Stihl MS 291 burnt out after 1 hr

[mstndvn]

Yeah no word of that anywhere in the manual. So if you choose the wrong idle setting, you burn out the clutch and your saw is shot? Are we serious here?

Not arguing with you bro, just expressing frustration for such an egregious design flaw.

 

[Bubster]

Best thing to do is never start a saw with the brake on.I watched a guy one day make a cut,lock the brake,move a limb,release the brake,cut,and repeat over and over for what seemed like 100 cuts.Basically,just make sure the saw is at low idle when you engage the brake.

 

[mstndvn]

I hear you but they should put that in the manual. That's the first I've heard of this and now the chainsaw is ruined.

 

[Bubster]

I hear you but they should put that in the manual. That's the first I've heard of this and now the chainsaw is ruined.

Well for what its worth,a clutch is not that expensive and easily replaced.Hopefully thats all the damage done.Chock it up to a hard lesson learned.Just keep in mind the chain brake is really just there in case of a kick back.It is a good idea to set the brake if you have an idling saw and are walking on a steep bank or crawling over brush though.

 

[grizz55chev]

I hear you but they should put that in the manual. That's the first I've heard of this and now the chainsaw is ruined.

Every single saw made this century has the high idle feature, I'm guessing yer new to operating a chainsaw. First clue is calling the bar a " blade".

 

[huskihl]

Yeah no word of that anywhere in the manual. So if you choose the wrong idle setting, you burn out the clutch and your saw is shot? Are we serious here?

Not arguing with you bro, just expressing frustration for such an egregious design flaw.

It’s like learning how to drive a car. You can’t learn it by reading the manual. If you were sitting in gear with the brake on and the accelerator pedal pushed halfway to the floor for a minute, your transmission would probably be junk as well. Same thing. There are things you’re expected to know that they shouldn’t have to explain in a manual

 

[a. palmer jr.]

I got used to using the old saws that didn't have a brake so subsequently I hardly ever use a brake on my newer saws but I never remove them. You don't have to worry about burning things up when the brake isn't on unless you get it stuck in a tree and keep the throttle down..

 

[MudgeHollowBeaver]

If the chainbrake was applied, how could you over-rev the saw? You'd smoke the clutch, but not melt everything around it.

As you are smoking a clutch it gets very hot and m. . elts all the plastic surrounding it. I was given a low use Echo CS310 that was either fast idled with the brake on, or tried to cut with the brake on, or maybe weak (cooked) clutch springs. Needless to say that the side cover, main housing, and the oil pump area were just a mess of melted plastic. Not worth repairing. Most of the parts saws that I found online are also missing these parts Makes me appreciate my old all metal Stihl 031av workhorses

 

[HansFranz]

There are things you’re expected to know that they shouldn’t have to explain in a manual

Yeah, having to explain that you shouldn't hold the throttle WFO for 9 minutes with the brake engaged is kinda like having to explain, in the owners manual for a welder, that you shouldn't weld aluminum while soaking in a bathtub.

 

[huskihl]

Yeah, having to explain that you shouldn't hold the throttle WFO for 9 minutes with the brake engaged is kinda like having to explain, in the owners manual for a welder, that you shouldn't weld aluminum while sitting in a bathtub.

Yep same

 

[MudgeHollowBeaver]

Remember that on a chainsaw clutch, weak springs don't effect it's grip. The springs are to keep it closed until the right amount of RPM is reached.

Yep, and if the springs are weak they let the shoes slip out LIGHTLY against the drum at idle and create a lot of frictional heat...

 

[MudgeHollowBeaver]

Maybe some Chinesium parts are being used ?

 

[belgian]

Best thing to do is never start a saw with the brake on.I watched a guy one day make a cut,lock the brake,move a limb,release the brake,cut,and repeat over and over for what seemed like 100 cuts.Basically,just make sure the saw is at low idle when you engage the brake.

A friend brought in his saw with the same result.... Low hour saw, but he told me ran the saw very hard on dry wood for a hour or so.
seems that this saw is particularly sensitive to heat ...

