Teaching: Anyone elses thoughts or experiences
- Thread starter KenJax Tree
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J
jrcat
Guest
Yeah I seem to hear that '' theres no money in logging" statement alot. The way I see it is then theres no money in anything then.. trucking , sawing, dirt work, ... heck theres no money in working for that matter. Making a living on the other hand I do believe that is still there. There is still some money to be made. What else is a younger guy supposed to do. I absolutely refuse to work a factory job or go trucking ( i have a class a) Ive been there and done that bit hauling gravel logs chips and moving equipment. I refuse to end up like my older brother who feels that working in a factory is the only safe bet, even though the last 3 he has worked for has shut down. This occupation may not make me rich and I'm not looking to be "rich". I choose to support my family on my own terms, not the terms of the corperations board members. I was told this as a child by my grandfather .. if at first you dont succeed ..redefine success.
I've never cut hardwood saw logs(except alder and thats different)... but what the common theme is, is to get the buyer on the landing and he will tell you where to cut and how long, takes a bit of extra time, but it will save you money in the end. Just remember to yard em out in tree length or there abouts first...
J
jrcat
Guest
Well one mill snubbed off as they said I need at least 10,000 feet on the landing and laid out. Which would be fine .......if I had a place to land that didnt equal the size of a postage stamp. I got a decent offer from one mill that I just might go with.(see my thread on saw logs and veneer). Last but not least... the amish mill......I called the guy this morning at 8 am.. and got his kid who insisted that his dad was getting ready to leave for the mill and could not be bothered to talk to me, even though the house is like 50 feet away from the mill 
. I am a bit apprehensive on my first offer ... Just like anyone else I want to get the best dollar possible. But this mill is only 8 miles away from my job and he needs the logs in the worst way and is willing to nix the trucking just to get the logs. He also told me that he will scale the logs in my presence and cut me a check on the spot, and tag my veneer logs which his next veneer sale is in 2 weeks and thats when I would get paid for those logs.
. I am a bit apprehensive on my first offer ... Just like anyone else I want to get the best dollar possible. But this mill is only 8 miles away from my job and he needs the logs in the worst way and is willing to nix the trucking just to get the logs. He also told me that he will scale the logs in my presence and cut me a check on the spot, and tag my veneer logs which his next veneer sale is in 2 weeks and thats when I would get paid for those logs.
J
jrcat
Guest
ooh the butts or short cut offs in the 4 to 6 foot range this guy will give a buck foot for. Does that sound ok?
J
jrcat
Guest
not many of them around here. and its a buck per board foot. I will cut em for fire wood or cut the on my nieghbors little band mill maybe.
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gotta know your mills, some have craptastic scalers, some are fair, some well just cause they have the best price does not mean you will get paid what its worth...
Got three of four options for me, as go to mills anyway,
mill a is an exporter they usually post the best price, and take damned near every species, but will without fail scale yer logs at less bf
Mill b takes many of the same species of timber, usually at a lower price but they scale the logs differently so you get paid more in the end.
Mill c only takes two species (alder and cotton wood) They are close by and post good prices, the bad news is their scaler has a very long thumb, and they switched to the same method as the exporter... which means you get about 2/3s of what you where expecting to be paid... not fun (I'm tossing around the idea of not using them again)
There are by far more mills in these parts, many of them contract out DNR sales though so getting my gypo loads in is always entertaining. The rest of em are a very niche market, all one species or custom milling stuff.
Learning by doing is a tried and true method, just pay attention to your scale tickets and scale your logs before they leave. It will give you a better idea as to what went good and what went wrong, as well as giving you a good idea as to what you should be getting paid, Don't worry it will be less then what you think...it always is.
Got three of four options for me, as go to mills anyway,
mill a is an exporter they usually post the best price, and take damned near every species, but will without fail scale yer logs at less bf
Mill b takes many of the same species of timber, usually at a lower price but they scale the logs differently so you get paid more in the end.
Mill c only takes two species (alder and cotton wood) They are close by and post good prices, the bad news is their scaler has a very long thumb, and they switched to the same method as the exporter... which means you get about 2/3s of what you where expecting to be paid... not fun (I'm tossing around the idea of not using them again)
There are by far more mills in these parts, many of them contract out DNR sales though so getting my gypo loads in is always entertaining. The rest of em are a very niche market, all one species or custom milling stuff.
Learning by doing is a tried and true method, just pay attention to your scale tickets and scale your logs before they leave. It will give you a better idea as to what went good and what went wrong, as well as giving you a good idea as to what you should be getting paid, Don't worry it will be less then what you think...it always is.
jrcat
If you get a chance and the opportunity presents itself, spend a little time with a scaler. They get vilified here and sometimes for good reason but a good scaler can point out things in logs...defect and such...that an average person might not see.
It's not good enough anymore to just send logs to the mill and hope for the best. You need to know everything you possibly can about the hows and whys of log grading. You can be the best logger ever to hit the woods but if you send in stuff that will be more expensive for the mill to cut than it's worth they're not going to pay you much.
