Typical Homeowner saw

[bcorradi]

There always seems to be a lot of confusion on what a "Homeowner Saw" should consist of.

What differentiates a homeowner from a pro user? Number of hours they put on a year? How many hours or cords of wood per year does a typical homeowner cut?

What are the most important properties a typical homeowner saw should have from a buyer's standpoint?

1) Longevity
2) Durability
3) Good air filtration
4) Low antivibes
5) Ease of maintenance
6) Power to Weight ratio
7) Economically priced
8) Reasonably priced wearable parts
9) Dealer support

What is important from a manufacturers perspective? How are the big saw manufacturers doing developing adequate "homeowner saws"?

 

[cityboy]

There always seems to be a lot of confusion on what a "Homeowner Saw" should consist of.

What differentiates a homeowner from a pro user? Number of hours they put on a year? How many hours or cords of wood per year does a typical homeowner cut?

What are the most important properties a typical homeowner saw should have from a buyer's standpoint?

1) Longevity
2) Durability
3) Good air filtration
4) Low antivibes
5) Ease of maintenance
6) Power to Weight ratio
7) Economically priced
8) Reasonably priced wearable parts
9) Dealer support

What is important from a manufacturers perspective? How are the big saw manufacturers doing developing adequate "homeowner saws"?

I think a homeowner would typically want all those things in a saw, but ya gets what ya pays for, so something has to give. Obviously a pro is going to put far more hours on a saw each year, so to them paying a bit more for something that's built to last longer is a good financial decision. Also, when you're getting paid to cut and the saw stops working, its more of a problem than for the homeowner who's cutting on their own time.

I went with a pro saw even though I'm a homeowner without a lot of wood to cut because with tools I've never regretted buying more capability than I need, one time, and be done with it. A few times I've bought something cheaper, that seemed to be adequate, only to find a few years later I needed more capability and had to go out and buy again. In the end by buying twice I spent more than I would if I'd just bought the better tool the first time.

Of course, now that I've found this site I'll have to buy a few more saws.

 

[sawinredneck]

OK, we seem to be going through this more and more of late. Lets get some things straight and out right now!!

A typical "Homeowner chainsaw" in it's truest sense, MIGHT get used twice a year. It sits in the garage and gets used to clean up after an ice storm. It might cut down a small to medium size tree that has died. It will sit in the garage, with fuel and oil in it. If it starts, great, if not, it gets tossed and a new one is purchased. These are you're Wildthing, Husky 145, craftsman etc. saw owners, It's all they need/ want. They are happy!!

Now we have a typical AS member. They come on here researching what is better than what they have been using. They use the saw more than twice a year. They have worn out the wildthing etc. type saws, they want a better peice of equipment!!! They WANT to take care of it. They WANT something better. They have a NEED for more saw. They typicaly cut more than a cord of wood a year, they like to go and cut down trees.

So comes the dilema. We have someone that has been here and done that, and wants more. Do we reccomend a "true" homeowner saw? Do we reccomend a better quality "homeowner saw" that we ourselves have used? "Sure it got the job done, but I wasn't happy with it, but I think you will love it!!" (with a smile on my face like a slick salesman) Or, like I have been trying to do in "what saws for these Oaks" thread, do like I have been and suggest saws that will realisticly work for their needs?

I will catch a lot for this post, I know, but lets look at what they need/want and find a realistic recomendation for them.
And enough with Sthil/Husky on the newbies!!!! They are confused enough, lets find them a good dealer, then make recomendations on that!! We all know they are both fine saws, enough already!!!

 

[Cut4fun]

Being a homeowner user only. Brand was not important to me. But having magnesium crank case was a must have with me. I was happy with 33cc TH for limbing and 60cc for everything else.

 

[Patriot222]

Lately I've been spending quite a bit of time around saw retailers and to me it seems that the homeowner only has two things in mind. 1)"how big is it?" and "is it a good saw?"

They ask the first question without any specific intensions. "How big is it" could mean, the bar length, the displacement, the weight......use your imagination.

The second question is really general, subjective, and usually is up to the opinion of the store representative. Of course the store clerk at HD for instance says, "that all of the Poulans and Echos are great and that Home Depot stands behind every saw they sell." A rep. at Lowes told a customer that this saw: http://www.norwalkpower.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1498 would do everything that the customer would ever need to do with a chainsaw even though he never asked what the customer would be using it for.