 

[coffeebrk]

A friend brought in his saw with the same result.... Low hour saw, but he told me ran the saw very hard on dry wood for a hour or so.
seems that this saw is particularly sensitive to heat ...View attachment 1107948

Ran it very hard, most likely quickly dulling chain and ran out of bar oil halfway thru working.

 

[ZeroJunk]

looks like you can fix that your self if Stihl dont . It wont cost that much . I aint so sure the engine housing is wrecked.

I have fixed several, just not after an hour. Usually the engine housing is only effected if the drum cuts in to the oil reservoir and it leaks.
So, oiler, worm , tank hose, and that top elbow if it doesn't come with the oiler. Can't remember from one week to the next anymore.

Didn't realize this thread is 100 years old.

 

[hacskaroly]

A friend brought in his saw with the same result.... Low hour saw, but he told me ran the saw very hard on dry wood for a hour or so.
seems that this saw is particularly sensitive to heat ...

Last year we had five new MS 271s (less than an hour run) brought in that looked like that, all were new users (first saw). Pretty much the same story, "We were cutting and then smoke started coming out, figured it was just burning new oil out of the engine, when we stopped, everything was burnt"...

After getting more information from them on how they were using it, it appears that while cutting they inadvertently hit the chain brake when the saw bucked, not hearing the brake click or feeling it engage, just heard that RPM start to drop, figuring they just needed to add more throttle, went full out with the chain brake on until they finally stopped their cut. As long as it doesn't melt the case beyond use, relatively easy and inexpensive fix using parts off of Amazon.

Didn't realize this thread is 100 years old.

Happy birthday thread!!

 

[west041]

I hate myself for reading all 25 pages christ

To sum this up for anyone else

Clutch and/or band overheated. OP claims to be extremely experienced and had no idea this was happening. Tons of personal attacks and sarcasm from both sides. Possibly some factory defect but unlikely. Stihl denied warranty and was apparently very rude but "has seen many burned up 291s so who knows".

Consensus is overall it was operator error and even if it was a factory defect or slipping clutch how did the OP, a very experienced operator who owns 15 pro level saws, not notice at all that anything was happening. He bought a new clutch, drum, oiler, got it running again for $50 in parts.

Trust me, do not sucked into the entire thread, it's a waste.

I was looking for some information on a 020AV recoil I need to work on and logged back into this site to find this thread is still going. First off I apologize to anyone who has wasted any part of their life reading this thread so please read the above quote for a perfect TL/DR.

I am honestly embarassed to read the stuff I wrote back then and how I presented the issues with that saw with zero attempt to take responsibility for my part in it.

I appreciate the knowledgeable guys on here who tried to explain the problem and the easiest solution to getting the saw running again. Also had a few laughs at a lot of the sarcastic replies that apparently really pissed me off back in the day! I feel like the older you get the more aware you become of your own fallibility.

The funniest part of this thread is that 291 is still going, been thru many cords the last 8 years and my brother who I gave it to has had to replace nothing bigger than a spark plug and air filter since I repaired the issues detailed in the thread.

Thanks for all the help and I'll be back next decade to post updates on the "burnt out" 291 ha

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Last year we had five new MS 271s (less than an hour run) brought in that looked like that, all were new users (first saw). Pretty much the same story, "We were cutting and then smoke started coming out, figured it was just burning new oil out of the engine, when we stopped, everything was burnt"...

After getting more information from them on how they were using it, it appears that while cutting they inadvertently hit the chain brake when the saw bucked, not hearing the brake click or feeling it engage, just heard that RPM start to drop, figuring they just needed to add more throttle, went full out with the chain brake on until they finally stopped their cut. As long as it doesn't melt the case beyond use, relatively easy and inexpensive fix using parts off of Amazon.


Happy birthday thread!!

Not to make this thread any longer, but I replaced a brake band on an MS271 a few days ago and the band fit very tight around the drum even with the brake off. I had to leave it off the saw because it would have overheated had I run it. Don't know why it was so tight as I checked all the parts and the installation. Maybe the new band was made too small?