You can buck stuff to your advantage if you know how to maximize your scale. A guy that can buck for better scale can make money.
I don't know anything about logging in your part of the country but some things are the same no matter what part of the woods you're in.
Most mill owners think that loggers are idiots...necessary idiots but idiots all the same. Don't prove them right.
If you get a chance and the opportunity presents itself, spend a little time with a scaler. They get vilified here and sometimes for good reason but a good scaler can point out things in logs...defect and such...that an average person might not see.
It's not good enough anymore to just send logs to the mill and hope for the best. You need to know everything you possibly can about the hows and whys of log grading. You can be the best logger ever to hit the woods but if you send in stuff that will be more expensive for the mill to cut than it's worth they're not going to pay you much.
You can buck stuff to your advantage if you know how to maximize your scale. A guy that can buck for better scale can make money.
I don't know anything about logging in your part of the country but some things are the same no matter what part of the woods you're in.
Most mill owners think that loggers are idiots...necessary idiots but idiots all the same. Don't prove them right.
If you get a chance and the opportunity presents itself, spend a little time with a scaler. They get vilified here and sometimes for good reason but a good scaler can point out things in logs...defect and such...that an average person might not see.
It's not good enough anymore to just send logs to the mill and hope for the best. You need to know everything you possibly can about the hows and whys of log grading. You can be the best logger ever to hit the woods but if you send in stuff that will be more expensive for the mill to cut than it's worth they're not going to pay you much.
You can buck stuff to your advantage if you know how to maximize your scale. A guy that can buck for better scale can make money.
I don't know anything about logging in your part of the country but some things are the same no matter what part of the woods you're in.
Most mill owners think that loggers are idiots...necessary idiots but idiots all the same. Don't prove them right.
I'm in the process of getting my scaling license now, and I think back to all the logs I use to buck, and wow.
OlympicYJ
ArboristSite Guru
If you get a chance and the opportunity presents itself, spend a little time with a scaler. They get vilified here and sometimes for good reason but a good scaler can point out things in logs...defect and such...that an average person might not see.
It's not good enough anymore to just send logs to the mill and hope for the best. You need to know everything you possibly can about the hows and whys of log grading. You can be the best logger ever to hit the woods but if you send in stuff that will be more expensive for the mill to cut than it's worth they're not going to pay you much.
You can buck stuff to your advantage if you know how to maximize your scale. A guy that can buck for better scale can make money.
I don't know anything about logging in your part of the country but some things are the same no matter what part of the woods you're in.
Most mill owners think that loggers are idiots...necessary idiots but idiots all the same. Don't prove them right.
Plus one big time! Having a good bullbuck, as I've been told, can be the difference between marginality and the big bucks.... at least back in the day.
I'll be doing some scaling this summer but mostly cruising and logging admin stuff. Helps with both cruising and making logs. I've had some training but hoping to get a bunch more. Dunno if I'll get certified by the bureau or not but we shall see. That would be cool if I was.
A good bucker needs to be a good scaler and good cruisers generally make good scalers and vise a versa. It's hard judging em when they're down & un-bucked and a helluva lot harder when they're standing! The guy that trained me on log quality was a bucker in a yard for years. I took what I had learned in school and built upon that. Hoping I can only improve on that by spending time with the scalers.
Wes
J
jrcat
Guest
10 years ago before 90% of the mills in this area evaporated, some scalers where EVIL and some were really good. and it all depends on perspective too.
HuskStihl
Chairin'em for the sound
You Sir have big, manly brass balls to suggest that Bob and RandyMac have nothing to teach you about falling:msp_biggrin:
HuskStihl
Chairin'em for the sound
Northman, Bob, and Randy all seem to have pretty good senses of humor. I was only jesting:wink2:
HuskStihl
Chairin'em for the sound
I should have known, but Scots tend to be a dry, mirthless lot:msp_biggrin:
J
jrcat
Guest
I met a girl from scotland she was from glasgow and she was oohh sooo very pretty and smart I was in love. she came here for a week and I have to say that was a very memorable experience. She to had a dry sense of humor. I loved to make her talk just to hear her accent. Nikola was her name. Long distance relationships kinda .......suck though.
Take'n out of context it would seem that way... What was meant was the the old farts around here,(I.E. my home etc.) some had good advice, most are dead, the rest work at boeing.
More or less everyone on here seem like good folk.
And I can guarantee that both Randy and Bob could out cut me on a regular basis, even if they had to use a walker...:biggrin:
I don't use a walker. Yet. But I did try to cut with a walking cast on my leg one time. That was just a bit slow and clumsy and the side rod gave me hell when he found out. I ran loader 'til the leg healed up.My favorite "walker" is my pickup. It has a good heater, a better radio, and cup holders.
roberte
Addicted to ArboristSite
My favorite "walker" is my pickup. It has a good heater, a better radio, and cup holders.
Walking cast , with corks built in and kevlar wrap?
Don't mark out trees for road right of way when taking pain pills for your injured leg. I think of it now as huckleberry habitat. :msp_smile:
I'll probably be the first one in a with a walker... gimpy leg is making it hard to walk without boots on as it is
