So I was trimming this palm tree...

[EdenT]

Yeah, well there are obviously thousands of pros capable of pruning or removing date palms without getting impaled by them, even after pruning thousands of them for decades.

Brush up on your pruning techniques and put away the stupid polesaws!

Nothing about palms are easy, and date palms will separate the men from the boys real quick in my experience here in SoCal.

A pole saw to prune a date palm practically guarantees a trip to the hospital.

All you need is a sharp midsize chainsaw like a 262 xp husky, saddle and gaffs with a steelcore lanyard and the right technique.

Fan palms kill far more climbers here than date palms do.

jomoco

I like the way you post examples of anything but an actual date palm TV, and offering opinions on trees you have no hands on experience with to boot.

Careful you don't get a date palm spike in yu TV!

jomoco

No wonder SoCal trees scare all the wanna be arborists back to where they come from!

If the big eucs aren't enough, the dates at MCRD seal the deal.

You guys really crack me up sometimes!

jomoco

It would be interesting to have Rich here to view the ignorance. He showed me how to go over the whole head 20 years ago, He is getting old but a great teacher! If you do trees in Socal, you better be able to handle date palms. Maybe I will give Rich a call.
Jeff

Let him go on Jeff, it makes for good comedy.

Please continue on mister date palm expert!

jomoco

Right!
Jeff

Did you see his illustration of where your lanyard goes? LOL!

And remember, you must always prune over your head!

jomoco

We are amazed at ignorance.
Jeff:monkey:

Simply because old school climbers like Magargal, Morales, Whorral and myself have pruned thousands of dates to specs using saddle, gaffs and a sharp rear handled chainsaw, does not mean the average joe can do the same.

Which is why I hesitate to elaborate on the technique that has worked so well for me personally for over 30 years now.

I note that even Magargal himself, whose technique I copied so successfully, hesitates to recommend other climbers use the same technique, but rather recommends a bucket or crane to accomplish the job!

But the truth of the matter is that SoCal climbers have been using the exact same technique Magargal and I use since the 60's when Jim Whorral taught it to Magargal. CI date palms are one of the nastiest and challenging trees to prune or remove around, full of rats, bumble bees, centipedes, bird crap and a host of other disgusting stuff aside from their huge spikes, which can put you in the hospital plenty quick.

Why would I recommend other climbers use my technique when doing so could get them hurt or killed?

There are only about a dozen other SoCal climbers I know that are even capable of dealing with date palms without getting into trouble using the old school method of pruning them.

By all means, use a bucket, a polesaw or whatever it takes you to prune these monsters without injuring yourselves. The most important thing to me is that you make it home safely at the end of each work day guys.

jomoco

You start out by telling us that using a polesaw is a guaranteed trip to hospital and a rear handle, pole belt and good technique is the way to go.

You then call us wannabe arborists.

You then drop a whole lineage of date palm pruners on us dating back to before I was born.

You have yet to share with us the technique for pruning a date palm with a rear handled saw (which I am beginning to doubt exists).

I have only seen one rear handled saw that could really handle this job

 

[jomoco]

You start out by telling us that using a polesaw is a guaranteed trip to hospital and a rear handle, pole belt and good technique is the way to go.

You then call us wannabe arborists.

You then drop a whole lineage of date palm pruners on us dating back to before I was born.

You have yet to share with us the technique for pruning a date palm with a rear handled saw (which I am beginning to doubt exists).

I have only seen one rear handled saw that could really handle this job

My saw choice for date pruning is a 262xp husky with a 20 inch bar.

I've seen other climbers use a polesaw in dates, but only to reach the fruit after it's been balled and slicked with a chainsaw.

I'll check with Rich and see if he has some vids of the old school method that I can post.

I'll also vid the next date palm I do with my helmet cam, but with the clear understanding that I don't recommend other climbers attempt the same.

You guys really prune dates with a polesaw huh?

jomoco

 

[EdenT]

Yes, polesaw works for low ones. You put two cuts in each frond. One outside the spiky bits that drops the main frond and then a second cut to remove the petiole stub with the spiky bits. Once you start dropping the spikes you need to keep the ground clear in case you have to move quick while still looking upwards. If you want to ball and slick then it's a bucket and a chainsaw.

I look forward to seeing your video's. Your disclaimer is noted.

 

[jomoco]

Embarrassing as it is to admit, at 14 years old I began pruning wash fans with hand loppers no less, three cuts per frond! At 15 years old, after graduating to monkey wards electric chainsaws, I bumped into my first date palm prunes, so I drove huge nails into their trunks to stand on all the way up about 40 feet, buzzed them real good with an electric chainsaw, told the customer I was leaving the nails in them for the next go round!

I never received any type of formal exposure to professional tree work or training until 78 when I was 19. As soon as I saw a pro working off a bodyline for the first time, I said the heck with stinkin palms, I wanna be a hardwood climber!

I cant think of anything harder on men or equipment than a big nasty palm contract. Palm juice literally dissolves the magnesium in your chainsaw casing, dulls a razor sharp chainsaw in minutes.

If I never did another palm in my life?

Peeling wash fans?

The man who invents a mechanical palm peeling/skinning machine could do very well indeed!

jomoco

 

[EdenT]

Mechanical advantage for palm cleaning.

Great news! A mechanical advantage for cleaning palms HAS been invented. I've heard they're a bit pricey though.

 

[ROOTSXROCKS]

My saw choice for date pruning is a 262xp husky with a 20 inch bar.

I've seen other climbers use a polesaw in dates, but only to reach the fruit after it's been balled and slicked with a chainsaw.

I'll check with Rich and see if he has some vids of the old school method that I can post.

I'll also vid the next date palm I do with my helmet cam, but with the clear understanding that I don't recommend other climbers attempt the same.