It just seems that joe consumer doesn't have the first clue about what to look for in a chainsaw and relys on the store rep to help them determine what they should be looking for. If a consumer happens to luck out and get a store rep that's knowledgable and caring the customer will probably make out good. If the retailer is your average shmuck then joe consumer is going to end up with another disposible saw. Going to a dealer doesn't necessarily protect you either. Just this past Saturday a local Husky dealer told me that I didn't want a 346 and that I should buy the 350 on his shelf because it had a larger engine. We live in a very corrupt world and IMO the only way that a person is going to get a saw which specifically matches his or her needs is if they research it themselves. In my case it took me about two hours of research to convert from joe consumer to being able to know what to look for.

One thing that I think is desperately needed, if it doesn't already exist, is gas oil premix with stabilizer premixed in. The average person doesn't flush out their tank for storage. They just put the saw away and let it gum up. It wouldn't elimanate every problem, but it would sure be better than storing it without Stabil. A new chainsaw owner could purchase a saw, a gallon of fuel, chain oil, hopefully some PPE and be done with it.

 

[berryman70]

OK, we seem to be going through this more and more of late. Lets get some things straight and out right now!!

A typical "Homeowner chainsaw" in it's truest sense, MIGHT get used twice a year. It sits in the garage and gets used to clean up after an ice storm. It might cut down a small to medium size tree that has died.

I think it's hard to decide what a typical homeowner saw is, what you discribed above most any Lows or HD saw would do. But how "bout the homeowners that do some yard cleanup & a few face cord for the fireplace or a small stove They may need a better/bigger (bigger is always better) saw, but nowhere near a pro saw, just too much money & overkill for what they do.
my 2 or 3 cents

 

[sawinredneck]

Patriot and Berryman both bring up good points.

Patriot: That is why I said "Help them find a GOOD DEALER!! I have also run into idiot dealers. One dealer, a Stihl dealer, could tell me the only difference between an ms390 and an ms440, was the "Ms440 has better springs for the antivibration." You are not alone!! The dealer I went with, and still go to, talked me out of the 440 in favor of the 390. He would have been right under normal circumstances. I unfortunatly am not normal, and the first tree I got into with the 390 came out to be a little over 11 cord!!! Thats a lot of Oak!!! I wish I had my 046 then!!!!
Bu yes, read hear, ask questions here. Then go ask you're dealer, if he answers vary from what Lake, Thall, and the magority (but mainly those two) say, walk away and find another dealer!!!


Berryman: That again is where we need to put predujuces aside, and asses, logicly asking the right questions, what would work best for that person. We also have to look at the perspective that they may end up becoming a jnunkie, much like ourselves, and doing a LOT more with the saw than we/they thought!!! That is why I try and upsell. If you KNOW you need this, and it's the limit, a litle bigger saw will make things easier, faster, and IF you do get into something biger, which I have, you can still get it done!
Granted, this can get out of hand. And it has, but if we all asses things, before making sugestions, I think it will be easier on the newbies.

Now for the newbies:
MOST OF THIS HAS BEEN HASHED OUT AGAIN AND AGAIN, DO A LITTLE SEARCHING, THEN ASK!!!!!

 

[bcorradi]

Being a homeowner user only. Brand was not important to me. But having magnesium crank case was a must have with me. I was happy with 33cc TH for limbing and 60cc for everything else.

Yeah I've seen you state this before. Being a typical homeowner user what does the magnesium crankcase provide for you?

 

[bcorradi]

Patriot and Berryman both bring up good points.

Patriot: That is why I said "Help them find a GOOD DEALER!! I have also run into idiot dealers. One dealer, a Stihl dealer, could tell me the only difference between an ms390 and an ms440, was the "Ms440 has better springs for the antivibration." You are not alone!! The dealer I went with, and still go to, talked me out of the 440 in favor of the 390. He would have been right under normal circumstances. I unfortunatly am not normal, and the first tree I got into with the 390 came out to be a little over 11 cord!!! Thats a lot of Oak!!! I wish I had my 046 then!!!!
Bu yes, read hear, ask questions here. Then go ask you're dealer, if he answers vary from what Lake, Thall, and the magority (but mainly those two) say, walk away and find another dealer!!!


Berryman: That again is where we need to put predujuces aside, and asses, logicly asking the right questions, what would work best for that person. We also have to look at the perspective that they may end up becoming a jnunkie, much like ourselves, and doing a LOT more with the saw than we/they thought!!! That is why I try and upsell. If you KNOW you need this, and it's the limit, a litle bigger saw will make things easier, faster, and IF you do get into something biger, which I have, you can still get it done!
Granted, this can get out of hand. And it has, but if we all asses things, before making sugestions, I think it will be easier on the newbies.

Now for the newbies:
MOST OF THIS HAS BEEN HASHED OUT AGAIN AND AGAIN, DO A LITTLE SEARCHING, THEN ASK!!!!!

