Stung by a "Bumble Bee" Chainsaw?

[Lakeside53]

If China is good enough for Stihl, why not good enough for famous Bumbled Bee knock-off Red Max brand?

Apples and oranges.. It's who made it, not where... Ask about the knock-off Chinese Honda engines flooding the low end pressure washer and gererator market... They look like decent copies, but have miserably low life and many problems.

When Stihl, Husky or whomever manufacures in Cinha, it will be to their quality. A Brazillian Stihl is every bit as good as a Stihl made in Germany and the USA, and apart from the serial number, pretty much indistinguishable. In case anyone is wondering, much of Brazil "low end" manufacturing is every bit as back-yard as China. I spent months in Sao Paulo attempting to install QA/QC processes in a large manufacting plant...

 

[max2cam]

Apples and oranges.. It's who made it, not where... Ask about the knock-off Chinese Honda engines flooding the low end pressure washer and gererator market... They look like decent copies, but have miserably low life and many problems.

When Stihl, Husky or whomever manufacures in Cinha, it will be to their quality. A Brazillian Stihl is every bit as good as a Stihl made in Germany and the USA, and apart from the serial number, pretty much indistinguishable. In case anyone is wondering, much of Brazil "low end" manufacturing is every bit as back-yard as China. I spent months in Sao Paulo attempting to install QA/QC processes in a large manufacting plant...

Granted.

But problems can be fixed and will be. If an American company imports Chinese junk they will get a bad rep and the product won't sell. But what normally happens is that quality control experts go over there and get the Chinese to improve the product to acceptable levels. It doesn't take a Stihl or a Husky to do that.

But big name or unknown name they are all converging in one place: China.

At this point we don't know if "famous" Chinese Bumble Bee chainsaw is junk or not. Guys laughed at the early Honda motorcycles too. But Harbor Freight is a big outfit. I get a catalog from them damn near every other day. Somebody will buy this $199.99 Chinese chainsaw and lets hope they post the results here.

 

[Tzed250]

yep

Andy is right. MIJ (made in Japan)used to be a joke. Now TPS (toyota producton system) is a worldwide manufacturing model. The specifications, and the QC system in place to ensure those specifications are what determine product quality. Most Chinajunk is that way because of low spec and low labor cost. When they bring the spec up the price will come up. I hope that the USA does not forget how to manufacture world class goods, or we are going to be in trouble.

 

[ValleyO'Giants]

Komatsu Zenoah has for some years now had a joint venture to manufacture in China. Now since Husqvarna has purchaced the OPE division now they have one. BTW Electrolux AG has been in China since 1987.
Now before you Stihl guys get all high and mighty.
Chairman of the Executive Board Dr. Bertram Kandziora and the Party Secretary of Qingdao, Mr Du Shi Cheng at the ground breaking for STIHL's China factory.

Like it or not,China is a market of tremendous growth potential and no manufacture is going to let it slip away.

Is that a Tombstone with Stihl's name on it?
Just kidding!

The problem I have with ANY company moving manufacturing(which means possibly losing jobs here in the USA) to China is that it increases our FREAKING GIGANTIC trade deficit with China.

ENOUGH ALREADY!!

That is why I will not buy a sears chainsaw.
All that acomplishes is putting Americans out of work just so a chinaman/woman can make 3 bucks a day while the huge corporation takes huge profits.
If you look hard enough you can get good quality american products for reasonable prices.
Even some european companies pay their workers a good wage. (IE German companies like addidas, stihl, etc.)

I buy American as much as I can.

My 2 cents

 

[KMB]

Note the Fuel and oil caps both being to the rear of the starter.

Don't mean to be a jerk, but are you sure? Looks like to me there is a cap of some type at the front of the starter, in the 'traditional' place for the oil cap on most modern saws. Looks like a decal above the fuel cap.

