This job pays too little! Looking for advice.

[ChoppyChoppy]

I think it's a matter of perspective. 10 hours of manual labor 6 days a week for little pay seems long. I only have to go into work 3 days a week for 2 hours of teaching each day and the rest of the time I sit on my behind thinking of new science. So I feel a 10 hour workday is long. BF doesn't think it is. Also 10 hours doesn't take into account an hour to get to work and get stuff ready and maybe 1-2 hours to drive back from jobs, put equipment away and drive back home.

In my original question, the reason I mentioned BF's frustration with 10 hr days was because he sometimes has to spend extra time fixing or cleaning his coworkers jobs. Working on his own he often gets the work done in under budgeted time.

If you're leaving home at 6 am and returning tired at 6 pm, when do you have time to contribute to a family? It's more of a general question. We don't plan on having kids, and I can entertain myself, but it doesn't seem like a climber has more than 2-3 hours of downtime if they want to get 8 hours of rest.

I usually work around 100hrs a week, so average around 14hr days, 7 days a week. Generally from around 8am to 10-11pm.

I have no family though, just my dog and he comes to work with me.

 

[Zale]

Sounds like your dog could use a rest.

 

[chainsaw_chomper]

The most important class I took in university (have a bachelors in Forestry with a post grad diploma in Forest Engineering) was Accounting for non-commerce students. I've worked in a number of forest companies and engineering consulting firms and most of the technical stuff is done by the new grads. As you become more senior, you start managing projects and working with budgets.

I would suggest he look at some form of business degree/diploma/certificate and parlay that with the technical skills he already has to improve his future. He may not want the desk life now, but one small slip one day can screw up his back/shoulder/knee/hips/neck and he will have to find a non-pysical job.

Thanks, this is helpful to know.

 

[JeffGu]

...but one small slip one day can screw up his back/shoulder/knee/hips/neck...

Yeah. Or worse yet, he could fall and break his ass! Then, he couldn't do the desk job, either. Not with a broken ass.
Man, life is hard.

 

[MSgtBob66]

I'm 49 and a Jr in a mechanical engineering program. I'm also a veteran, so that covers tuition and housing. My stumping business is my retirement, so I have something to do after retirement that gets me outside. If I can learn new things, so can the BF.
He needs to figure out that something soon. A CC is a great place to get a business AS degree so he can manage people and still get outside. Jeff got in when you didn't need a degree, now it is virtually mandatory for management.

 

[chainsaw_chomper]

I usually work around 100hrs a week, so average around 14hr days, 7 days a week. Generally from around 8am to 10-11pm.

I have no family though, just my dog and he comes to work with me.

That life isn't for everyone, but it sounds like you have it figured out. Dogs are the best! Ours is just a puppy but we are getting him to the point of spending the day at work with me.

 

[no tree to big]

What do you do in management? What is a typical day like?

Hah you don't even want to hear what Jeff does! That man leaves the house early to cone off parking lots stays late runs a bikini car wash on Saturdays and play with his tortoise on Sundays

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[HuskyHeadDave]

Yeah....unfortunately moving is difficult for us because of my university job. It's very very stable, but pretty hard to pack up and get a new one. After my postdoc at a UC, I moved to the east coast, but spent 5 years applying for jobs in CA and nothing worked out (and i think I am one of the lucky ones to have a tenure track job at all - a lot of my cohorts gave up). Trust me, if there is someone who is not a sissy about the weather, it's him. I am not sure why they pack up on very rainy days. I know he is fine working in the rain, so I don't know if its the bosses, or the rest of the crew or what. And during winter, work just seems to trickle in, really.

Also, as I clarified above - I don't want him to make more money. The money bothers him and he has said many times he wishes he could earn more - I just want to help him figure out if there is something he can be doing differently. And also, as I said above, I personally think that that salary is not too bad if you live carefully, which we do to a large extent but could be doing better.

You should maybe try to pick up teaching some online classes and boost your income. Get usta the fact that you'll need to make more cash to cover the notes.... Or, buy a truck and s chipper and hire him!!! LMAO. Then you could give him a raise!

 

[rarefish383]

My cousin and I are 4th generation Arborists. Our Dad's both owned their own companies. In 1986 I kind of burned out on the 24-7 running a business. I went 3 years with out a vacation. So, I "retired", and went to work for UPS. I still did, and do, a little side work. The climber that helps me on week ends has been climbing for my cousin for over 30 years. I give him between $500 and $750 a day. He makes a bit more than your BF, I think he told me he makes about $30 an hour. If your BF could hook up with a small company that needs skilled climbers, he could make a couple big pay days a month helping them. If I were still in business, I could never pay my climber that kind of money in a real job, taxes, soc, comp, health. There are other things out there. My Teamster pension pays me more than my climber makes per year. But, most climbers I know are not happy unless they are climbing. Even while I was at UPS I'd hear a saw or chipper and ride around the block to see who it was. It's in the blood, it's hard to change, and I think it gets harder as you get older. He may do better with a reputable small company that pays by merit, instead of pay by scale. If he's good he could hook up with a landscape company that wants to branch out into tree work, and possibly get a cut of the tree work he does, as a bonus. We tend to stay in our comfort zone. To get ahead you have to get out of the comfort zone. If you seem happy at the level you are at, no one is going to jump out and give you more. They are in business to make money, not worry about you making money. It's a hard one, good luck, Joe.

