildings and other property should be left for the pros, and that is why in most cases when doing cleanup my fees are on a sliding scale. When the tornado came through our town in April, I worked a little more than half of the time for free to help those that needed the help but couldnt afford it. A ten minute conversation with the homeowner and a quick look at their property, cars in the driveway, and their dress clearly told me if they were indigent folks who couldnt afford my $50 per man hour rate, or if they were financially able and just looking for a freebie. And I based my rates accordingly.

And the result?I handed out over a hundred business cards and work has been brisk all summer long because of it. I instantly earned a reputation of a fair guy willing to help others, and financially it was the best form of advertising I have ever done.1/3 of my business this summer has come directly from word of mouth after the storm, and in every case where I have gone to give an estimate since, the homeowner didnt even bother getting a second estimate. Almost all of them told me flat out that they had heard from a neighbor, friend, or relative that I was an honest business man, trustworthy, and charged only for the work performed.

Do a little thinking before you bash the volunteers next time. In the event that you ever suffer from a natural disaster and need the assistance of someone who has the skill and work ethic to help without a paycheck involved, you might be glad deep down inside that you are simply being handed a gift that was payed forward and you are simply being on the receiving end this time.

I know without a doubt you are thinking right now, "yeah, I have overhead man.I have boom truck payments, chippers to maintain,fuel, insurance, etc and they all dont come free" and your right.Maybe financially you are not able to fund any volunteer work. But dont bash the ones that are in a situation that allows them to volunteer their time, even if it means nothing more than a chance to stock up on some firewood.

I've made money on every major tornado/storm we've had since I was 14, either via charging for cleanup or for simply taking what wood the landowner and I agreed to (to help them for free) and then either selling it or burning it myself (the payback). I have no boom truck, chipper, etc. I DO have multiple trucks, access to trailers and am on a first-name basis w/a reputable rental yard that maintains good chippers, w/reasonable rates. Free jobs for those I thought deserved/needed it, usually just involved the removal of good bulk firewood wood leaving the small misc debris behind, leaving them immensely less mess to clean up. Those who had the cash/affluence/ability to finance the job, got a properly bid job, accounting for all costs and a reasonable labor estimate. If I went over because I underbid it, I ate the loss. I also have never taken a job that I either couldn't do properly or safely, seeing as how I'm not bonded/insured. I'm extraordinarily picky about which liabilities I'm willing to assume. The labor I've performed was usually barely a den in the overall big picture. I'm sure I pissed off a few "professionals" before, but there was more than enough to go around so screw 'em. I've gotta eat too'. So do the homeowners. I don't give handouts. I will give a hand up when I'm able.

 

[anymanusa]

as a contractor working on storm cleanup for homeowners, I must say its the woodchucks like yourself that are screwing me and my guys. we lost over $3,000 of work in a matter of 18 hours to people who will do the cleanup for "free" for the wood (after I wasted my time driving around looking at the jobs). go scavage the wood thats in the woods by the road, don't touch the ones on residential properties unless you're invited in!

troll post is trolling.

 

[tex]

Bfd bsd

You lost out on $3000? BS. Sounds like you were just as much of a woodchuck. If you'd have been busy cutting when you had your verbal agreements instead of scrounging town for more work, you'd have gotten paid.

My sister had a limb fall on her roof a couple weeks ago. The insurance company sent an arborist over to quote the job. When she didn't want to burn through her deductable to have a pro do it, and paid me gas and a box of beer, does that make me a woodchuck? Did I screw the arborist?

With your attitude, I'm surprised you get any work. Maybe you should be greatful when you do get work, instead of being bitter when you don't. You'll live a short, miserable life acting like you are.

 

[treeman82]

I was working with BSD during these storms... these were jobs that were on the "to -do list" Before we could get to these jobs we were pulling trees off of houses, roads, and so forth. So you can all believe me that he is not a scrounger. Our convoy during this storm included up to 6 guys, a 70 ton crane with operator, 3 dump trucks, 2 tractors, and 1 chipper, plus I hold 2 arborist licenses.