You guys really prune dates with a polesaw huh?

jomoco

Look forward to the Video, don't worry When ask to prune them i use Nancy's advice and Just say no.
Besides here in north Florida its rare I see any Monsters that tall, I only mess with the ritlanatas for one customer and I cuss the entire time I do it.

 

[jomoco]

Look forward to the Video, don't worry When ask to prune them i use Nancy's advice and Just say no.
Besides here in north Florida its rare I see any Monsters that tall, I only mess with the ritlanatas for one customer and I cuss the entire time I do it.

One of the few types of pruning I'll actually use a carbide tipped chain to accomplish, is removing advantitious pups from reclinata palm groupings. Their spikes are just as sharp as a CI date, if not as long.

jomoco

 

[jefflovstrom]

23 Phoenix dactylifera (true dates) tommorrow. I will get pics and see if this site lets me load them. I hate when they stick out a new head.
Jeff

 

[jomoco]

Hey Jeff, I just got off the phone with Rich, and he's going to hook me up with some old school CI date palm pruning vid footage. The master himself!

Should be worthy of an entirely new palm specialist thread.

Between you me and Rich, we should be able to post some decent stuff!

I'm going to have to get Ekka to chip in some Aussie palm techniques to round things out nicely.

Looking forward to seeing your dactylifera footage Jeff. But we both know they're way easy compared to canariensis'!

jomoco

 

[outofmytree]

Hey Jeff, I just got off the phone with Rich, and he's going to hook me up with some old school CI date palm pruning vid footage. The master himself!

Should be worthy of an entirely new palm specialist thread.

Between you me and Rich, we should be able to post some decent stuff!

I'm going to have to get Ekka to chip in some Aussie palm techniques to round things out nicely.

Looking forward to seeing your dactylifera footage Jeff. But we both know they're way easy compared to canariensis'!

jomoco

This I would like to see. I am especially interested in how the fruit is removed without spiking the climber or damaging the collar.

 

[outofmytree]

Rich Magargal has probably pruned more palms over the years than any other climber I know. And though he's getting on in years now, he is still very active in the biz and teaching palm safety now in the southwest.

Here is a link to an article he wrote for Helen Stone on how to recognise the dangers involved in pruning the mex fan palms that have killed so many climbers in the southwest.

http://www.swtreesandturf.com/articles/1606/safety11606.html

Rich is also widely recognised here for his expertise in balling and slicking canary island date palms.

jom0oco

Interesting article although, as you were quick to point out yourself earlier, not about the palm in question. I would be interested to see exactly how Magargal prunes Washingtonia's now as compared to when he required rescue. Perhaps it is similar to this.

When I have a point to make, especially regarding safe climbing, I back it up with E-V-I-D-E-N-C-E.

Simply because old school climbers like Magargal, Morales, Whorral and myself have pruned thousands of dates to specs using saddle, gaffs and a sharp rear handled chainsaw, does not mean the average joe can do the same.

So then you should have plenty of evidence of this technique you rave about.

The most important thing to me is that you make it home safely at the end of each work day guys.

Really? Is this true? If it is and you have a safer way to do the job then show us all and I will be the first to eat humble pie.

 

[treevet]

I'm going to have to get Ekka to chip in some Aussie palm techniques to round things out nicely.
jomoco

Don't think you will get an Aussie to validate your tech. as I am pretty sure it is in violation of their pruning standards to spike their prunes like you do.

A.S. 4373 2007 Pruning of Amenity Trees

Damn, you are only 51 years old?

 

[tree MDS]

Nice job with that palm oomt.

 

[outofmytree]

Don't think you will get an Aussie to validate your tech. as I am pretty sure it is in violation of their pruning standards to spike their prunes like you do.

A.S. 4373 2007 Pruning of Amenity Trees

Damn, you are only 51 years old?

Good point TV.

Extract from AS 4373 section 7.4 Pruning of palms

"Climbing devices that wound the stem, such as spikes, should not be used as they may allow entry of decay causing organisms and other pathogens" and this little gem "The genus Phoenix ..... are very susceptible to the fatal fungal disease caused by Fusarium oxysporum"

Come on Jomoco. If TV can find information on a standard that applies half a world away, surely you can find at least one photograph or video in your own computer.

Enlighten us please.

 

[treevet]

Don't press him too much Doc, he will fire up the old zoo video footage on us again.

 

[Bermie]

It doesn't appear to me that oomt is wearing spikes in that picture...?
I can't zoom in to se for sure...

 

[tree MDS]

Check out page 12 of the sherrill cat. on the black widow micro bull line too.

Hard to tell exactly what they got going on there, but somebody must be familiar with this. A few years back they explained it better (if I remember correctly).

 

[outofmytree]

It doesn't appear to me that oomt is wearing spikes in that picture...?
I can't zoom in to se for sure...

Those palms were removals but you are correct Bermie. No spurs are required on Washingtonias when you use a false crotch. The petiole bases form a rough "thatching" as you know and this offers a good grip to boots. In fact spurs get caught in the dead fronds more often than not and become an impediment to lateral movement.

 

[jomoco]

Those palms were removals but you are correct Bermie. No spurs are required on Washingtonias when you use a false crotch. The petiole bases form a rough "thatching" as you know and this offers a good grip to boots. In fact spurs get caught in the dead fronds more often than not and become an impediment to lateral movement.

Have any climbers died in Australia from wash fan frond bags falling on them and asphyxiating them outofmytree?

12 here in SoCal since 02.

jomoco

 

[ROOTSXROCKS]

I am still trying to visualize how that happens, is it from trying to prune from the bottom up? The hurricane weather here rarely allows that mush build up, but I have seen them pretty thick, I would not want to mess with them like that. Hell I don't like doing it when I can reach them from the ground.