 

[chainsaw_chomper]

You should maybe try to pick up teaching some online classes and boost your income. Get usta the fact that you'll need to make more cash to cover the notes.... Or, buy a truck and s chipper and hire him!!! LMAO. Then you could give him a raise!

I did think of this - him running his own company. First, I am not sure I have enough cash lying around to buy everything that one would need to actually start making money quickly. It;s not just equipment, right? Don't you need insurance? Second, neither of us is a managing type and we'd probably be terrible at running a business. We'd have even less time away from boring busywork than we do now, a direction we don't want to go in.

 

[chainsaw_chomper]

My cousin and I are 4th generation Arborists. Our Dad's both owned their own companies. In 1986 I kind of burned out on the 24-7 running a business. I went 3 years with out a vacation. So, I "retired", and went to work for UPS. I still did, and do, a little side work. The climber that helps me on week ends has been climbing for my cousin for over 30 years. I give him between $500 and $750 a day. He makes a bit more than your BF, I think he told me he makes about $30 an hour. If your BF could hook up with a small company that needs skilled climbers, he could make a couple big pay days a month helping them. If I were still in business, I could never pay my climber that kind of money in a real job, taxes, soc, comp, health. There are other things out there. My Teamster pension pays me more than my climber makes per year. But, most climbers I know are not happy unless they are climbing. Even while I was at UPS I'd hear a saw or chipper and ride around the block to see who it was. It's in the blood, it's hard to change, and I think it gets harder as you get older. He may do better with a reputable small company that pays by merit, instead of pay by scale. If he's good he could hook up with a landscape company that wants to branch out into tree work, and possibly get a cut of the tree work he does, as a bonus. We tend to stay in our comfort zone. To get ahead you have to get out of the comfort zone. If you seem happy at the level you are at, no one is going to jump out and give you more. They are in business to make money, not worry about you making money. It's a hard one, good luck, Joe.

I've started driving out of my way to look too when I hear a chainsaw. I like the idea of trying to find a smaller company that pays by merit....we need to do a very thorough search and lots of calling people.

 

[no tree to big]

Sooo Dude at work has this gf that complains when he has a day off then she complains when he works 5 or 6 days then complains he don't make enough then complains when he goes to make money then takes all his money then complains when he uses a very small amount of said money then complains when the money is gone n complains more when he goes to work.... do I know you?[emoji12]

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[jefflovstrom]

I did think of this - him running his own company. First, I am not sure I have enough cash lying around to buy everything that one would need to actually start making money quickly. It;s not just equipment, right? Don't you need insurance? Second, neither of us is a managing type and we'd probably be terrible at running a business. We'd have even less time away from boring busywork than we do now, a direction we don't want to go in.

You need signed contract's,,
Jeff

 

[jefflovstrom]

What do you do in management? What is a typical day like?

Ha ha,, I can't type that much,,,
Jeff

 

[acer-kid]

Ha ha,, I can't type that much,,,
Jeff

I'll help you out Jeff.
"Little to nothing"
"Not enough to break the Sabbath"
"Fack all"
"Crack whips"
"Bluff"

Choose which best suits.
Have a beautiful day,,,,,,,,,,
,,,,,,,

 

[chainsaw_chomper]

Sooo Dude at work has this gf that complains when he has a day off then she complains when he works 5 or 6 days then complains he don't make enough then complains when he goes to make money then takes all his money then complains when he uses a very small amount of said money then complains when the money is gone n complains more when he goes to work.... do I know you?[emoji12]

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You might.....I nag arborists all over the country.

 

[Marshy]

I think the best piece of advice for your BF is to strike up a conversation with his employer. If the company is a big one then he needs to ask them where the next step is for advancement. They might reward him by getting certified. Just ask him if he has discussed advancement with them, and if not, why not? Maybe the company considers him to already be at the top of the ladder so to speak for climbers. They might tell him they could use him as an estimator which he may or may not need some education for (if he'll spring for it). If he's dead set on being a climber and only a climber then he still needs talk with them and bring to light all of the "extra" effort he gives and what the future holds for him. Tell him, "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always gotten". That's the truth.

 

[acer-kid]

Tell him, "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you've always gotten". That's the truth.

I think that's the best advice you've got so far. I'd run with that. If it doesn't work out, start looking at plan b.

 

[Babaganoosh]

Here is my best piece of advice for you, your boyfriend, and most anyone in life. Yup, there's always a list of reasons not to. The kids, the job, the parents, the school....but in the end it is almost always worth it to make a change in an unhappy life.

 

[bad69bird]

doing tree work for 15 years

So about in mid 30's or older ? I'm 70, have not climbed for over 10 years, less than 1/2 the strength I used to have which makes it more dangerous. After 35 everything physical only gets harder every day as I recall, and strength deteriorates more rapidly after 55 or so. Possibly time for BF to get the education you refer to ?

I recall RBTree is not a spring chicken anymore but still climbs, would be interesting to hear his take on the subject.

From the net, university assoc profs pull down $80K year plus. Hard to understand the difficulty in living expenses. Possibly the BF wanting to make more is simply the income disparity is not good for male ego? I've always made more than my wife for the last 49 years, but am enough of a chauvinist to realize that it would be an ego bruise if she made more, but I'd never mention to her. It did not bother me though that she made more when she was working to help me finish school -- possibly relay that aspect to BF ? But of course we were already married and knew it was a lifelong commitment.

Me and my wife live in Southeastern pa, and probably make make around simalar money to them but with me on the high end and the wife on the low end. Sure you can get by with much less money but if you want to do anything besides just get by I can see where they could have money issues