Short bar - Heavy chain

[ale]

This thread by TK got me wanting to try .404

http://www.arboristsite.com/chainsaw/189188.htm

Many will say it does not make since and at this point I can’t disagree. But I’ve noted MCW (Matt) is a fan of .404 due to its good wear characteristics and he cuts lots of wood and knows his chains. May be a good set-up for the dirty wood I’ve been cutting. Less time filing, more time cutting.

First, I sourced some .058 gauge .404 semi-chisel Carlton chain. Then just added a .404 Oregon style tip to an 18” .058 bar using a .404-7 rim. I like to run short bars and the short length may help off-set the heavier chain.

 

[ale]

View attachment 224489View attachment 224490View attachment 224491

 

[deye223]

it's just about all i use

 

[watsonr]

Can't wait to see what you say about it. I been running lots of .404 and love that stuff!

 

[fearofpavement]

Maybe you ought to pick up a harvester bar and modify that to fit your saw, then you can use some seriously heavy chain. I think if you are cutting dirty wood, it is going to dull any pitch of chain so not sure if there will be any perceived benefit. Report back with your finding.

 

[Slamm]

For bucking up skidded and muddy logs, I'm using .404 with 20" bars and semi-chisel, the .404-7 pin is like running an 3/8-8 pin, so you get the faster chain speed of an 8 pin on a short bar and the extra life of the .404 semi-chisel.

Perfect set up,

Sam

 

[Adirondackstihl]

I think yer gonna like it!

 

[MEATSAW]

That is awesome. If it cuts as good as it looks you've got a winner!

 

[Locust Cutter]

I've been curious about this myself. Been thinking of running a 20" .404 setup on my 660 for bucking Hedge/Oak/Locust... Especially if would hold a hedge longer or if it was in the least, less susceptible to chain stretch...

 

[SawTroll]

This thread by TK got me wanting to try .404

http://www.arboristsite.com/chainsaw/189188.htm

Many will say it does not make since and at this point I can’t disagree. But I’ve noted MCW (Matt) is a fan of .404 due to its good wear characteristics and he cuts lots of wood and knows his chains. May be a good set-up for the dirty wood I’ve been cutting. Less time filing, more time cutting.

First, I sourced some .058 gauge .404 semi-chisel Carlton chain. Then just added a .404 Oregon style tip to an 18” .058 bar using a .404-7 rim. I like to run short bars and the short length may help off-set the heavier chain.

.....

Carlton and semi-chisel doesn't look good to me - but each to his own.....:msp_wink:

 

[Slamm]

I've been curious about this myself. Been thinking of running a 20" .404 setup on my 660 for bucking Hedge/Oak/Locust... Especially if would hold a hedge longer or if it was in the least, less susceptible to chain stretch...

That is an excellent setup. I use to run a 25" bar and .404 for super hard hickory and hard maple up in Wisconsin it was the only thing in semi chisel that wouldn't get the sharp chisel teeth knocked off. you could actually cut for a little while before the chain would go so dull it wouldn't cut anymore.

Don't forget that running Stihl chain is one of the best steps you can get to longer chain life and less stretch by large measurable amounts.

Sam

 

[SawTroll]

This is a bit odd, as I think the common cosensus is that .404 is too slow for and heavy for "normal" conditions (whatever that is), on any "normal" saw, less than 120cc....:msp_confused:

 

[Locust Cutter]

That is an excellent setup. I use to run a 25" bar and .404 for super hard hickory and hard maple up in Wisconsin it was the only thing in semi chisel that wouldn't get the sharp chisel teeth knocked off. you could actually cut for a little while before the chain would go so dull it wouldn't cut anymore.

Don't forget that running Stihl chain is one of the best steps you can get to longer chain life and less stretch by large measurable amounts.

Sam

I have become a fan of Stihl chain over the years. I possess probably 15 assorted loops of Carlton chain and as soon as they're worn out (which won't be long) I do not intend to buy another. I have been a bit dismayed at how quickly it loses it's edge and stretches out, compared to Stihl or even Oregon chain... Not to mention that the .325 pitch chain has a different cutter height and file req't than standard Stihl .325 does. Either way the 660 may be going to .404... I'm just undecided about whether to keep the long bar as a 3/8" setup.