 

[Chris-PA]

People get confused about right-of-ways and easements - if the municipality has a right-of-way along the road, that does not mean they own the land, rather that they and the public have certain rights to use it. My rural Township owns very little land, and there are no gaps on the tax maps where the roads are. Somebody pays taxes on all that property. I've got a lot of trees along our road - the Township has the right to trim those trees, and the power company too where the lines are, but they are my trees. If they come down or need to be taken down, it's my wood. Usually I have anything that comes down cleaned up before they get there, unless it's dangerous. And if you want to park there, or put signs there, or something else not involved with using the road you'd best be asking my permission first.

On a side note, a couple of years ago the local utility had a program to do some serious tree work on their lines. They hired a company to do the work, and we were contacted by their forester. I took a morning off of work and walked the lines with him - I really liked the guy, he was a very reasonable and sensible person - and we decided what to drop and what to trim. Then nothing happened. I had planned to take some time off when they were working, so I wondered when they would come out. Eventually I found out the utility had canceled the contract to save money. They've never come out and there are plenty of young branches that are into the lines now.

 

[Section VIII]

So are there rules to scavenging wood that has been downed my a storm? Specifically wood left by the road side. We got hit pretty good by Irene and she took down a lot of trees in my area. So the day after the storm I grab the truck saws and fuel and hit the roads around my area. First day struck out second day was decent small load of maple already cut to firewood size stacked at the curb with a free sign. Third day saw an uprooted oak about 18" and 25 feet long with free spray painted on it. Score I thought jump out grab the saw and go to work get it all cut and loaded and the brush stacked by the curb. I didnt know anyone was home till I was finished and loading the saws and haveing some water. The homeowner comes out and says thanks but arent you going to take the stump and rake up the saw dust. I was hot tired and a little on edge my reply was do I look like a tree service. The way I see it I just did this guy a favor now call a tree service and have the stump ground and get a rake for the saw dust. I dont think I was out of line at all. So what say you guys what are your normal rules for this I have never had the chance to get wood from a storm.

I think you did the homeowner a favor by cutting the tree up and taking it away. Less work to actually pay for.

Ok ill clear a little up since my first post was so long.

First tree was down no hazzard at all it was in a side yard 5 feet from the curb had "FREE" spray painted along the trunk several times over. If a homeowner does that in my opinion its free game same as a washer and dryer sitting on the curb with a free sign on it the home owner just wants it gone. My saw is not quite by any means and he had about an hour of me cutting to come out and say something but he waited till i was about to pull away.

2nd case the property owner came home when i was in the middle of loading the brother in law who lives next door was the one on vacation who took the first half of the tree. I did talk to the brother in law today on the phone and he said not my tree cut what you want and can handle and ill take care of the big stuff cool headed over today for another load. As I was loading the homeowner came home with his son and they both walked over to me. We got to talking and he said his brother in law wanted the tree and then I told him the conversation I had with him and all was good. Turns out in conversation the lady they bought the house from still owns the bulk of the land there was 15 acres total and they only bought the house and a 1/2 acre they are from the city originally. The original owner now lives in Texas so I dont really think she will mind or even know for that matter she hasnt been around in 10+ years. The son is pretty cool offered to help me load and unload which he did help with, offered to come over tomorrow to help split and stack and anything else I need help with even offered to mow my lawn every week. Turns out this kid is always helping his uncle next door who as a horse farm and just loves to be outside and work hard. Work hard he did loading and unloading oh and did I mention he is only 11. Im not young and im not old im 30 but I think this kid could work me into an early grave. He even asked what time he should be over in the morning.

Now there is one good kid with his head on straight. He, in my opinion, should get paid at least $40 as a bonus after the work is done. I know that's what I would do. Even if money was not talked about, it's good to teach someone that hard work does pay at the end...as long as he understands that it is not to be expected. Like those guys who run up to your vehicle and clean your windshield at a stop light in the city and expect you to pay them.

Here is something I have learned over the years, ASK for permission and you’ll be surprised that most people will go along, as long as you ask first.
Doesn’t mater what you want, just ask first.

I have scored lots of stuff by just asking and have gotten leads on other stuff as well.
Plus I sometimes find a friend in the process.

