I run 050 3/8 LP on my all plastic homelite, I use a standard 3/8 drive sprocket on a hardnose 20", seems to work pretty well. Am thinking of getting a couple of loops to run on the 441 , now I gotta get me a bar.
3/8 lp vs. 3/8
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nmurph
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Well, I reckon I have milled about 15 (small) logs with the plastic homelite 340 over a period of about 2 years with that combo and the drive sprocket's got about the amount of wear I'd expect for that much cutting. One difference is that the Homelite does have a spur and not a rim sprocket although I can see that would make any difference, or maybe it does?
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deezlfan
Meadow River Lumber Co. 6
Well fair enough, a picture is worth a thousand words. But riddle me this gentleman........
This is a 16" Tilton SuperBar that has seen service on my Homelite 240 since about 1987 [1]. Always ran the original size 3/8" chain [2]. A couple of years ago I needed a new spur and the only one in stock at my local chainsaw guy was for LP. Swapped the spur and installed a loop of LP chain and haven't looked back [3].
And just so you can't say I am using photographic trickery, here's the two chains side by side.
And to counter the previous supposition, the bar nose and sprocket are not 'worn to crap'.
They are in excellant shape for the age and usage this saw has received.
This is a 16" Tilton SuperBar that has seen service on my Homelite 240 since about 1987 [1]. Always ran the original size 3/8" chain [2]. A couple of years ago I needed a new spur and the only one in stock at my local chainsaw guy was for LP. Swapped the spur and installed a loop of LP chain and haven't looked back [3].
And just so you can't say I am using photographic trickery, here's the two chains side by side.
And to counter the previous supposition, the bar nose and sprocket are not 'worn to crap'.
They are in excellant shape for the age and usage this saw has received.
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deezlfan
Meadow River Lumber Co. 6
Additional point. If you look closely at the fourth photo you will see the top chain's links are marked 91 which is Oregon 3/8" LP chain and the lower is marked 72 which is their regular 3/8".
so measure the distance between 3 rivets and divide by 2 on both chains
whatdaya get .325, .365, .375, .404?
whatdaya get .325, .365, .375, .404?
Good Post DZL!
On the drive sprocket side I agree, at the other end I cannot say because I use a hardnose.
As an aside, you must be cutting soft wood because the length of some of the 3/8 cutters would snap off in some of the wood I cut. Also it looks like you have an alternating filing issue with the outside cutter being longer than the inner cutters, or is it a photographic thang?
deezlfan
Meadow River Lumber Co. 6
BobL,
Both those chains were in my junk pile, grabbed out for photographic purposes only. The original 3/8" chains from my 240 moved on to other saws when I changed it to LoPro. I wanted to illustrate that at least a few bars will accept both types of chain without issues. Obviously there would be geometry conflicts when the depth of the bar and diameter of the sprocket changes. As the earlier photos clearly illustrate, in most cases they are not interchangable. But because this bar did accept them both, it cause me to wonder until I learned the differences.
You are correct there are issues with the sharpening techniques employed on that particular chain. In fact a chain just like that starred in one of my threads a couple of weeks ago regarding how far you could/should use a chain. The general consensis was use it until the teeth come off, then use it some more. I personally wouldn't risk it. You should see some of the chains that come through the door of my shop since I started buying saws for parts! I can't take credit for the maintainance of either of those chains.
Both those chains were in my junk pile, grabbed out for photographic purposes only. The original 3/8" chains from my 240 moved on to other saws when I changed it to LoPro. I wanted to illustrate that at least a few bars will accept both types of chain without issues. Obviously there would be geometry conflicts when the depth of the bar and diameter of the sprocket changes. As the earlier photos clearly illustrate, in most cases they are not interchangable. But because this bar did accept them both, it cause me to wonder until I learned the differences.
You are correct there are issues with the sharpening techniques employed on that particular chain. In fact a chain just like that starred in one of my threads a couple of weeks ago regarding how far you could/should use a chain. The general consensis was use it until the teeth come off, then use it some more. I personally wouldn't risk it. You should see some of the chains that come through the door of my shop since I started buying saws for parts! I can't take credit for the maintainance of either of those chains.
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MCW
Somebody's talking crap here & it ain't the tree!
The rounded off teeth on the sprocket nose looks like that bar was originally meant for 3/8"LP anyway? Maybe bars have changed since the '80s
You most certainly can't put 3/8"LP chain on any of the sprocket nose bars I have in stock that are meant for standard 3/8".
deezlfan
Meadow River Lumber Co. 6
That may be the case but this bar is not marked for any particular chain size. I purchased it a pro shop after a buddy dropped a tree on the original Homelite laminated bar not long after I got the saw. I shutter to think that the saw shop sold me the wrong bar all those years ago. But with almost 20 seasons, I never had an issue with the chains jumping off or damage to either the bar or chain.
MCW
Somebody's talking crap here & it ain't the tree!
It does look like your chains fit that bar pretty well though regardless.
deezlfan
Meadow River Lumber Co. 6
I guess the next question would be: WHY couldn't they have made 3/8LP so that the drive links and and pitch were the same? Seems like it would have been easier all around. Perhaps it would space the raker too far from the tooth?
I think the pitch is in fact the same and is really .365, they just call it 3/8" or .375 for convenience.
The drive links are different, and the LP chain is narrower to remove less material making it easier for an underpowered saw to cut, like a thin kerf blade for your table saw or portable circular saw. The LP chain is also quite a bit lighter, thinner material that is not as strong since it won't be exposed to high HP.
Mark
The drive links are different, and the LP chain is narrower to remove less material making it easier for an underpowered saw to cut, like a thin kerf blade for your table saw or portable circular saw. The LP chain is also quite a bit lighter, thinner material that is not as strong since it won't be exposed to high HP.
Mark
nmurph
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thank you Mark for that confirmation.
Another question about LP vs standard chains for a EZ chainsaw.
I see the difference in the pictures of the roller tip bars for the LP and standard, the LP bars have the round teeth.
I think my Homelite 16 inch OEM bars are for the standard chains. (I'll take a look to confirm)
I have couple of EZ's that have the solid bar, non roller tip bar, one has a 3/8 toothed sprocket and one has a rim sprocket.
Can a LP chain be used on the solid type bar with the standard sprocket without damaging the sprockets?
AND
It appears that the link is not as deep on the LP chain. Will a standard bar have any problems with the LP links not cleaning the bottom of the groove ??? (oily fine dust building up in the bottom of the standard bar groove and possibly clogging the oiler hole also when using the lower Height LP chain?)
Got my questions answered. Just did not do enough reading.
I see the difference in the pictures of the roller tip bars for the LP and standard, the LP bars have the round teeth.
I think my Homelite 16 inch OEM bars are for the standard chains. (I'll take a look to confirm)
I have couple of EZ's that have the solid bar, non roller tip bar, one has a 3/8 toothed sprocket and one has a rim sprocket.
Can a LP chain be used on the solid type bar with the standard sprocket without damaging the sprockets?
AND
It appears that the link is not as deep on the LP chain. Will a standard bar have any problems with the LP links not cleaning the bottom of the groove ??? (oily fine dust building up in the bottom of the standard bar groove and possibly clogging the oiler hole also when using the lower Height LP chain?)
Got my questions answered. Just did not do enough reading.
I too used to claim you could use lp chain on regular 3/8 sprocket & bar & it does work sorta, but the sprockets are not the same & will run rough & wear fast.
I took an 026 Stihl on trade, it had a new full size 3/8 bar & chain on it but the chain ran very rough. I messed around with this for quite a while, the bar was plainly marked 3/8, the chain was obviously full size 3/8, the sprocket rim said 3/8p,
the (p) is the clue here, it is Stihl"s mark for picco their name for lo pro chain.
I went up to the saw shop and asked to see a standard 3/8 rim for that saw, there is a very small difference in cercumference, but the big difference is in the dividers between the drive links, they are much thicker in the lo pro rim.
I took an 026 Stihl on trade, it had a new full size 3/8 bar & chain on it but the chain ran very rough. I messed around with this for quite a while, the bar was plainly marked 3/8, the chain was obviously full size 3/8, the sprocket rim said 3/8p,
the (p) is the clue here, it is Stihl"s mark for picco their name for lo pro chain.
I went up to the saw shop and asked to see a standard 3/8 rim for that saw, there is a very small difference in cercumference, but the big difference is in the dividers between the drive links, they are much thicker in the lo pro rim.
I just went through this myself a couple of months ago, tried to match l.p. vs regular 3/8 chains on the different type of rim sprockets. Didn't work.
The base of the chain is farther away from the pins on the regular 3/8, meaning that when the chain is bent around an arc, the base describes a smaller circle than it would with a chain that has pins closer to the base, I.E. low profile. This is why the larger diameter .404 sprocket is actually a closer fit on the LP chain.
The local Stihl dealer confirms it, he sells different sprockets for 3/8 and l.p. 3/8, you put the two side by side and there is a noticeable difference .
Stick with the 3/8 l.p. bar/sprocket, and use the Stihl PS chain. Big difference in cutting speed. This little Husky 32 pulls it, your saw should as well.
The base of the chain is farther away from the pins on the regular 3/8, meaning that when the chain is bent around an arc, the base describes a smaller circle than it would with a chain that has pins closer to the base, I.E. low profile. This is why the larger diameter .404 sprocket is actually a closer fit on the LP chain.
The local Stihl dealer confirms it, he sells different sprockets for 3/8 and l.p. 3/8, you put the two side by side and there is a noticeable difference .
Stick with the 3/8 l.p. bar/sprocket, and use the Stihl PS chain. Big difference in cutting speed. This little Husky 32 pulls it, your saw should as well.
Little Al
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It performs OK ( It's a saw I look after for a friend of a friend ) but I would not consider having to spend for Sprocket Chain & Bar as it's a non replaceable tip as against a new 3/8LP chain as to me the tiny gain ('if there was one) is not worth the extra expense. He took it in to a dealer for a chain to be told it needed the full set up replacing& he got it back 325 equipped didn't realize till he went to sharpen his chain & his husky roller guide woudn't fit
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