The evils of burning wood

[Big Briggs 37]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/science...es-emit-six-times-pollution-diesel-truck.html

I keep coming across articles like this. The title of this thread is the first thing that came to mind after reading the article. Seems ridiculous to me that someone is trying to blame major environmental issues on wood burning. I'm trying to figure out why they would do this. Maybe the article sponsored by a home heating company (oil/gas ECT). Seems like the large number of motor vehicles and industry/manufacturing would be a larger concern. I'm also not sure how much wood gets burned in England.
Any thoughts?

 

[sirbuildalot]

As much as I love wood burning, wood stoves can emit a lot of smoke, its hard to deny that. Especially the people who burn anything in there OWB that will throw heat. I've seen whole neighborhoods smoke covered. Pretty inconsiderate really. Whether its your right to burn the stove or not, (maybe not depending on time of year and local by-laws/ordinances), and/or what is in it that you are burning (again local by-laws/ordinances), its called being a good neighbor, and not being a jackass.

With that said, I have no problem with people burning seasoned wood in their wood burner. Whether they emit 6 times the pollution that diesel trucks do, I find hard to believe. I think there are some stoves that smoke a lot, and some that hardly smoke, same with trucks. As long as common sense is used, and the stove setup is safe (many are not and are not cleaned enough), then I think people should be able to burn in stoves, fireplaces and boilers.

 

[Big Briggs 37]

As much as I love wood burning, wood stoves can emit a lot of smoke, its hard to deny that. Especially the people who burn anything in there OWB that will throw heat. I've seen whole neighborhoods smoke covered. Pretty inconsiderate really. Whether its your right to burn the stove or not, (maybe not depending on time of year and local by-laws/ordinances), and/or what is in it that you are burning (again local by-laws/ordinances), its called being a good neighbor, and not being a jackass.

With that said, I have no problem with people burning seasoned wood in their wood burner. Whether they emit 6 times the pollution that diesel trucks do, I find hard to believe. I think there are some stoves that smoke a lot, and some that hardly smoke, same with trucks. As long as common sense is used, and the stove setup is safe (many are not and are not cleaned enough), then I think people should be able to burn in stoves, fireplaces and boilers.

I agree. Alot of this could be due to being a good neighbor. It makes me wonder when the article spoke about how the pollution went up the most on weekends. A weekend burner in a city would be more likely to not have as good dry wood as someone depending on the wood for heat. I have not seen it personally but I have heard of people burning everything in outdoor boilers from tires to old sneakers. This is a good way to get the government to step in and regulate. I feel the same way about diesel pickup trucks. Tuning the truck up to spew black smoke all the time is only going to ruin it for everyone and get the government involved

 

[echomeister]

Surely woodsmoke is less damaging in some ways than diesel emissions. To make an accurate assessment of risks the volume of particles emitted must be weighted by their relative danger. I would rather breath woodsmoke than diesel emissions.

 

[Retired Marine]

Wildfires are natural.

This is just politicians trying to dig in your pocket for some money and/or big energy trying to make you dependent on them.

 

[Big Briggs 37]

Wildfires are natural.

This is just politicians trying to dig in your pocket for some money and/or big energy trying to make you dependent on them.

Whenever I see a study by a university doctor I try to find out who funded the study. That is what really determines the outcome

 

[Franny K]

Seems ridiculous to me that someone is trying to blame major environmental issues on wood burning. I

. This is about particle emissions in London to a large degree.

Obviously a lot of links or footnotes are not present. The author seems to understand burning wet, garbage, choke off air to last.

Similar article about insect pests coming into those neighborhoods would be equally informative.

Light the kindling pile from the top.

 

[Little Al]

In rural France there is almost universal heating/cooking by wood burning In our area /dept a survey, check on stove type installation & type /moisture content of wood being burnt the out come was enlightening the biggest problem was type of stove ,a good #of folk were using multi fuel rather than solely wood burning stoves ,if seasoned hard wood was burnt with a 20% or thereabouts moisture content the emissions were near neutral using wet soft wood was the worst offender I didn't see any info as to comparison to diesel emissions quoted mind we only get the odd truck /tractor other than at harvest time I guess a lot of diesel vehicles & many burners of junk crap wood could be a problem we must have been OK as we received a refund on the Tax habitation (house tax) one other thing noted was that vehicle pollution is emitted some 1/2ft from ground height stove/fire smoke is usually some 15/20 ft above ground level when emitted & both being hot will rise to be moved on at heights above humans

 

[Marley5]

I strongly disagree with that article.

But I do agree with burning quality wood emits minimal emissions and being responsible about what we burn.

Give an idiot a degree and we all have to suffer the consequences. Lol

 

[turnkey4099]

Surely woodsmoke is less damaging in some ways than diesel emissions. To make an accurate assessment of risks the volume of particles emitted must be weighted by their relative danger. I would rather breath woodsmoke than diesel emissions.

Yes. Wood "smoke" in and of itself is not a problem for Climate Change. It is the CO2 it contains. Even that is a zero sum amount as whether burned or left to rot as ALL wood eventually releases it's CO2 content. Granted that burning would releases it much faster than Ma Nature but in the end it evens out.