Excellent post Andy except for calling us all asses .

 

[berryman70]

Patriot and Berryman both bring up good points.

Berryman: That again is where we need to put predujuces aside, and asses, logicly asking the right questions, what would work best for that person. We also have to look at the perspective that they may end up becoming a jnunkie, much like ourselves, and doing a LOT more with the saw than we/they thought!!! That is why I try and upsell. If you KNOW you need this, and it's the limit, a litle bigger saw will make things easier, faster, and IF you do get into something biger, which I have, you can still get it done!
Granted, this can get out of hand. And it has, but if we all asses things, before making sugestions, I think it will be easier on the newbies.

Now for the newbies:
MOST OF THIS HAS BEEN HASHED OUT AGAIN AND AGAIN, DO A LITTLE SEARCHING, THEN ASK!!!!!

After I posted I thought about it a little, folks that take the time to do the research & end up here (AS) aren't typical homeowners, they're looking for something better & good advice, which they get here, if these same people bought a craftsman they wouldn't be happy - that's why they're here, so guys keep up the good recommendations

 

[sawinredneck]

Excellent post Andy except for calling us all asses .

Friggin typoes!!!

 

[COLD_IRON]

Well I can post based on my recent experiences and what led my father and myself to each order a MS 361.

I first identified what I wanted out of the saw:

I wanted a saw that will last 20 years, that I can drop in the woods and not damage it seriously, that can bounce around in a truck bed and not crack. I wanted enough power to get small to medium trees (no more than 24'' at the MOST) and downed trees cut up yet light enough that I can easily carry it through rough terrain.

Now finding a recommended saw:

A Rental Dealer friend of mine suggested Stihl. He said they just seem to last longer than any of the other brands that he has rented out to customers. That said a lot to me. This led me to a Manufacturer.

Then I went to the local Stihl dealer and looked at all the saws and held each one to see if I liked carrying around the weight. The 290/310/390 saws felt a touch heavy, especially with a 24'' bar. The 440/441/460 definitely felt too heavy and were a little more than I wanted to spend.

That left the 260/361. I loved the weight of the 260, but it was almost identical in power to the Jonsereds 49SP I have been using and wanting to replace. That left the 361 - more power and only $100 more. Lightweight, powerful, and versatile. It sold itself. All in all, I spent about 2 months or better doing this research, so I didn't take it lightly.

Now am I a professional user? No. But I do use a saw for work sometimes clearing out trees that are starting to block views on waterfront lots, and for clearing trails to property corners etc etc. And when I pay that kind of money for something, I expect it to work very well, not fall apart after a few months or years worth of use.

So in the end, you get what you pay for - Homeowner or Pro. I went with Pro because I don't like to buy something that will end up in a landfill or a scrap pile in 5 years. And for anyone looking for a saw, I highly suggest doing your homework because you definitely don't want to spend money on something that is either too little or too much for your needs - or worse yet - a total piece of junk.

 

[cityboy]

After I posted I thought about it a little, folks that take the time to do the research & end up here (AS) aren't typical homeowners, they're looking for something better & good advice, which they get here, if these same people bought a craftsman they wouldn't be happy - that's why they're here, so guys keep up the good recommendations

Exactly. We're trying to avoid buying something that we won't be happy with, and we're looking for some advice from actual chainsaw users to weigh against any bad advice we'll get from a know-nothing or mis-informed salesperson.

Due to the mass merchandising retail transition that's occurred in the last 20-30 years finding a store in my area where the employees know anything about what they sell is nearly impossible. In smaller towns that might not be the case, but here in SoCal I think the average retail employee lasts about 3-6 months.

And from my own local experience, and stories here, it sounds like there's a fair number of privately owned saw shops that don't pass out the best advice either.

So I came here to find out what people thought of Echo, Husky, Stihl, etc. from personal experience, and I'm glad I did. And I got a good laugh when over a couple beers at a party I mentioned to a few guys that I'd just bought a chainsaw and one of them replied "so did I, I got a Poulan, cause they're the best".

 

[COLD_IRON]

I mentioned to a few guys that I'd just bought a chainsaw and one of them replied "so did I, I got a Poulan, cause they're the best".

And to think I was almost gonna take a sip of brew when I read that...