Some people will have an aptitude but at least I only had to deal with the disappointment and snotty attitude from rejection. Witch is way better then dealing with a law suite.

Dennis

Sounds like a pretty smart thing to do to ensure no assumptions.

I was working with BSD during these storms... these were jobs that were on the "to -do list" Before we could get to these jobs we were pulling trees off of houses, roads, and so forth. So you can all believe me that he is not a scrounger. Our convoy during this storm included up to 6 guys, a 70 ton crane with operator, 3 dump trucks, 2 tractors, and 1 chipper, plus I hold 2 arborist licenses.

I'm not going to bash BSD and indirectly, you about the rant BSD had. However, a contract that states that an administrative fee will be applied if the client decides not to use you for the job and doesn't tell you about said decision until after you show up would probably be a good thing. If that's legal, anyway.

On a side note, my neighbor's 2 trees blew over/uprooted into my backyard during Hurricane IRENE. The larger one fell and took the smaller one with it--like dominos. Anyway, other than damage to a section of my fence, all was good. Both trees fell in a relatively clear area so no obstructions other than my section of the fence. She called to get a quote from a tree removal guy. He quoted $1250.00 to basically buck, haul away, and chip the remaining branches! I don't remember if grinding the stumps was included but it sounded like quite a bit of money.

She had a friend come over and cut the limbs off the trunks but his saw couldn't handle bucking. I walked over a couple weeks later (cause I got tired of seeing the work half done) and offered to finish bucking the trees. She said okay but she wanted to keep some of the wood for firewood. I left the wood in her backyard in a somewhat neatish pile and went about cleaning the saw.

Anyway, she got her brother and friend to come over a week after that and they put the bulk of the logs and branches by the curb. Someone with a trailer came later that evening and took all the wood (except the trash branches)....which the city took the next morning.

Now she still has the two stumps to deal with.

 

[1project2many]

OP, I know your area, since I grew up near there. Rule is, wood belongs to land owner where tree grew, not town, utility, or neighbor, regardless of where it fell. You show up at my place and cut without asking, I'm likely to let you cut to length, load, and as you're heading out I'll redirect you to my woodpile. After all, who turns down free help? I'd expect the nothing less than the same treatment at your place.

Always safer and better to ask. Get an understanding up front. It's a courtesy and it builds good neighbors.

I understand complaints from the guy losing work. You can spend a lot of money during a year hoping to get it back. When an opportunity comes up to make a good profit it's just wrong to have it taken from you. But... it's not the guys looking for free wood that are the problem. It's the property owners. Keep your focus and try harder to educate the owners when you bid. After all, freebie guys that get hurt can sue the property owner and his insurance co. If the freebie guy damages a home or the power lines, it's the PO's responsibility to fix it. And even if it's not, there's potential fines, legal battles, insurance issues... Who wants to deal with that?? After all, if the guy shows up in a 3 color pickup truck full of beer cans, what are the odds he's even got enough money to fill his fuel tank let alone cover unintended damage. For the jobs you lose console yourself by realizing the POs willing to take on elevated risk to save a few bucks are also the guys more likely to turn a "simple" paying job into a PITA through complaining and looking for "extras." You've also seen that you don't make any friends by complaining to the guys willing to work hard for "only" a free truckload of wood. Maybe that guy with the three color rig is willing to bust his butt for a return that you'd view as not worth the effort. Let it go and focus on something positive.

 

[John R]

as a contractor working on storm cleanup for homeowners, I must say its the woodchucks like yourself that are screwing me and my guys. we lost over $3,000 of work in a matter of 18 hours to people who will do the cleanup for "free" for the wood (after I wasted my time driving around looking at the jobs). go scavage the wood thats in the woods by the road, don't touch the ones on residential properties unless you're invited in!

Oh Boo-Hoo!!!

 

[sb47]

I never did much wood chasing. Sure I’ll go get something special if I need too but I’ve learned to just wait on the tree co. to bring it to me. After all most of the work is felling, bucking and loading then hauling it home.
Tree company’s love to give wood away and they keep me supplied with all the wood I can handle. The only snag with that is I have to see the load before they dump it. even though they know I’ll only except good wood they will try to bring junk wood from time to time.