 

[Little Al]

I think that the original study was centered on a built up area with big #'s of indoor fireplaces /stoves I am of an age that can remember the "Pea soup fogs" caused by coal burning both industrial & domestic in the UK (before the smokeless zones /clean air acts came about ) as many dwelling' s burnt coal the efficient state of the fires/chimneys /flues was probably not the best if you look at turn of the 20century built housing chimney stacks the more expensive built units with a total of 6 rooms probably had 6 fireplaces so a fire in each grate in the winter (poor/no insulation, gaps at windows/doors with big drafts )would have a good amount of pollution with the coal (possibly not the cleanest burning ) smoking away

 

[Deleted member 135597]

Tree huggers! Just like all the animal rights groups against hunters. It’s all propaganda to suit their own agenda.

 

[Multifaceted]

So, the basis of the argument this article is using to butress their claim resides in the findings of some random PhD student with 'instruments', that which prompted 'fellow scientists to leap to his findings' — and do not cite any actual data nor link to a study or scientific paper.

Sounds like mild sensationalist "news" to me, nothing short of expected from the known tabloid that is Daily Mail...

 

[LondonNeil]

Gents would you like a London local to give you some background?

Firstly the daily mail is gutter press, shock headlines and poor articles are it's stock. However search around other UK press and even the good ones will have similar articles currently (try the Telegraph website, you'll find several, that's a quality news paper).

It is an issue here because London and a few other big cities are missing European law for air quality standards which is forcing the government to act. It's about particulate and local air quality, not greenhouse emissions. In the cities no one needs to burn wood, we are all on mains gas which is cheap and clean. The cities have smoke control laws which like your EPA stuff mean we can only burn wood on approved appliances. As they article points out though, the particulates emitted are still worse than diesel engines.
Wood stoves have become a toy of thethe mid class for many city dwellers, 100 000 new installs a year apparently. Most of them don't get used by anybody that knows a dry split. Often the owner will pick up a small sack of woodfrom a store on the way home from work and burn it they evening. Wood sellers, like yours, often don't properly season. You can tell the result.

Anyway the gov is consulting currently, the consultation paper proposes a complete ban on house coal, setting a sulphur limit on smokeless coal, banning the sale of wood wetter than 20% MC unless in volumes larger than 2m³ .(a cord =3.5m³) . The reasoning is that small quantities of wood tend to be burnt immediately, larger volumes are stored and seasoned.

Anyway, I scrounge my wood, I season for 2+ years, I burn hot and clean.....I know when my neighbors are burning as I can smell it (coal often). You can only rarely smell my stove. I suspect it is just a matter of time though before the stove is banned, or the regs get further tightened. In the mean time I'm the oddity, heating a house in London primarily with scrounged wood.

 

[Big Briggs 37]

Gents would you like a London local to give you some background?

Firstly the daily mail is gutter press, shock headlines and poor articles are it's stock. However search around other UK press and even the good ones will have similar articles currently (try the Telegraph website, you'll find several, that's a quality news paper).

It is an issue here because London and a few other big cities are missing European law for air quality standards which is forcing the government to act. It's about particulate and local air quality, not greenhouse emissions. In the cities no one needs to burn wood, we are all on mains gas which is cheap and clean. The cities have smoke control laws which like your EPA stuff mean we can only burn wood on approved appliances. As they article points out though, the particulates emitted are still worse than diesel engines.
Wood stoves have become a toy of thethe mid class for many city dwellers, 100 000 new installs a year apparently. Most of them don't get used by anybody that knows a dry split. Often the owner will pick up a small sack of woodfrom a store on the way home from work and burn it they evening. Wood sellers, like yours, often don't properly season. You can tell the result.

Anyway the gov is consulting currently, the consultation paper proposes a complete ban on house coal, setting a sulphur limit on smokeless coal, banning the sale of wood wetter than 20% MC unless in volumes larger than 2m³ .(a cord =3.5m³) . The reasoning is that small quantities of wood tend to be burnt immediately, larger volumes are stored and seasoned.

Anyway, I scrounge my wood, I season for 2+ years, I burn hot and clean.....I know when my neighbors are burning as I can smell it (coal often). You can only rarely smell my stove. I suspect it is just a matter of time though before the stove is banned, or the regs get further tightened. In the mean time I'm the oddity, heating a house in London primarily with scrounged wood.

Great insight

 

[Big Briggs 37]

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7769583/pollution-wood-burning-stove-emission-illnesses/amp/

Looks like more from the same author.....

 

[Big Briggs 37]

The author is a "pollution scientist" peddling a book. Makes sense now

 

[Little Al]

The author is a "pollution scientist" peddling a book. Makes sense now

Wonder when he's going to look into the amount of gas turbine engine exhaust gases blown out by the vast #of aircraft at & passing in the vicinity of Heathrow

 

[LondonNeil]

The sun is even more in the gutter! That's a paper of celeb news, page 3 girls ( models with free clothes on, on page 3 obviously!) , Sport and little else.

I expect the same poorly written stuff will be in the Telegraph soon though. I even found a new scientist article on stoves that was as thin on fact recently.

Air pollution here is an issue though. Btw, the new standards we adopt shortly after I believe your EPA standards that you've had a couple of years.

 

[lknchoppers]

What about add the unseasoned wood that burned up in California, maybe they should regulate that !!