Kevin

 

[Stihl 041S]

Stihl ASSEBMLY plant might be the key. Springfeild had assembly plants in South America for their 1911's maybe 20 years ago.

The japanese car people had assembly plants before production plants in the USA.

The company I used to work for would but HF rivet guns along with all the other companys. You put a set of Bellville washers to give max load,and a trigger set to repull if it could pull against the washers. along with the counter you let it run till it puked hydro fluid, and it couldn't pull the trigger.

The HB grade rivet gun might go 1000 to 5000 pulls tops. Ours with 357 castings at 40,000 tensile castings would go more than half a million til we got sick of testing. Pull our gun apart and you couldn't tell any wear except some on O-rings but still working fine. Ours cost about 10 times as much, but worth at least 50.

Those guns were bought by a lot of production plants that did peice work, people won't pot up with maintenance when it cuts into the paycheck.

For the people pullig a couple of hundred rivets, buy HB. I still loan out some of my riveters that are 35 years old to guys building race cars, no problem.

Casting: sand is great for low numbers but not so good for fine detail. Imagine a snd casting fir the stihl 090 cylinder. You are talking 5 figure mold. Ever notice a lot of aftermarkets have half the number of fins.

End of rant.

 

[Steve128]

I agee

Don't mean to be a jerk, but are you sure? Looks like to me there is a cap of some type at the front of the starter, in the 'traditional' place for the oil cap on most modern saws. Looks like a decal above the fuel cap.

Kevin

Don't know about the decal, but the oil tank opening is in front as I have a copy of the saw everyone is bagging on. Not a bumble bee but a cheaper copy of it

We must be careful though, bad voodoo may happen if Spike60 gets upset!

Interesting to read this thread!

 

[rb_in_va]

I have a copy of the saw everyone is bagging on. Not a bumble bee but a cheaper copy of it

How long have you had it, and how does it run? Must not be too bad if you are claiming it out in the open like this.

 

[Steve128]

Out of the closet! For rb_in_va

Just bought on a whim for little over $100.00. because I was curious.:monkey: It came with Carlton non safety chain. Jets were untabbed so easy to tune and starts on first pull every time. Since it starts so easy, it is the perfect loaner saw for neighbors. If they do something wrong, I'm out a tad over $ 100.00 bucks!

I probably have just over 50 hours on it without incident. Gas does seep out a little from the cap if left over a week.

Okay, I do have other saws! Guess I "outed" myself! :jester:

 

[beelsr]

In case anyone is wondering, much of Brazil "low end" manufacturing is every bit as back-yard as China. I spent months in Sao Paulo attempting to install QA/QC processes in a large manufacting plant...

Virtually all Dodge truck shocks come from Brazil. Brother-in-law spent months doing the same thing. Best thing about the trips, though, was all the Pinga he would bring home...

 

[rb_in_va]

That is why I will not buy a sears chainsaw.
All that acomplishes is putting Americans out of work just so a chinaman/woman can make 3 bucks a day while the huge corporation takes huge profits.
If you look hard enough you can get good quality american products for reasonable prices.

And you own a Craftsman and a Stihl? The only quality American chainsaws are old homies and macs. Maybe I'm not looking hard enough.

 

[manual]

So.. does anyone think the saw pistons and cylinders coming out of China are any better???

Don't know, But hows the parts made in china doing for Stihl ?opcorn:

We don't hear much about this.



Whoops spoke too soon ,should have read the rest of the post

 

[gatkeper1]

Don't know, But hows the parts made in china doing for Stihl ?opcorn:

We don't hear much about this.

Manual, I am glad you asked that. seems some more air will soon be let out of glorious, Made in Germany , sales pitch.
In May 2006,from Mahles web site:

Today, MAHLE produces in its eight plants in China already a wide range of components and systems for the internal combustion engine and its peripherals, including pistons, piston castings, bearings, air, oil, fuel filter modules and other components. MAHLE is planning to build up more plants in the future in China, to localize the production of its full range of products. "In 2005, we generated nearly 20% of the Group's total turnover in Asia, and it is our strategic goal to triple the turnover in China until 2010", said Prof. Junker.