 

[Alex D]

Somethings I had been thinking about in terms of chain size was if .404 had benefits eg stays sharper longer and so forth than 3/8 then 1/2 chain must be awesome in these attributes. However 1/2" chain is friggen enormous compare this. Difference between .404-.375= .029 Difference between .500-.404 = .096, difference between .404-.325= .079 there is a greater size difference between 1/2" and .404 then there is between .404 and .325. No wonder 1/2" would be so ineffectively slow...

 

[ancy]

Carlton and semi-chisel doesn't look good to me - but each to his own.....:msp_wink:

Is that all you do, b1tch? Let someone like something with out you b1tching all about it. Do you have a life?

 

[Eccentric]

This thread by TK got me wanting to try .404

http://www.arboristsite.com/chainsaw/189188.htm

Many will say it does not make since and at this point I can’t disagree. But I’ve noted MCW (Matt) is a fan of .404 due to its good wear characteristics and he cuts lots of wood and knows his chains. May be a good set-up for the dirty wood I’ve been cutting. Less time filing, more time cutting.

First, I sourced some .058 gauge .404 semi-chisel Carlton chain. Then just added a .404 Oregon style tip to an 18” .058 bar using a .404-7 rim. I like to run short bars and the short length may help off-set the heavier chain.

Where did you source .404-.058G chain in the US?

Those two 77cc Homelite C-5's (bottom two saws) both wear short bars (18" and 21" hardnoses) and .404 chain (OLD Stihl 46 and newer Oregon 27). They bucked up a few pickup loads (8 foot bed, filled to the roof of the shell with just enought room at the back for three saws and the gas/oil) of dirty windfall firewood with only a touchup of a few file strokes about 1/2 way through.

This is the only digital pic I have of that setup (.404 on short bars). Was a 'staged' pic after I'd unloaded the third or fourth load of firewood. Mostly Oak, Doug Fir, and Madrone. Did all the cutting with those two C-5's and the XL-12 (wearing an 18" bar and 3/8" Woodland Pro 30RC) above them. All heavy, loud old saws without AV. Wearing the 'wrong' chain (All Carlton) too. Must give SawTroll fits seeing that....

 

[dingeryote]

This is a bit odd, as I think the common cosensus is that .404 is too slow for and heavy for "normal" conditions (whatever that is), on any "normal" saw, less than 120cc....:msp_confused:

Troll,

"Slow" is relative. If you have to put the file to the Crusty Dog terd, welfare trash, Oregon LPX/LGX joke of a chain, every third cut on a Shagbark, it isn't very "Fast" when you can get a whole stem bucked up with something else with some actual steel and chrome in it....Like Carlton SC.

"Light" is also relative. Who the #### notices the weight of the chain when it's in the kerf? Folks however DO notice the weight of the saw when they have to carry it back to the stump and file the Crusty dog terd Oregon welfare trash for the 38th time in an afternoon.

.404 on a working saw, that isn't used in a sterile lab to cut Balsa cants damn well can be lighter and faster, and I think it's a brilliant alternative for those of us who have Shagbark stems that were skidded through sand staring at them.


Next time ya get over here, I'll round up a nice stack of Ornery Shagbarks and Hornbeam for ya to play with, so you can cuss Oregons Dog terds too.

Stay safe!
Dingeryote

 

[deye223]

slow i think not
[video=youtube;hzbWGAcxxqc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzbWGAcxxqc&context=C307dbacADOEgsToPDskKsudLI0aJD0VFi-zMd5CAQ[/video]

the 460 is wearing .404 RMC this debate will probably go on for ever, there are 3 kinds of people those who know and use it , those who want too know and learn too use it . and those don't want too know and will never use it no matter what the proof.
and we all know how accurate common consensus is just take a look at the gun and logging debate and untill you have used this chain for a couple of years in all kinds of wood what is your opinion worth. any way rant over:rant:

 

[Nardoo]

We use an awful lot of .404 in Australia with our hard eucs. I have used it on saws of around 85cc and up for more than 30 years and I will continue to do so. This 288 runs a 25" bar and .404 semi in dirty dry box wood without the stretching of a 3/8" chain. Not sure it makes any difference with soft woods but it, makes sense here.

Al.

 

[wyk]

This is a bit odd, as I think the common cosensus is that .404 is too slow for and heavy for "normal" conditions (whatever that is), on any "normal" saw, less than 120cc....:msp_confused:

Somehow I have a feeling that 288 is gonna pull 20" of 404 fast as anyone would need it to....