 

[lazermule]

I have a Poulan Wildthing. I have had it for about 10 years and it has been a great saw. I cut 3-5 full cords of oak per year and it has never let me down. I previously used my dad's 036(??I think) Stihl, before I got the Wildthing. I know Stihl is a good saw but his must be a lemon as it seemed as though it would cost me $50 every time I would use it. The clutch gernaded once, the muffler fell off, the fuel cap cracked and other things. Now he uses my saw and his Stihl hasn't been run in 10 years. I since have acquired a Husky 61 Rancher, but I find the Wildthing more comfortable and lighter to handle. The Wildthing has seem quite a bit of use over the years, but I have only put oil, gas and one spark plug in it. My brother did break the handle on it once (dropped a log on it) and it was extremely easy to get parts for and they were cheap (handle was like $6). I think I paid like $125 with a case and I think it was a great value.

Lazer

 

[superfire]

you get what you pay fer

the more you spend the better the saw
i say start lookin in the $350.00-$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
The More You Spend Now less Youz Pay Later:greenchainsaw:
Just my beer monies worth
cheers mates

 

[SinglerM]

Rules for buying.

Rule#1. Always get a saw that looks cool.

Rule#2. Always determine how much you want to spend.

Rule#3. Always keep in mind what length of bar you want.

Rule#4. Always buy a powerhead to match the bar length in Rule#3. (example: 50cc powerhead= 14"-18"bar. 70cc powerhead= 20"-28", give or take. 90cc= 28" and up. These bar lengths vary by region....search further.

Rule#5. After evaluating the size determined from Rule#4...increase the amount of money to spend determined from your Rule#2 assessment.

Rule#6. Always remember Rule#1.

 

[Roteiche]

Hi,

I think, sawinredneck ist right, if he say, lets find a good dealer. He and his service is much more important than the name of the brand. And this not only for the homeowner. Every prof look for this, when he buy a stihl or a husky or a dolmar or a solo.

Roteiche

Husqvarna 238 SE
Solo 651
Stihl FS 420

 

[joatmon]

Patriot and Berryman both bring up good points.

Patriot: That is why I said "Help them find a GOOD DEALER!! I have also run into idiot dealers. One dealer, a Stihl dealer, could tell me the only difference between an ms390 and an ms440, was the "Ms440 has better springs for the antivibration." You are not alone!! The dealer I went with, and still go to, talked me out of the 440 in favor of the 390. He would have been right under normal circumstances. I unfortunatly am not normal, and the first tree I got into with the 390 came out to be a little over 11 cord!!! Thats a lot of Oak!!! I wish I had my 046 then!!!!
Bu yes, read hear, ask questions here. Then go ask you're dealer, if he answers vary from what Lake, Thall, and the magority (but mainly those two) say, walk away and find another dealer!!!


Berryman: That again is where we need to put predujuces aside, and asses, logicly asking the right questions, what would work best for that person. We also have to look at the perspective that they may end up becoming a jnunkie, much like ourselves, and doing a LOT more with the saw than we/they thought!!! That is why I try and upsell. If you KNOW you need this, and it's the limit, a litle bigger saw will make things easier, faster, and IF you do get into something biger, which I have, you can still get it done!
Granted, this can get out of hand. And it has, but if we all asses things, before making sugestions, I think it will be easier on the newbies.

Now for the newbies:
MOST OF THIS HAS BEEN HASHED OUT AGAIN AND AGAIN, DO A LITTLE SEARCHING, THEN ASK!!!!!

Andrew,

Your genius shines through again! Is there and Echo in here?

In 1994, I had a smaller Stihl and decided I needed a bigger saw. Several of us were cutting firewood and distributing it to low-income families. My buddy had an 026, so I went down to my Stihl dealer on a Friday afternoon and bought an 026. I put it in the truck, waiting for the Saturday morning cutting. Well, Friday night, I out foxed myself. I decided that if my buddy had an 026, why don't I get a saw one size bigger? Yeah, that's the ticket. I was there on Saturday morning when the Stihl dealer opened and told him I wanted the next size larger saw. I laid $125 and my 026 on the counter and got a ........ 029. True story. The least he could have done is offered me a cigarette when he'd finished with me.

I always figured that when you went to a Stihl dealership, that they would take care of you. Oh, that dealer is now out of business, but I can't say that the others I've used are any better. You live and learn. I've drunk the Stihl Kool-Aid and it made me sick.

Joat

 

[Al Smith]

Of course you get what you pay buuut,why in the world would anybody lay out say 850 bucks for a saw just to cut a few loads of firewood? It most likely is the same reason they pony up 30 grand for a fancy pick-em -up that they won't haul anything in,a cowboy limosine.

Some of these lower priced saws work just fine for occasional usage.The reason most of the complaints come about is due to the fact they sit for 51 weeks out of the year full of funky gas and they don't start.They end up at garage sales for 20 bucks.

During the big ice storm a few years back,a local Stihl dealer sold about 3 semi loads of saws.The majority was 200 T's.They should hit the garage sales in a year or 2, I'll be ready.