This is getting to be fun.

 

[max2cam]

Stihl in China

I get this impression from the thread:

1) New "Bumbled Bee" brand chainsaw from Harbor Freight tools is probably a Red Max knockoff (Japan design?) and is probably built in China (HF sales rep admitted as much).

2) Just because a chainsaw or parts are made in China doesn't mean they are instant junk, witnessed by stampede of Western chainsaw firms getting into China, i.e. famous German Stihl brand, Mahle, etc. and putting their names on Chinese made stuff.

3) Therefore, it's not clear if "Bumble Bee" chainsaw is POS or not until somebody buys one and puts it over the hurdles and see how it measures up. Low price or stupid name alone doesn't prove POS status, because some of the Chinese "junk" Harbor Freight sells is actually pretty good.

 

[manual]

There are other ways to win in a war.

Economics is one way.
Corporate Greed will kill the working force.

 

[spike60]

We must be careful though, bad voodoo may happen if Spike60 gets upset!

Actually Steve, I think I should "out" myself here. I sent E-mails to a couple of those companies to see what the deal was. I figured that you could buy a couple hundred of them direct for about $50 a pop. I had my eye on that 372 knockoff. The warranty would be "Here's another one". Haven't heard back on any of them yet. Not sure that I would actually do it, but I'm curious to see how this works, and just how cheap they really are.

How is the finish/quality of yours? I'd like to take a look at one of them, and I suppose it won't be long before one of them wanders in.

I think there will probably be two tiers of this Chinese stuff. The upper end will be product from factories that are owned by the OEM's that we are all familiar with. (Red Max already had a factory in China, which now belongs to Husky.) Then there will be a lower tier of stuff from the "copy cat" manufacturers. Some of it probably won't be too bad, but some of it will be absolute junk. But how are we going to know the good guys from the bad guys?

Also, some product will no doubt be imported by outfits that won't give a thought to the parts and service side of the equation. Again, AS guys are far more resourceful than the average consumer, so parts and service wouldn't be as much an issue. Somebody ought to call up and ask about Bumblebee parts and where warranty work can be obtained. It'd be interesting to hear what they say.

 

[Austin1]

Actually Steve, I think I should "out" myself here. I sent E-mails to a couple of those companies to see what the deal was. I figured that you could buy a couple hundred of them direct for about $50 a pop. I had my eye on that 372 knockoff. The warranty would be "Here's another one". Haven't heard back on any of them yet. Not sure that I would actually do it, but I'm curious to see how this works, and just how cheap they really are.

How is the finish/quality of yours? I'd like to take a look at one of them, and I suppose it won't be long before one of them wanders in.

I think there will probably be two tiers of this Chinese stuff. The upper end will be product from factories that are owned by the OEM's that we are all familiar with. (Red Max already had a factory in China, which now belongs to Husky.) Then there will be a lower tier of stuff from the "copy cat" manufacturers. Some of it probably won't be too bad, but some of it will be absolute junk. But how are we going to know the good guys from the bad guys?

Also, some product will no doubt be imported by outfits that won't give a thought to the parts and service side of the equation. Again, AS guys are far more resourceful than the average consumer, so parts and service wouldn't be as much an issue. Somebody ought to call up and ask about Bumblebee parts and where warranty work can be obtained. It'd be interesting to hear what they say.

This is true as I have found the same thing and you bring up a really good point as to warranty! Hope the rep went through

 

[max2cam]

Bumble Bee on Sale

I've noticed that Harbor Freight has been discounting their famous Bumble Bee chainsaw from $199.99 to $149.99.

Has anybody bought one of these beasts yet and road tested it? Looks to have a metal crankcase and from outer appearances looks like a "real" chainsaw.

See if I can post a pix: