Another cord thread...MN legal definition...arrgh

[Steve NW WI]

I was looking for a "thrown cord" volume on MN's Dept of commerce web site for another thread, and I got to reading the fine print. It turns out that those oddball Swedes, Irishmen, Finns and Germans over in MN have decided that 120 cu ft of split and stacked wood is a cord.

From this page: http://mn.gov/commerce/weights-and-measures/images/BuyingFirewood.pdf

Here's the quote, reference to MN statute given at the end:

What is a cord?

A cord has a specific legal definition in Minnesota:

• One cord is 128 cubic feet in four foot lengths.

• If the wood is sawed, a cord is 110 cubic feet when
ranked, or 160 cubic feet when thrown loosely into a
truck.

• If the wood is sawed and split, a cord is 120 cubic feet
when ranked, and 175 cubic feet when thrown loosely
into a truck. (Minnesota Statutes, Section 239.33)

So, by their definition, 128 ft³ (btw, hold down the ALT key and type 0179 on your number pad to get the ³ symbol, something else I learned today) of 4' logs, when cut and stacked will shrink to 110 ft³, then grow to 120 ft³ when split and restacked. Loose rounds are 160ft³, and loose splits are 175ft³ to make a cord.

WTF? If government can't even have a standard "standard", I'm giving up on straightening out wayward measurers. WI by the way, beleives in 128 ft³, "well ranked and stowed" - WI Statutes 98.02(2) Link here: Wisconsin Legislature: 98.02(2)

 

[HEAVY FUEL]

Steve, all you have to do is fall the tree, haul it home, then throw in wood stove as needed. Your making this alot more difficult than you need to!!!

 

[turnkey4099]

I was looking for a "thrown cord" volume on MN's Dept of commerce web site for another thread, and I got to reading the fine print. It turns out that those oddball Swedes, Irishmen, Finns and Germans over in MN have decided that 120 cu ft of split and stacked wood is a cord.

From this page: http://mn.gov/commerce/weights-and-measures/images/BuyingFirewood.pdf

Here's the quote, reference to MN statute given at the end:

What is a cord?

A cord has a specific legal definition in Minnesota:

• One cord is 128 cubic feet in four foot lengths.

• If the wood is sawed, a cord is 110 cubic feet when
ranked, or 160 cubic feet when thrown loosely into a
truck.

• If the wood is sawed and split, a cord is 120 cubic feet
when ranked, and 175 cubic feet when thrown loosely
into a truck. (Minnesota Statutes, Section 239.33)

<snip>

WTF!! is right. They even have the adjustments from whole to cut/split/stacked bassackwards. The amount of _actual_ wood in a given size pile _shrinks_ with each step in processing. Thus they should be _adding_ cu ft over the "4' lenght cord" for cut and and again for cut/split if they want to make addustments. In reality they shouldn't be screwing with an industry standard at all.

Harry K

 

[CrappieKeith]

...but Steve I know you used to tell all of the girls 10" was a foot...LOL
:msp_scared:

 

[Garmins dad]

...but Steve I know you used to tell all of the girls 10" was a foot...LOL
:msp_scared:

:hmm3grin2orange::hmm3grin2orange:

 

[Whitespider]

Well hey... you're gonna' lose some wood to the saw kerf..... right? :hmm3grin2orange:

 

[Fifelaker]

My wood ain't too big around but it sure is short.:msp_scared:

 

[les-or-more]

WTF!! is right. They even have the adjustments from whole to cut/split/stacked bassackwards. The amount of _actual_ wood in a given size pile _shrinks_ with each step in processing. Thus they should be _adding_ cu ft over the "4' lenght cord" for cut and and again for cut/split if they want to make addustments. In reality they shouldn't be screwing with an industry standard at all.

Harry K

Well look at that the "industry standard" isn't standard either. The ton is looking better all the time now isn't it?

 

[Hedgerow]

Well look at that the "industry standard" isn't standard either. The ton is looking better all the time now isn't it?

I wish!!! That truckload of Hedge just went up in price baby!!!

 

[les-or-more]

I wish!!! That truckload of Hedge just went up in price baby!!!

It would make far more sense if wood was sold like other commodities are then all that needs to be done is determine what % of moisture is allowed to be classified as seasoned wood.

 

[Steve NW WI]

Well look at that the "industry standard" isn't standard either. The ton is looking better all the time now isn't it?

That'd work...IF the standard was tons on a dry matter basis. Gotta take moisture outta the equation. You'd need a certifiable method of measuring moisture content then.

It's industry standard in grain selling, so its workable. Bushels of grain are actually sold by weigt not volume.

 

[les-or-more]

That'd work...IF the standard was tons on a dry matter basis. Gotta take moisture outta the equation. You'd need a certifiable method of measuring moisture content then.

It's industry standard in grain selling, so its workable. Bushels of grain are actually sold by weigt not volume.

It would get rid of the difference in BTU's between species of tree, and end all the silly arguing over length of cut and what people call it.

 

[dancan]

One of our larger firewood sellers process and load (loosely) baskets that measure out at 168 cu ft .
They guaranty a cord (128cu ft) when you stack it .
I've never heard or read a complaint about them .

 

[Hedgerow]

That'd work...IF the standard was tons on a dry matter basis. Gotta take moisture outta the equation. You'd need a certifiable method of measuring moisture content then.

It's industry standard in grain selling, so its workable. Bushels of grain are actually sold by weigt not volume.

You're right... Then all firewood would be equal on a dollar per btu unit, no matter what the variety...

 

[chucker]

wood being sold by the btu like natural gas/propane by the cubic foot/gallon?? now this is something to thunk about.....

 

[Circle B MN]

When buying, I do believe 175 cu ft comes out right for both parties involved. As for the MN rules, I think the author of that had recently returned from a Sunday run across the river when he wrote it...

 

[turnkey4099]

wood being sold by the btu like natural gas/propane by the cubic foot/gallon?? now this is something to thunk about.....

??? Nope, in your example one is being sold by volumn (gas/propane) the other by btu (wood).

What it comes down to is cord is a defined volumn amount. What is in that volume has to be specified by the producer. Same as a galloon of paint says nothing about the quality or a 'bushel" says nothing about what kind of grain or quality thereof is in it.

E.g. I have a cord of seasoned oak here at $x. That pile over there is pine priced as $y per cord.

Les or more seems to be trying to troll again.

Harry K

 

[turnkey4099]

When buying, I do believe 175 cu ft comes out right for both parties involved. As for the MN rules, I think the author of that had recently returned from a Sunday run across the river when he wrote it...

That was my first impression when I read it.

Harry K

 

[turnkey4099]

That'd work...IF the standard was tons on a dry matter basis. Gotta take moisture outta the equation. You'd need a certifiable method of measuring moisture content then.

It's industry standard in grain selling, so its workable. Bushels of grain are actually sold by weigt not volume.

This old farm boy learned something. I thought you were full of it but your are correct. Seems thing changed some since I was back on the farm in the mid 50s.

Harry K

 

[TreePointer]

I wonder what happened to make the definition ridiculous. Sometimes govt. officials make compliance so difficult so as to squeeze out the little guy or reduce an undesirable industry. Or maybe some state representative's MIL complained after she thought she was shorted on firewood delivery.

Absurd.